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aussiebloke
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03 Apr 2018, 3:17 am

auntblabby wrote:
if the great joojoo had not intended for us to eat animals, why did he make them out of meat? ;)



If you believe in such things why did this so called creator make most of his creations vegan ? FACT . And if you believe in science our closet relation is a herbivorous FACT . Why deny science ?


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aussiebloke
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03 Apr 2018, 3:26 am

Wolfram87 wrote:
aussiebloke wrote:
What are meat eater in the eyes of animals ?


Just another predator? Or do you morally judge predators as well?


aussiebloke wrote:
What did you achieve by eating a animal?


A full stomach?



And people pretending to have the reduction of animal suffering in mind should look up what the warfarin-derivatives used to guard their precious soy does to the animals ingesting it and the rest of the eco-system. Hint: quick and painless isn't part of that process. I'll have my steak now, thanks.


Enjoy your steak in ignorance , most of the worlds cows are not fed grass can you guess what ? Can you guess how many kilos of soy , grain etc it takes to produce a kilo of meat ? Are you familiar with the saying as hungry as a pig ?
Why do people comment on things they know nothing about ? I would never do this , I only stick to the things I know , which ain't much.


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Last edited by aussiebloke on 03 Apr 2018, 3:34 am, edited 1 time in total.

aussiebloke
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03 Apr 2018, 3:30 am

Wolfram87 wrote:
aussiebloke wrote:
What are meat eater in the eyes of animals ?


Just another predator? Or do you morally judge predators as well?


aussiebloke wrote:
What did you achieve by eating a animal?


A full stomach?



And people pretending to have the reduction of animal suffering in mind should look up what the warfarin-derivatives used to guard their precious soy does to the animals ingesting it and the rest of the eco-system. Hint: quick and painless isn't part of that process. I'll have my steak now, thanks.


I agree , glad you clarified . I also object to the vegans who protest at cattle ranchers etc . Just set up a stall at a shopping mall and educate the public in a non condescending tone .


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aussiebloke
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03 Apr 2018, 3:33 am

cyberdad wrote:
B9 the vegan will tell you (through their loudspeaker) that you are creating a demand for killing more cows when you order the t-bone



For some one so smart you still don't get it . You are not alone , some day I hope .


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Wolfram87
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03 Apr 2018, 3:40 am

I'm a hunter, an amateur biologist and an avid nature-lover. Tell me again that I'm ignorant on these matters. Saying you don't know much seems to be an understatement with how simplistic your view on this is. The bottom line is this: you do not have the moral high ground. Personally, I'd say it's worse to indiscriminately cause the death of wild animals and disrupt eco-systems than it is to kill and eat animals raised and bred for captivity. Your soy, beans and grains are not cruelty-free. You just have an easier time igoring the death it causes. But there I go being a terrorist again, right?


aussiebloke wrote:
And if you believe in science our closet relation is a herbivorous FACT . Why deny science ?

Given opportunity, chimps will readily and enthusiastically eat meat. And I don't know, why do you deny science?


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aussiebloke
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03 Apr 2018, 3:49 am

Wolfram87 wrote:
I'm a hunter, an amateur biologist and an avid nature-lover. Tell me again that I'm ignorant on these matters. Saying you don't know much seems to be an understatement with how simplistic your view on this is. The bottom line is this: you do not have the moral high ground. Personally, I'd say it's worse to indiscriminately cause the death of wild animals and disrupt eco-systems than it is to kill and eat animals raised and bred for captivity. Your soy, beans and grains are not cruelty-free. You just have an easier time igoring the death it causes. But there I go being a terrorist again, right?


aussiebloke wrote:
And if you believe in science our closet relation is a herbivorous FACT . Why deny science ?

Given opportunity, chimps will readily and enthusiastically eat meat. And I don't know, why do you deny science?


You did not address my other point , what are the majority of the worlds food animals fed ? Please enlighten me and tell be what the feed conversion ratio is to produce a kilo of meat ?

I just which meat eaters where honest and just admit they don't care about cruelty , or they do and instead think there palate or appeal to tradition fallacies is more important . At least I can respect them for their honesty

And what does your job title have anything to do with this discussion ? I have seen "vets" who allegedly care for animals who own foie gras farms . Force feeding kilos of corn to a duck with a metal pipe down their gullet at one sitting is not cruel ?


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aussiebloke
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03 Apr 2018, 3:57 am

aussiebloke wrote:
Wolfram87 wrote:
I'm a hunter, an amateur biologist and an avid nature-lover. Tell me again that I'm ignorant on these matters. Saying you don't know much seems to be an understatement with how simplistic your view on this is. The bottom line is this: you do not have the moral high ground. Personally, I'd say it's worse to indiscriminately cause the death of wild animals and disrupt eco-systems than it is to kill and eat animals raised and bred for captivity. Your soy, beans and grains are not cruelty-free. You just have an easier time igoring the death it causes. But there I go being a terrorist again, right?


aussiebloke wrote:
And if you believe in science our closet relation is a herbivorous FACT . Why deny science ?

Given opportunity, chimps will readily and enthusiastically eat meat. And I don't know, why do you deny science?


You did not address my other point , what are the majority of the worlds food animals fed ? Please enlighten me and tell be what the feed conversion ratio is to produce a kilo of meat ?

I just which meat eaters where honest and just admit they don't care about cruelty , or they do and instead think there palate or appeal to tradition fallacies is more important . At least I can respect them for their honesty

And what does your job title have anything to do with this discussion ? I have seen "vets" who allegedly care for animals who own foie gras farms . Force feeding kilos of corn to a duck with a metal pipe down their gullet at one sitting is not cruel ?


" GIVEN THE OPPURTUNITY " Yes I would eat meat to , so would a vegan animal like a cow whom became cannibals in the EU , which is what caused mad cow . In the wild its all about survival . What does opportunity have anything to do with it ? Give a gorilla a plate of bananas or a beef rending which one would it eat ? If meat eating is so natural why does it increase our risks of so many diseases , yet a veg based diet reduces these problems ? When has a half decent doctor told their patient to reduce their broccoli intake ?


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aussiebloke
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03 Apr 2018, 3:59 am

^^^^^

I never said my diet was cruelty free . It is about harm reduction


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Wolfram87
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03 Apr 2018, 4:19 am

None of those are my job title; they are things I do in my spare time because they interest me. They do, however, bestow on me some knowledge about ecology, which is very pertinent to this discussion.

And I'm well aware that in many places cows are fed soy and grains and whole bunch of other BS that's not good for them, and no, I can't tell you the isolated doomsday-number you're trying to get out of me. My point isn't that the meat industry is perfect, my point is that your offered alternative puffs itself up with moral superiority that it cannot deliver on.


And yes, foie gras farming is animal cruelty. So is Belgian Blue breeding. So is cock fighting and bull fighting. So is that thing vegan activists do when they break into mink farms and release the murderous little buggers on the local duck population.


Quote:
I just which meat eaters where honest and just admit they don't care about cruelty


I'm glad to see that veganism comes with telepathy now. Oh, it doesn't? Then shove your moralizing where it belongs.


Quote:
Give a gorilla a plate of bananas or a beef rending which one would it eat ?


Like I said before, gorillas have evolved their guts and intestines towards an (as far as I know) entirely vegetarian diet. It's why they spend almost all their time eating. Their food is high in mass and low in nutritional value.


Quote:
" GIVEN THE OPPURTUNITY "


As in, they will actively hunt, kill and eat monkeys and other smaller creatures. Not as in "if served to them on a plate".


Quote:
If meat eating is so natural why does it increase our risks of so many diseases , yet a veg based diet reduces these problems ?

Mostly meat based diet comes with problems, mostly plant based diet comes with other problems. It's almost like we're omnivores or something.


[quote][/ When has a half decent doctor told their patient to reduce their broccoli intake ?[quote]

There was a vegan propaganda campaign here some time ago where they claimed that broccoli contained more protein than beef. They counted "per calorie" rather than "per gram". So given that you'd have to eat something like 5 kilos of broccoli to get the same protein as contained in 200 grams of beef, I'd say a half decent doctor might advice against that?


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