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techstepgenr8tion
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21 Sep 2008, 3:50 pm

http://www.ffiec.gov/cra/

This is an act that people have been talking about a lot lately regarding our current mortgage crisis. This (lax lending policies by mandate), compounded with the low interest rates, and the housing valuation bubble, all contributed in their own way to our subprime crisis. The subprime of course was the first dominoe which then hit Fannie and Freddie, and as well it hit Lehman, AIG, and has of course given anyone else a scare who is dabbling in mortgage equities (ie. Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs).



DevilInPgh
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21 Sep 2008, 5:01 pm

Whoa, whoa, whoa. I'd sure like to know where those low interest rates were when my parents bought their first house in 1983. It was a $30k new Levitt house (yeah, they don't exist anymore at those prices) at THIRTEEN percent interest. Subprime? Yeah, more like usury.



monty
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22 Sep 2008, 10:03 am

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
http://www.ffiec.gov/cra/

This is an act that people have been talking about a lot lately regarding our current mortgage crisis. This (lax lending policies by mandate), compounded with the low interest rates, and the housing valuation bubble, all contributed in their own way to our subprime crisis. The subprime of course was the first dominoe which then hit Fannie and Freddie, and as well it hit Lehman, AIG, and has of course given anyone else a scare who is dabbling in mortgage equities (ie. Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs).


Sorry to disagree, but there was no mandate for the foolishness that caused this mess. Government at various times has tried to reduce unfairness that banks traditionally had towards minority or low income borrowers, but that doesn't come anywhere close to explaining the loans that were given out in the past 6 years. I surround myself with non-low income, non-minority people, and I know quite a few that were encouraged to inflate (ie, lie about) their income, or who got loans where the income was not even checked. My friends were offered huge loans on the assumption that rising home prices would always rise, and that real estate was always a solid investment. It should be obvious that banks were handing out loans like the neighbors hand out candy on Halloween.



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When I entered this business back in the prehistoric 1970s, commercial bankers followed the 3-6-3 rule: they paid 3% for deposits, lent them out at 6% and were on the golf course by 3 in the afternoon.

Banks were boring, but they were safe. You didn't have to worry about your money because they made loans only to those who were creditworthy and kept them on their books, so that if a loan did go sour, it would have a direct effect on the bank that made it.

This was an outgrowth of the freewheeling 1920s and the crash of 1929. It led to the Glass-Steagall Act, which separated commercial from investment banking.

Investment banks were only loosely supervised by the Securities and Exchange Commission. They could, and did, take big risks.
They magnified their profits -- and their losses --- by borrowing lots of money from the financial markets.

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/b ... aspx?guid={2E98DC49-EA62-4E89-AB3B-3138273C3A65}



Quote:
The credit crisis shaking the global economy is forcing a dramatic reconfiguration of Wall Street, where the financial industry in recent years has been driven to take ever-greater risks on increasingly esoteric investments.

...

Nor were government regulators fully aware of the gathering storm. They were hobbled by balkanized oversight and gaps in disclosure rules. "The problem is transparency because regulators weren't able to assess risks at investment banks in the way they are able to with commercial banks," said Mark Gertler, an economics professor at New York University.

...

In recent decades U.S. banks, facing competition from foreign counterparts that had no restrictions barring them from owning brokerages, found loopholes in the law to open or acquire new business lines. In 1999, Congress conceded to the new reality, repealing the 1933 law with the passage of the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act.

Commercial banks moved increasingly into the traditional domain of investment houses, in some cases acquiring them outright, such as the marquee purchase of Chase Manhattan Bank by J.P. Morgan in 2000. As investment banks faced heightened competition in their traditional business lines, these enterprises leveraged up with borrowed money and went looking for profits, betting on ever-riskier securities and derivatives. That is the trend the crisis of 2008 may reverse, at least for a time.

http://www.sltrib.com/News/ci_10523793



ToadOfSteel
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22 Sep 2008, 12:11 pm

monty wrote:
I surround myself with non-low income, non-minority people, and I know quite a few that were encouraged to inflate (ie, lie about) their income, or who got loans where the income was not even checked. My friends were offered huge loans on the assumption that rising home prices would always rise, and that real estate was always a solid investment. It should be obvious that banks were handing out loans like the neighbors hand out candy on Halloween.


The overlying issue is that people want to appear richer than they really are...

It's all about the bloody appearances again... nothing about actual substance.

Hence, the McMansion



monty
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22 Sep 2008, 12:20 pm

ToadOfSteel wrote:
monty wrote:
I surround myself with non-low income, non-minority people, and I know quite a few that were encouraged to inflate (ie, lie about) their income, or who got loans where the income was not even checked. My friends were offered huge loans on the assumption that rising home prices would always rise, and that real estate was always a solid investment. It should be obvious that banks were handing out loans like the neighbors hand out candy on Halloween.


The overlying issue is that people want to appear richer than they really are...

It's all about the bloody appearances again... nothing about actual substance.

Hence, the McMansion


Well, that human tendency does exist .... but my point was rather different. The people I am talking about didn't splurge on McMansions in spite of the fact that the banks wanted them to. The banks were throwing money at anyone willing to sign their name because they made immediate profit, and then the banks sold the dubious loans to some schmuck who didn't know what they were buying.



DevilInPgh
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23 Sep 2008, 4:14 pm

For some reason, the word "McMansion" made me think of this:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeoDoeukvKg[/youtube]



pheonixiis
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25 Sep 2008, 10:59 am

monty wrote:
ToadOfSteel wrote:
monty wrote:
I surround myself with non-low income, non-minority people, and I know quite a few that were encouraged to inflate (ie, lie about) their income, or who got loans where the income was not even checked. My friends were offered huge loans on the assumption that rising home prices would always rise, and that real estate was always a solid investment. It should be obvious that banks were handing out loans like the neighbors hand out candy on Halloween.


The overlying issue is that people want to appear richer than they really are...

It's all about the bloody appearances again... nothing about actual substance.

Hence, the McMansion


The banks were throwing money at anyone willing to sign their name because they made immediate profit, and then the banks sold the dubious loans to some schmuck who didn't know what they were buying.


This is true. We were in the market to buy a house 2003, in the midst of the 'housing bubble.' We were pre-approved for an amount that was staggeringly out of proportion with what we could afford to pay on a morgage. As a result our broker only showed us houses at the very upper-most limit of that amount. In spite of what we said.

Greed. Greed. Greed.

(We didn't buy a house then by the way. Pretty spooked by the whole experience.)


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pbcoll
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25 Sep 2008, 12:59 pm

To point out the obvious, 1977 was quite a while ago - so why didn't it cause problems until now, if it really is the cause of the crisis?

The fact is, no government regulation forced investment banks like Lehmans to buy mortgage-based bonds, no regulation forced ordinary banks to create them (in fact, they were created after de-regulation), no regulation forced (private) ratings agencies to ineptly rate these bonds as safe, no regulation forced boards of governors to come up with golden parachutes, etc encouraging CEOs to take immense risks with shareholder's money (the CEO's could not lose, they were in effect gambling with other people's money with a guaranteed profit for themselves), etc.

There are two government failures involved in the crisis: the artificially low interest rates of the Greenspan-Bernanke era (brought to you by the same people that fuelled the dot com bubble), and the failure of regulators, Bush and Congress to do anything at all about the orgy of speculation going on.


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