The REAL cause of the totenham riots...

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MissConstrue
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09 Aug 2011, 2:54 pm

Tom_Kakes wrote:
MissConstrue wrote:
Tom_Kakes wrote:
MissConstrue wrote:
This supposedly started out as a peaceful protest against the shooting of Mark Duggan. I also find his shooting very suspicious and I think it needs open investigation. However I do not condone what these guys are doing. Even Mark Duggan's family condemned these violent "riots". They are thugs and when protests like this happen it is not unusual for people like this to get in on it. I doubt they are doing it for Mark Duggan or even for what you presume their poor status. I live in a trailer without any air condition, I have no job now, I do not have spending money and I came from a working family who lived on little. I have been homeless and not all people who live in poverty or living in a poor economic circumstances act like this. This is pure criminal behavior and it makes most people who are disenfranchised and living in poverty look bad. I saw one video that really p*ssed me off. Now you tell me who the criminal is? If this is out of frustration, they are not doing a good job AT ALL by behaving this way. They are not attacking the wealthy they are attacking their own neighborhood and without motivation.


http://youtu.be/HLPxmKf02C4



[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLPxmKf02C4[/youtube]



This video has been on the first page of this thread since 10 this morning well before it was put on the BBC news website. Nice that you all payed attention. How can you even argue if you dont know the facts...

Btw apparently fresh outbreaks in Cambridge in the mill road area. According to a friend, fires have been started.

Im thinking about the time people start to listen and differences can be reconciliated, it will be far too late.



I don't live in London so I do not know all the details. But I do want to point out, I do know what it's like to be frustrated living in the lower gap of society. Here in America there is a lot of prejudice attitudes toward the poor and the gap between the wealthy and poor is getting bigger. Even people who were once in the upper middle class are losing their jobs and experiencing poverty first hand.

I'm not sure what I missed. I've read all of your posts and I still do not see the excuse for what is happening right now. I do not have the tendency to take either sides too quickly. I don't know what the corruption from police is like over there but I do know that despite what has happend, this is not a protest but theft and robbery. I don't believe for one second these guys are protesting or doing the right thing to get their message spread across. There are much better ways of protesting without burning buildings and cars and stealing a bunch of stuff out of stores and people while cowardly wearing masks. All they are doing is making themselves look bad and frankly I don't blame the people in London who are angry. These guys are acting out in the most childish ways. Maybe you're ok with it but if worse came to worse and one of these kids starts attacking someone or robbing another person just because they want to get their "message" spread, don't be surprised if these people they rob from should have to defend themselves with any means necessary. This kind of sh*t happens to all countries regardless of race or creed. In the end most people get hurt. I think the Egyptian protesters did a much a better job than these half wits and my hats off to them. They united themselves no matter who they were with few bad apples. Nevertheless, they united and tried to get rid of this division that these kids are helping perpetuate.


Be great if you could expound on these differences you're talking about. I hate racism as the next person and it does exist. I hate poverty and it exists and it's not just a thing that happens to people of color but of people of many creeds including whites. If you want to bring these issues up, at least bring them up in a way that makes sense to everyone without resorting to this crap. This is not a protest this is robbery. Had it occurred to you that perhaps the very stores that're being busted and robbed are the very jobs people are working at? Has it not occurred to you that those who are trying to better themselves are now having to pay what little they have because of these guys? All this is going to do is prove that many of us who are "commoners" are nothing but criminals who want to leach off everyone else. All this is going to do is anger people who had nothing to do with what has been provoked.


Fair enough :)

its because they are broke, undervalued and pi**ed off!


I highly doubt it. Some may be but from what I've seen in pictures and the videos, I couldn't even begin to afford the kind of clothes, shoes and hairstyles these rioters are wearing. A lot of it looks new and expensive. Then again, maybe the stole them who knows. And FYI I am also pissed about our economy but I'm not going to go stealing out of stores or bashing people's property. If I was going to protest, it would be at the Corporations and the Government running this country. But even that is hard to do especially if you don't have a car. >_<


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Tom_Kakes
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09 Aug 2011, 2:58 pm

This has been poping in and out of my head all day, only just thought to think why lol.

Enjoy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFM7Ty1EEvs



cdfox7
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09 Aug 2011, 3:11 pm

MissConstrue wrote:
I highly doubt it. Some may be but from what I've seen in pictures and the videos, I couldn't even begin to afford the kind of clothes, shoes and hairstyles these rioters are wearing. A lot of it looks new and expensive. Then again, maybe the stole them who knows. And FYI I am also pissed about our economy but I'm not going to go stealing out of stores or bashing people's property. If I was going to protest, it would be at the Corporations and the Government running this country. But even that is hard to do especially if you don't have a car. >_<


Theres people in my city who don't work have designer clothes, flashy sports cars and the top cell phones. 9 times of out 10 one can guess that theses people make money from crime.

Also organised crime in my city requte children to do they dirty work as kids under our current criminal justice system (IMHO its a f*****g joke as those you do crime can get away with it too easy) lets kids get away scot free from a few crimes.

We had this problem from years on in the UK, its a social issue on many levels. Theses riots only show the world how f****d up our society is in my country right now.



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09 Aug 2011, 3:11 pm

Urgh, was going to meet up with two friends and have had to cancel.

My opinion of this whole thing: Playing fields concreted over and built upon, youth centres closed, EMA taken away (harder to travel to college and buy books), benefits cut...these youths are bored and have nothing to do. I know when I have nothing to do, I feel like I'm going crazy. But I don't loot, burn people's homes, lifetime businesses..

If this whole thing was political they would have had a main message before it all started, and they wouldn't have taken it out in their own communities. So they must be bored kids who have decided to loot for some excitement. I blame the government cuts, and making people pay too much for things like swimming pools plus all of the things I mentioned in the second sentence I wrote. Basically, if they had something better to do (which has been taken away) then this could have been prevented. I still think they're thugs.



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09 Aug 2011, 3:23 pm

Something to add: How can you call these people parasites when it's the rich who are keeping all of the money and cutting off everything to the poor including money and decent education? If you cut these things off then how are people going to get decent enough jobs like the rich?



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09 Aug 2011, 3:26 pm

[

quote="MissConstrue"]

Tom_Kakes wrote:
MissConstrue wrote:
Tom_Kakes wrote:
MissConstrue wrote:
This supposedly started out as a peaceful protest against the shooting of Mark Duggan. I also find his shooting very suspicious and I think it needs open investigation. However I do not condone what these guys are doing. Even Mark Duggan's family condemned these violent "riots". They are thugs and when protests like this happen it is not unusual for people like this to get in on it. I doubt they are doing it for Mark Duggan or even for what you presume their poor status. I live in a trailer without any air condition, I have no job now, I do not have spending money and I came from a working family who lived on little. I have been homeless and not all people who live in poverty or living in a poor economic circumstances act like this. This is pure criminal behavior and it makes most people who are disenfranchised and living in poverty look bad. I saw one video that really p*ssed me off. Now you tell me who the criminal is? If this is out of frustration, they are not doing a good job AT ALL by behaving this way. They are not attacking the wealthy they are attacking their own neighborhood and without motivation.


http://youtu.be/HLPxmKf02C4



[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLPxmKf02C4[/youtube]



This video has been on the first page of this thread since 10 this morning well before it was put on the BBC news website. Nice that you all payed attention. How can you even argue if you dont know the facts...

Btw apparently fresh outbreaks in Cambridge in the mill road area. According to a friend, fires have been started.

Im thinking about the time people start to listen and differences can be reconciliated, it will be far too late.



I don't live in London so I do not know all the details. But I do want to point out, I do know what it's like to be frustrated living in the lower gap of society. Here in America there is a lot of prejudice attitudes toward the poor and the gap between the wealthy and poor is getting bigger. Even people who were once in the upper middle class are losing their jobs and experiencing poverty first hand.

I'm not sure what I missed. I've read all of your posts and I still do not see the excuse for what is happening right now. I do not have the tendency to take either sides too quickly. I don't know what the corruption from police is like over there but I do know that despite what has happend, this is not a protest but theft and robbery. I don't believe for one second these guys are protesting or doing the right thing to get their message spread across. There are much better ways of protesting without burning buildings and cars and stealing a bunch of stuff out of stores and people while cowardly wearing masks. All they are doing is making themselves look bad and frankly I don't blame the people in London who are angry. These guys are acting out in the most childish ways. Maybe you're ok with it but if worse came to worse and one of these kids starts attacking someone or robbing another person just because they want to get their "message" spread, don't be surprised if these people they rob from should have to defend themselves with any means necessary. This kind of sh*t happens to all countries regardless of race or creed. In the end most people get hurt. I think the Egyptian protesters did a much a better job than these half wits and my hats off to them. They united themselves no matter who they were with few bad apples. Nevertheless, they united and tried to get rid of this division that these kids are helping perpetuate.


Be great if you could expound on these differences you're talking about. I hate racism as the next person and it does exist. I hate poverty and it exists and it's not just a thing that happens to people of color but of people of many creeds including whites. If you want to bring these issues up, at least bring them up in a way that makes sense to everyone without resorting to this crap. This is not a protest this is robbery. Had it occurred to you that perhaps the very stores that're being busted and robbed are the very jobs people are working at? Has it not occurred to you that those who are trying to better themselves are now having to pay what little they have because of these guys? All this is going to do is prove that many of us who are "commoners" are nothing but criminals who want to leach off everyone else. All this is going to do is anger people who had nothing to do with what has been provoked.


Fair enough :)

its because they are broke, undervalued and pi**ed off!


I highly doubt it. Some may be but from what I've seen in pictures and the videos, I couldn't even begin to afford the kind of clothes, shoes and hairstyles these rioters are wearing. A lot of it looks new and expensive. Then again, maybe the stole them who knows. And FYI I am also pissed about our economy but I'm not going to go stealing out of stores or bashing people's property. If I was going to protest, it would be at the Corporations and the Government running this country. But even that is hard to do especially if you don't have a car. >_<[/quote]


Ok.

Trying to compare your personal life experiences to a such a diverse group of people only hilights the deep problems we have in society as a whole. How can you? I certainly didn't see them all wearing Gucci. I don't know one scrap of information their backgrounds. Is it their first offence, do they smoke weed, were they beaten as a child?

What do you?

Getting fed up with saying but I reiterate. I don't agree with what they are doing and I also don't agree with what has been done to them. It could and should have been avoided and it has gone far too far. People are going to get killed and it won't be the rich.



Tom_Kakes
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09 Aug 2011, 3:35 pm

BTW was replying to both your posts ad I missed your first.

Sorry :)



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09 Aug 2011, 3:39 pm

smudge wrote:
Something to add: How can you call these people parasites when it's the rich who are keeping all of the money and cutting off everything to the poor including money and decent education? If you cut these things off then how are people going to get decent enough jobs like the rich?


Its the government and the media that spin the poor on benefits as parasites. The Tories as the same old Tories thinking about the rich. Labour were the same back in the 90s under the New Labour (Pseudo Tory) BS. You know today in the news it was said that the bankers got another pay rise, a great day to cover that up now!!

Don't trust the Tories as after the Toxeth riots back in the 80s they did say that they would resolve the social issues that riot pointed out, they did jack s**t!! Its taken my city 20 years to recover from the '81 and '85 riots.



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09 Aug 2011, 3:43 pm

cdfox7 wrote:
smudge wrote:
Something to add: How can you call these people parasites when it's the rich who are keeping all of the money and cutting off everything to the poor including money and decent education? If you cut these things off then how are people going to get decent enough jobs like the rich?


Its the government and the media that spin the poor on benefits as parasites. The Tories as the same old Tories thinking about the rich. Labour were the same back in the 90s under the New Labour (Pseudo Tory) BS. You know today in the news it was said that the bankers got another pay rise, a great day to cover that up now!!

Don't trust the Tories as after the Toxeth riots back in the 80s they did say that they would resolve the social issues that riot pointed out, they did jack sh**! ! Its taken my city 20 years to recover from the '81 and '85 riots.


No, I don't trust them. It was just that post on here that spoke of them being parasites and how great it was for where they live where they have more guns than people. :roll:



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09 Aug 2011, 3:44 pm

cdfox7 wrote:
smudge wrote:
Something to add: How can you call these people parasites when it's the rich who are keeping all of the money and cutting off everything to the poor including money and decent education? If you cut these things off then how are people going to get decent enough jobs like the rich?


Its the government and the media that spin the poor on benefits as parasites. The Tories as the same old Tories thinking about the rich. Labour were the same back in the 90s under the New Labour (Pseudo Tory) BS. You know today in the news it was said that the bankers got another pay rise, a great day to cover that up now!!

Don't trust the Tories as after the Toxeth riots back in the 80s they did say that they would resolve the social issues that riot pointed out, they did jack sh**! ! Its taken my city 20 years to recover from the '81 and '85 riots.



+1

I'll never vote Tory, ever!



Tom_Kakes
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09 Aug 2011, 3:50 pm

smudge wrote:
cdfox7 wrote:
smudge wrote:
Something to add: How can you call these people parasites when it's the rich who are keeping all of the money and cutting off everything to the poor including money and decent education? If you cut these things off then how are people going to get decent enough jobs like the rich?


Its the government and the media that spin the poor on benefits as parasites. The Tories as the same old Tories thinking about the rich. Labour were the same back in the 90s under the New Labour (Pseudo Tory) BS. You know today in the news it was said that the bankers got another pay rise, a great day to cover that up now!!

Don't trust the Tories as after the Toxeth riots back in the 80s they did say that they would resolve the social issues that riot pointed out, they did jack sh**! ! Its taken my city 20 years to recover from the '81 and '85 riots.


No, I don't trust them. It was just that post on here that spoke of them being parasites and how great it was for where they live where they have more guns than people. :roll:


I hate that slimebucket Cameron, he makes me want to puke every time I hear his voice. Funny how he was on holiday when this all happend. He didn't even come back till today. Well out if view of the cameras. Teflon slimebucket!



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09 Aug 2011, 3:54 pm

You're right, he is a slimebucket. That smug, sly look on his face just says "slime"! !



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09 Aug 2011, 3:55 pm

smudge wrote:
No, I don't trust them. It was just that post on here that spoke of them being parasites and how great it was for where they live where they have more guns than people. :roll:


The Yanks don't understand cos they don't live &/or had expedience of living in the UK. Now just imagine if we had the same gun controls as the Yanks, we be talking about people being killed and theses riots would be more of a cluster f**k that it already right now. Two wrongs don't make a right!

Now if those Yanks had the same gun controls as us Brits then they might have a safer place to live :wink:



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09 Aug 2011, 4:02 pm

cdfox7 wrote:
smudge wrote:
No, I don't trust them. It was just that post on here that spoke of them being parasites and how great it was for where they live where they have more guns than people. :roll:


The Yanks don't understand cos they don't live &/or had expedience of living in the UK. Now just imagine if we had the same gun controls as the Yanks, we be talking about people being killed and theses riots would be more of a cluster f**k that it already right now. Two wrongs don't make a right!

Now if those Yanks had the same gun controls as us Brits then they might have a safer place to live :wink:


Lol ;)

I wouldn't trust myself with a gun. Let alone any other Englishman. Ask the Tasmanians :(



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09 Aug 2011, 4:05 pm

OrangeCloud wrote:
There may be extremely poor people who are looting out of necessaty, or anarchists that are damaging property to make a political statement.

But I think that the majority are just criminal opportunists and adrenaline junkies who are harming and terrorising people and their property without regard or empathy, I hope the police crack down on them hard.


this.
it is mindless and purely for the sake of it- fuelled by people getting caught up in the 'excitement'
that is what is so infuriating.



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09 Aug 2011, 4:10 pm

smudge wrote:
No, I don't trust them. It was just that post on here that spoke of them being parasites and how great it was for where they live where they have more guns than people. :roll:

He is just glad that if there is ever civil unrest near him, he and his community has the means to hold the kind of BS going on in London right now at bay. If this is truly a romanticized communist dream of the proletariat rising up, why are they fighting their own neighborhoods and not making any attempt to go after politicians and their financial backers? Why are they just running around looking for new communities to sack? If they have an organized plan to take force the government and the super rich to implement some notion of social justice, why are they running around attacking small shop owners?

parrow wrote:
These are parasites, not revolutionaries. Revolutionaries stand and fight their oppressors, not the people.

EXACTLY!! ! Barbarian hordes. How is it that when I was living off peanuts when I couldn't get any aid that running around town beating people up and torching everything in my wake never stood to help my situation any?

And why the hell did England import people that can't look after themselves and the government can't afford to look after them ether? Did they decide that keeping peace in Northern Ireland and dealing with chavs wasn't a big enough headache so they added to it?


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