Occupy Protests now trying to shut down Ports...
12 Dec 2011, 11:24 am
OAKLAND, Calif. – Anti-Wall Street protesters along the West Coast joined an effort Monday to blockade some of the nation's busiest ports from Anchorage, Alaska, to San Diego, with the thought that if they cut off the ports, they cut into corporate profits.
Demonstrators were to gather to march on the Port of Oakland, which Occupy protesters successfully shut down in November. Marchers also descended on the sprawling port complex spanning Los Angeles and Long Beach as the work day begins.
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/12/12/oc ... z1gL20tDZg
So much for their claims of trying to help the middle class, looks more like they are trying to wreck the entire country...
12 Dec 2011, 11:25 am
Inuyasha wrote:
OAKLAND, Calif. – Anti-Wall Street protesters along the West Coast joined an effort Monday to blockade some of the nation's busiest ports from Anchorage, Alaska, to San Diego, with the thought that if they cut off the ports, they cut into corporate profits.
Demonstrators were to gather to march on the Port of Oakland, which Occupy protesters successfully shut down in November. Marchers also descended on the sprawling port complex spanning Los Angeles and Long Beach as the work day begins.
.....
So much for their claims of trying to help the middle class, looks more like they are trying to wreck the entire country...
Demonstrators were to gather to march on the Port of Oakland, which Occupy protesters successfully shut down in November. Marchers also descended on the sprawling port complex spanning Los Angeles and Long Beach as the work day begins.
.....
So much for their claims of trying to help the middle class, looks more like they are trying to wreck the entire country...
Easy cure: Turn the long-shore men loose.
ruveyn
12 Dec 2011, 11:46 am
ruveyn wrote:
Inuyasha wrote:
OAKLAND, Calif. – Anti-Wall Street protesters along the West Coast joined an effort Monday to blockade some of the nation's busiest ports from Anchorage, Alaska, to San Diego, with the thought that if they cut off the ports, they cut into corporate profits.
Demonstrators were to gather to march on the Port of Oakland, which Occupy protesters successfully shut down in November. Marchers also descended on the sprawling port complex spanning Los Angeles and Long Beach as the work day begins.
.....
So much for their claims of trying to help the middle class, looks more like they are trying to wreck the entire country...
Demonstrators were to gather to march on the Port of Oakland, which Occupy protesters successfully shut down in November. Marchers also descended on the sprawling port complex spanning Los Angeles and Long Beach as the work day begins.
.....
So much for their claims of trying to help the middle class, looks more like they are trying to wreck the entire country...
Easy cure: Turn the long-shore men loose.
ruveyn
Don't get your hopes up. Their supervisors would probably make them stand around and watch them beat the OWSers down as a training exercise. Some supervisors might get upset that some of their guys aren't working while in the process, which then will upset the union guys enough to file grievances for supervisors stealing their work.
Last edited by snapcap on 12 Dec 2011, 12:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Sweetleaf
Veteran
Joined: 6 Jan 2011
Age: 36
Gender: Female
Posts: 35,278
Location: Somewhere in Colorado
12 Dec 2011, 12:17 pm
Inuyasha wrote:
OAKLAND, Calif. – Anti-Wall Street protesters along the West Coast joined an effort Monday to blockade some of the nation's busiest ports from Anchorage, Alaska, to San Diego, with the thought that if they cut off the ports, they cut into corporate profits.
Demonstrators were to gather to march on the Port of Oakland, which Occupy protesters successfully shut down in November. Marchers also descended on the sprawling port complex spanning Los Angeles and Long Beach as the work day begins.
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/12/12/oc ... z1gL20tDZg
So much for their claims of trying to help the middle class, looks more like they are trying to wreck the entire country...
Demonstrators were to gather to march on the Port of Oakland, which Occupy protesters successfully shut down in November. Marchers also descended on the sprawling port complex spanning Los Angeles and Long Beach as the work day begins.
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/12/12/oc ... z1gL20tDZg
So much for their claims of trying to help the middle class, looks more like they are trying to wreck the entire country...
The Occupy movement was never about 'the middle class' its about the 99% world citizens in general vs the 1% who has control of most of the worlds wealth and resources (though since not everyone in the 99% supports this movement its more of a mix of people from all classes and ways of life who are sick of the screwed up sytem).
Glad to hear they are still actively causing trouble for corporate america though, I was thinking the movement was getting close to dying.
_________________
Tis the time to melt the Ice.
12 Dec 2011, 12:21 pm
Sweetleaf wrote:
The Occupy movement was never about 'the middle class' its about the 99% world citizens in general vs the 1% who has control of most of the worlds wealth and resources (though since not everyone in the 99% supports this movement its more of a mix of people from all classes and ways of life who are sick of the screwed up sytem).
.
Will you kindly stop this exaggeration. Please. In the U.S. one percent own about 40 percent of the financial assets. It is about half that much in Japan. You don't see Occupy the Ginza in Japan, do you?
ruveyn
Sweetleaf
Veteran
Joined: 6 Jan 2011
Age: 36
Gender: Female
Posts: 35,278
Location: Somewhere in Colorado
12 Dec 2011, 12:29 pm
ruveyn wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
The Occupy movement was never about 'the middle class' its about the 99% world citizens in general vs the 1% who has control of most of the worlds wealth and resources (though since not everyone in the 99% supports this movement its more of a mix of people from all classes and ways of life who are sick of the screwed up sytem).
.
Will you kindly stop this exaggeration. Please. In the U.S. one percent own about 40 percent of the financial assets. It is about half that much in Japan. You don't see Occupy the Ginza in Japan, do you?
ruveyn
Its not an exageration its a rough estimate based on the world population and the amount of people who control most of the worlds wealth and resources. I was just trying to explain that the Occupy movement has nothing to do with the middle class, it has to do with a small amount of people being in control of most of the worlds wealth and resources and how the majority of people are getting screwed by a small group.
I mean you can agree or disagree with that, but that is what the Occupy movement is about wether you or anyone else likes it or not
_________________
Tis the time to melt the Ice.
12 Dec 2011, 1:24 pm
Sweetleaf wrote:
The Occupy movement was never about 'the middle class' its about the 99% world citizens in general vs the 1% who has control of most of the worlds wealth and resources (though since not everyone in the 99% supports this movement its more of a mix of people from all classes and ways of life who are sick of the screwed up system).
Ms. Leaf,
I beg to disagree.
The "Occupy" movement was never about the 99% vs. the 1%. It has always been about the 9% who can't find a job making trouble for the 90% who are currently employed while the 1% wonders what all the noise is about - if they notice the noise at all, that is.
It is also about people claiming that it is "unfair" for someone else to earn their wealth, and then not share that wealth with someone who has little or no wealth of their own.
It has been proposed that taxes on the rich should be increased to make things more "fair". This will not work. Any extra revenue raised by extra taxes on the wealthy will go straight into military spending, and not social services. To add insult to injury, the wealthy will become wealthier because of it. Who do you think owns the factories that make the planes, tanks, ships, guns, and ammunition? The 9%? The 90%? No, it is the 1% that will profit directly from the increased military spending.
It is a fantasy to believe that the "Occupy" movement will do anything other than provide a distraction for those who have nothing to do and all day to do it.
Sincerely,
Fnord
Sweetleaf
Veteran
Joined: 6 Jan 2011
Age: 36
Gender: Female
Posts: 35,278
Location: Somewhere in Colorado
12 Dec 2011, 1:35 pm
Fnord wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
The Occupy movement was never about 'the middle class' its about the 99% world citizens in general vs the 1% who has control of most of the worlds wealth and resources (though since not everyone in the 99% supports this movement its more of a mix of people from all classes and ways of life who are sick of the screwed up system).
Ms. Leaf,
I beg to disagree.
The "Occupy" movement was never about the 99% vs. the 1%. It has always been about the 9% who can't find a job making trouble for the 90% who are currently employed while the 1% wonders what all the noise is about - if they notice the noise at all, that is.
Well i have to disagree with you there, maybe that's your perception of it......but it is supposed to be about what I described, that is the impression I've got from actually looking into the movement. And I dont know that its accurate that only 9% of people don't have jobs, also though a lot of the protestors do actually have jobs. so I guess its not just people without jobs who are sick of the corruption.
It is also about people claiming that it is "unfair" for someone else to earn their wealth, and then not share that wealth with someone who has little or no wealth of their own.
Much of the wealth was earned through corrupt, dishonest means........and yes it is kind of unfair for the super wealthy who own most of the worlds wealth and control most of the resources to expect those with nothing to just shut up and accept their sh*tty lives even though something could be done to improve their lives.
and also many of these super wealthy families are all about keeping the money in the family, which pretty much kills that whole trickle down idea.
It has been proposed that taxes on the rich should be increased to make things more "fair". This will not work. Any extra revenue raised by extra taxes on the wealthy will go straight into military spending, and not social services. To add insult to injury, the wealthy will become wealthier because of it. Who do you think owns the factories that make the planes, tanks, ships, guns, and ammunition? The 9%? The 90%? No, it is the 1% that will profit directly from the increased military spending.
The only way that would work is if the tax system was reformed so taxes people pay actually do go to services the whole community can benifit from. As it is now they could raise the taxes on the rich and it would not nessisarly help anyone like you say the wealthy would probably just end up more wealthy. So no I would not argue raising taxes on the rich in the current system would help anything.
It is a fantasy to believe that the "Occupy" movement will do anything other than provide a distraction for those who have nothing to do and all day to do it.
Sincerely,
Fnord
I am just glad they are causing trouble for corporate america, and the more people who find out about it......the more people will think about things and maybe want to do something about it themselves. It could be wishful thinking but I figure that is usually the idea of a protest to make a stand and get people thinking about the issues.
_________________
Tis the time to melt the Ice.
12 Dec 2011, 2:23 pm
Fnord wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
The Occupy movement was never about 'the middle class' its about the 99% world citizens in general vs the 1% who has control of most of the worlds wealth and resources (though since not everyone in the 99% supports this movement its more of a mix of people from all classes and ways of life who are sick of the screwed up system).
Ms. Leaf,
I beg to disagree.
The "Occupy" movement was never about the 99% vs. the 1%. It has always been about the 9% who can't find a job making trouble for the 90% who are currently employed while the 1% wonders what all the noise is about - if they notice the noise at all, that is.
It is also about people claiming that it is "unfair" for someone else to earn their wealth, and then not share that wealth with someone who has little or no wealth of their own.
It has been proposed that taxes on the rich should be increased to make things more "fair". This will not work. Any extra revenue raised by extra taxes on the wealthy will go straight into military spending, and not social services. To add insult to injury, the wealthy will become wealthier because of it. Who do you think owns the factories that make the planes, tanks, ships, guns, and ammunition? The 9%? The 90%? No, it is the 1% that will profit directly from the increased military spending.
It is a fantasy to believe that the "Occupy" movement will do anything other than provide a distraction for those who have nothing to do and all day to do it.
Sincerely,
Fnord
Fnord
Let's take it a different. What would be your solution for those to obtain jobs these days? What appropriate measures and steps should they take?
It is said that a person has to start at the bottom. Where exactly is the bottom? In detail, what is the hierarchy of the employers? If one does not have the hierarchy how does one start at the bottom? How does one obtain this hierarchy?
Here is another question that I do have. What exactly is fairness? What should be fair?
When someone tells me life is unfair I do not understand what they and here is why.
1.
free from bias, dishonesty, or injustice: a fair decision; a fair judge.
2.
legitimately sought, pursued, done, given, etc.; proper under the rules: a fair fight.
If life does not go under any proper rules and not going under proper rules is a proper rule then it seems like this statement negates itself and life is therefore fair.
What exactly the correct definition and usage of the words life and fair?
It seems like there are numerous problems with the view of all should be provided necessary help and the other view of whether other people should be forced to provide it?
Is there a way that those who need help can receive help and no one has to be forced to provide it? Fnord, it seems like you believe no one should be forced and sweetleaf it seems like you may believe the other view. I may be wrong. Who is really correct here? Is there a way that both you Fnord and sweetleaf can be happy? What would be a good resolution?
12 Dec 2011, 2:24 pm
Fnord wrote:
The "Occupy" movement was never about the 99% vs. the 1%. It has always been about the 9% who can't find a job making trouble for the 90% who are currently employed while the 1% wonders what all the noise is about - if they notice the noise at all, that is.
It is also about people claiming that it is "unfair" for someone else to earn their wealth, and then not share that wealth with someone who has little or no wealth of their own
It is also about people claiming that it is "unfair" for someone else to earn their wealth, and then not share that wealth with someone who has little or no wealth of their own
Both of these statements are patently untrue. Regarding the first one, there are plenty of sources showing that the majority of people participating in Occupy are employed - I would be happy to link you to some if you can't find them.
Also, it's not about people who fairly earn their wealth, it's about the exploitation of government loopholes to do so. For example, giant conglomerate corporations that pay minimal or no tax.
Sincerely,
An employed occupier who has no problem with rich people who fairly earn their wealth
12 Dec 2011, 2:24 pm
ruveyn wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
The Occupy movement was never about 'the middle class' its about the 99% world citizens in general vs the 1% who has control of most of the worlds wealth and resources (though since not everyone in the 99% supports this movement its more of a mix of people from all classes and ways of life who are sick of the screwed up sytem).
.
Will you kindly stop this exaggeration. Please. In the U.S. one percent own about 40 percent of the financial assets. It is about half that much in Japan. You don't see Occupy the Ginza in Japan, do you?
ruveyn
Where did you find this statistic at?
12 Dec 2011, 2:28 pm
dogslife wrote:
Fnord wrote:
The "Occupy" movement was never about the 99% vs. the 1%. It has always been about the 9% who can't find a job making trouble for the 90% who are currently employed while the 1% wonders what all the noise is about - if they notice the noise at all, that is.
It is also about people claiming that it is "unfair" for someone else to earn their wealth, and then not share that wealth with someone who has little or no wealth of their own
It is also about people claiming that it is "unfair" for someone else to earn their wealth, and then not share that wealth with someone who has little or no wealth of their own
Both of these statements are patently untrue. Regarding the first one, there are plenty of sources showing that the majority of people participating in Occupy are employed - I would be happy to link you to some if you can't find them.
Also, it's not about people who fairly earn their wealth, it's about the exploitation of government loopholes to do so. For example, giant conglomerate corporations that pay minimal or no tax.
Sincerely,
An employed occupier who has no problem with rich people who fairly earn their wealth
I am going to ask you what I asked Fnord? What exactly is the meaning and the correct usage of the word fair supposed to be?
12 Dec 2011, 2:29 pm
Ms. Leaf,
Your views have merit.
I have to point out that not all wealth is acquired dishonestly, and that not all of those who lack wealth lead "sh*tty" lives. It is also not so much that they expect the rest of us to shut up, but that they may have already blocked us out.
As for the "90% + 9% + 1%" equation, the 9% value is derived from the Mean Unemployment Rate, which is currently at about 8.6%.
The Occupy movement seems to have many goals, not the least of which is to simply draw attention to itself. My view that it's really all about the 9% (or the 8.6%) just making noise and trouble is from observing the videos and speaking with some of the Occupiers. They want to "Draw attention to our cause" and "Make enough trouble that people start taking us seriously". Other than that, the actual "Cause" seems to vary with the locale and the people being interviewed.
And yes, the Plutarchs have way too much control over how the world governments run, and we're likely to see things get much worse before they get any better, but what can we do? They simply do not care.
Sincerely,
Fnord
PS: The "Occupy the Ports" protests are over. It seems that the 9% can't stand a little rain.
PPS: For the record, I go by the applicable Merriam-Webster Dictionary definition of the word "fair":
FAIR (adj): (1) Marked by impartiality and honesty; (2) free from self-interest, prejudice, or favoritism; (3) Conforming with the established rules; (4) allowed.
12 Dec 2011, 2:46 pm
Sweetleaf wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
The Occupy movement was never about 'the middle class' its about the 99% world citizens in general vs the 1% who has control of most of the worlds wealth and resources (though since not everyone in the 99% supports this movement its more of a mix of people from all classes and ways of life who are sick of the screwed up sytem).
.
Will you kindly stop this exaggeration. Please. In the U.S. one percent own about 40 percent of the financial assets. It is about half that much in Japan. You don't see Occupy the Ginza in Japan, do you?
ruveyn
Its not an exageration its a rough estimate based on the world population and the amount of people who control most of the worlds wealth and resources. I was just trying to explain that the Occupy movement has nothing to do with the middle class, it has to do with a small amount of people being in control of most of the worlds wealth and resources and how the majority of people are getting screwed by a small group.
I mean you can agree or disagree with that, but that is what the Occupy movement is about wether you or anyone else likes it or not
I agree with the movement I just wish people were able to do a bit more than occupy. I think the middle class needs to step up it's game and start petitioning for better human resources and less corporate freedoms. We should have more government policies that prevent corporations from needlessly looking for cheaper labor. If nothing is done than there could be a lot more poor and a lot less middle class.
Fogman
Veteran
Joined: 19 Jun 2005
Age: 59
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,986
Location: Frå Nord Dakota til Vermont
12 Dec 2011, 2:50 pm
Inuyasha wrote:
OAKLAND, Calif. – Anti-Wall Street protesters along the West Coast joined an effort Monday to blockade some of the nation's busiest ports from Anchorage, Alaska, to San Diego, with the thought that if they cut off the ports, they cut into corporate profits.
Demonstrators were to gather to march on the Port of Oakland, which Occupy protesters successfully shut down in November. Marchers also descended on the sprawling port complex spanning Los Angeles and Long Beach as the work day begins.
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/12/12/oc ... z1gL20tDZg
So much for their claims of trying to help the middle class, looks more like they are trying to wreck the entire country...
Demonstrators were to gather to march on the Port of Oakland, which Occupy protesters successfully shut down in November. Marchers also descended on the sprawling port complex spanning Los Angeles and Long Beach as the work day begins.
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/12/12/oc ... z1gL20tDZg
So much for their claims of trying to help the middle class, looks more like they are trying to wreck the entire country...
This will earn them the hate of many people who want to get new electronics during the holidays, when supplies run out and stores are unable to resupply due to the ports being blocked. Complete fail.
--Then again, your source is Fox news, which isn't exactly known for providing credible news.
_________________
When There's No There to get to, I'm so There!
12 Dec 2011, 4:25 pm
Fnord wrote:
Ms. Leaf,
Your views have merit.
I have to point out that not all wealth is acquired dishonestly, and that not all of those who lack wealth lead "sh*tty" lives. It is also not so much that they expect the rest of us to shut up, but that they may have already blocked us out.
As for the "90% + 9% + 1%" equation, the 9% value is derived from the Mean Unemployment Rate, which is currently at about 8.6%.
The Occupy movement seems to have many goals, not the least of which is to simply draw attention to itself. My view that it's really all about the 9% (or the 8.6%) just making noise and trouble is from observing the videos and speaking with some of the Occupiers. They want to "Draw attention to our cause" and "Make enough trouble that people start taking us seriously". Other than that, the actual "Cause" seems to vary with the locale and the people being interviewed.
And yes, the Plutarchs have way too much control over how the world governments run, and we're likely to see things get much worse before they get any better, but what can we do? They simply do not care.
Sincerely,
Fnord
PS: The "Occupy the Ports" protests are over. It seems that the 9% can't stand a little rain.
PPS: For the record, I go by the applicable Merriam-Webster Dictionary definition of the word "fair":
FAIR (adj): (1) Marked by impartiality and honesty; (2) free from self-interest, prejudice, or favoritism; (3) Conforming with the established rules; (4) allowed.
Your views have merit.
I have to point out that not all wealth is acquired dishonestly, and that not all of those who lack wealth lead "sh*tty" lives. It is also not so much that they expect the rest of us to shut up, but that they may have already blocked us out.
As for the "90% + 9% + 1%" equation, the 9% value is derived from the Mean Unemployment Rate, which is currently at about 8.6%.
The Occupy movement seems to have many goals, not the least of which is to simply draw attention to itself. My view that it's really all about the 9% (or the 8.6%) just making noise and trouble is from observing the videos and speaking with some of the Occupiers. They want to "Draw attention to our cause" and "Make enough trouble that people start taking us seriously". Other than that, the actual "Cause" seems to vary with the locale and the people being interviewed.
And yes, the Plutarchs have way too much control over how the world governments run, and we're likely to see things get much worse before they get any better, but what can we do? They simply do not care.
Sincerely,
Fnord
PS: The "Occupy the Ports" protests are over. It seems that the 9% can't stand a little rain.
PPS: For the record, I go by the applicable Merriam-Webster Dictionary definition of the word "fair":
FAIR (adj): (1) Marked by impartiality and honesty; (2) free from self-interest, prejudice, or favoritism; (3) Conforming with the established rules; (4) allowed.
Fnord, here is the paradox. If life is unfair like some claim then life does not conform to any established rules. This seems to be a rule in itself. If this is a rule then life does comform to established rules so therefore life is fair. By saying life is unfair why can't we conclude life is fair hence the paradox or am I missing something? If my logic is off where am I wrong in my premises?
