Question about Israeli military and religious Zionists

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Question about Israel's military, to people knowledgeable about same:

Do hardcore religious Zionists have a significant presence in Israeli's military, especially in the upper ranks?

I've heard that many male Orthodox Jews have managed to avoid military service altogether, via a law that exempts rabbis and yeshiva students from military service. Is that true? If so, that would likely limit the number of religious Zionist fanatics in Israel's military.

But, on the other hand, I am wondering how many of the religious Zionist fanatics might be making a point of attending whatever the Israeli equivalent of West Point might be. If so, that might give them a disproportionate influence over Israel's military policies.

You would have to ask your question of someone who has that data, which is likely classified as a military secret.

Exact data and personal identies might be secret, but, at least here in the U.S.A., retired officers are free to talk about at least some aspects of their experiences. And West Point does publish various statistics about its graduating classes. I don't know whether Israel's nearest equivalent school, whatever that is, does the same.

To my understanding, religious Zionists as a group aren't fanatics. Some fanatics might self-identify as religious Zionist. The concept arose because Zionism began as a secular movement, so initially some religious Jews were cool to it. There is a community in Israel that rejects Zionism for doctrinal reasons, but they are quite small and it's my impression that most Israelis think them a joke, although tour guides there like to take their clients to visit the neighborhood in Jerusalem where most of those people live (they try to live as their ancestors did in the ghetto which makes them a prime tourist attraction whether that pleases them or not).

I would imagine the vast majority of Jews in both Israel and the diaspora who identify as religious are also Zionists. Some might be fanatics of different sorts, but I don't think there's a statistically meaningful correlation between religious Zionism and fanaticism of any sort.

Perhaps I should clarify what I mean by a religious Zionist fanatic. I mean the kind of person who, if a stray Hamas rocket were to accidentally hit one of the mosques on the Temple Mount, would take that as a sign from God that it's time to tear down both those mosques and start building the Third Temple.

See, for example:

- Holy cow! Can one heifer herald the Third Temple — and the end of the world as we know it?: "A red heifer calf has been born in Israel, to the delight of controversial Third Temple advocacy groups," by Mira Fox, Forward, September 8, 2023.
- 'Almost everything is ready for the Third Temple,' claims Israeli TV report about red heifers brought to Israel last year: "Arrival of five red heifers continues to cause excitement and consternation in the Jewish state," All Israel, August 8, 2023.
- From Texas to Israel: Red heifers needed for Temple arrive: "A Christian farmer in Texas raised the prized heifers which are essential for priests to serve in the Temple," Jerusalem Post, September 20, 2022.
- Wikipedia article on the Temple Institute.

Some background, from 25 years ago:

- Forcing the End by Lawrence Wright, The New Yorker, July 12, 1998. Another copy here, on the PBS site.
- Apocalypse Cow, New York Times, March 30, 1997.

People like this were a tiny minority in Israel in 1998. I suspect that they've grown quite a bit since then, though hopefully still a small minority.

Last edited by Mona Pereth on 28 Oct 2023, 4:13 pm, edited 3 times in total.

Those people aren't Jewish though and I wouldn't consider them Zionists, they just have weird ideas about Jews and the second coming.

I am sure that Jewish Zionist fanatics (both religious and the secular) are well represented in the Israeli army. As well most every other creed that exists in Israeli society because their military pretty much IS their whole society.

There are some splinter Orthodox Jews who oppose Zionism who dont serve. Then there are Arab Druze (a heretical offshoot of Islam) who eagerly join the Israeli army. So you get a lot of the unexpected as well.

I think there are some religious men who are able to get exempted from service to study scripture etc. full-time. I would have to research that to know for sure. They aren't necessarily anti-Zionist though. I believe secular Israelis generally resent those people though. I would suppose the religious parties insist on having that exemption. The religious parties are small but nobody has ever been able to form a government without including them in the coalition. One thing I do recall those people have done is put a chain across the neighborhoods they control and people have died riding a motorcycle through there and not seeing the chain. This has made some people very angry.

The Temple Institute is indeed Jewish, although they get support and assistance from evangelical Christian fanatics (including a Texas cattle rancher who is supplying the "red heifers") as well as from Jewish fanatics.

For details, read the articles I linked to.

Yes, I'm aware that Israel has (almost) universal military service. My question was more specifically about military officers, especially high-ranking ones.

Yeah those people exist but I don't think they have any influence over the Israeli military (which seemed to be the point of this thread). I suspect most Israelis think they're wacko.

BTW I believe I read that some Israeli military had gone to Ukraine to fight there, because they feel they are better appreciated by Zelenskyy than by Netanyahu. You may recall that I said, when this whole thing started, that I blame the whole thing on Netanyahu because the military/intelligence establishment became weaker under his leadership, because Netanyahu has caused the Israeli people to no longer respect their government, and the military IS the Israeli people. If things had been functioning as they should have, the Hamas incursion would have been a pathetic failure. Netanyahu has Jewish blood on his hands and he couldn't care less.

I stumbled upon a video of Arab reporter lady interviewing an anti zionist rabbi.

The rabbi pulled out a binder with photographs and pointed to a picture of the founding "fathers" all shaking each others hands while celebration the official declaration of Israel as an independent nation in 1948. The rabbis said "Look! Not ONE of them has his head covered". Meaning that none of them wore yarmulkas in adherence to Jewish custom of men keeping their heads covered. So yes...probably the ruling elite in Israel (both govt and military) maybe fanatic and maybe Zionist...but its secular and not religious.

Though the Orthodox are gaining in power and in numbers.

My boyfriend (whose mother lives in Jerusalem) tells me that it is highly unlikely that there are very many religious Jews, fanatical or otherwise, in the upper ranks of the Israeli military.

His evidence: Israel just launched a major military operation on Shabbos. An observant Jew would not do that if they had any choice in the matter.

What and where is "Shabbos". And why would it be sacred?

Saturday i.e. The Sabbath.

THE HAREDI EXEMPTION