Democrats seek to 'Dissolve' Cities in Georgia

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John_Browning
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13 Apr 2011, 11:50 pm

The voting rights act of 1965 and the 15th amendment were not violated not violated in creating those cities. Blacks living in the area are still allowed their vote. Nor can the creation of those cities be considered racial gerrymandering because they were created as the result of some very wise economic moves that created some very prosperous cities and the quality of public works, utilities, and emergency response was a major factor that led to the development of the cities as well. If anything, the voting rights act of 1965 works against the butthurt blacks because the argument that the 1965 voting rights act protects racial gerrymandering was struck down Miller v. Johnson, and gerrymandering for the purpose of creating a predominantly black district is all they would be doing because there certainly wouldn't be any logistical or economic incentive to do so.


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DanielF
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14 Apr 2011, 12:18 am

Dissolving the aforementioned cities won't neccesarily mean that everyone will be able or want to leave for other localities! The homeless have no form of transportation in which to escape the city and criminals like gangsters and vandals, probably wouldn't want too! The problem with city police forces today is that they are currently understaffed and underpaid, and so they would be of little or no effect in convincing the citizens of each city to leave their current residencies en masse.


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14 Apr 2011, 1:06 am

xenon13 wrote:
The purpose of this is to not have to pay for Atlanta public transit and for other such things thus forcing massive service cuts and tax rises for the heavily black areas.

Does Atlanta public transit serve these towns as well as it does Atlanta? If not, it seems quite reasonable for the towns not to want to pay for some other city's benefits.



John_Browning
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14 Apr 2011, 5:53 pm

psychohist wrote:
xenon13 wrote:
The purpose of this is to not have to pay for Atlanta public transit and for other such things thus forcing massive service cuts and tax rises for the heavily black areas.

Does Atlanta public transit serve these towns as well as it does Atlanta? If not, it seems quite reasonable for the towns not to want to pay for some other city's benefits.

I've heard that public transportation in that area of the country is really limited and I can only imagine it would be worse in unincorporated areas, which like utilities and trash service, they wanted to improve on.


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xenon13
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14 Apr 2011, 7:52 pm

Some of those towns infamously outsourced most of their functions to corporations including one in Colorado when they were created. This was supposed to be the future of for profit contractors running all government functions that is part of a dystopia planned.



John_Browning
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14 Apr 2011, 8:14 pm

xenon13 wrote:
Some of those towns infamously outsourced most of their functions to corporations including one in Colorado when they were created. This was supposed to be the future of for profit contractors running all government functions that is part of a dystopia planned.

So?


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Kraichgauer
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14 Apr 2011, 9:26 pm

John_Browning wrote:
xenon13 wrote:
Some of those towns infamously outsourced most of their functions to corporations including one in Colorado when they were created. This was supposed to be the future of for profit contractors running all government functions that is part of a dystopia planned.

So?


Everything I've heard of private contractors running public services leaves much to be desired.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



John_Browning
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14 Apr 2011, 10:03 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
John_Browning wrote:
xenon13 wrote:
Some of those towns infamously outsourced most of their functions to corporations including one in Colorado when they were created. This was supposed to be the future of for profit contractors running all government functions that is part of a dystopia planned.

So?


Everything I've heard of private contractors running public services leaves much to be desired.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

There is a mix of public, private, and regulated services here and they are all about the same.


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14 Apr 2011, 10:49 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
No one should have the right to dissolve anyone's city or town - not liberals in this case, and not conservatives in Wisconsin, where governor Walker and conservative state legislators are seeking this power.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


ideally, but it sounds like they are trying to rectify a republican redistricting move obviously intended to eliminate democratic voters from the district.

or .. this would certainly explain it:

xenon13 wrote:
These cities were just created as part of a scheme to carve out a mostly-white county out of Fultton and DeKalb Counties (they plan to call the new county Milton County). The purpose of this is to not have to pay for Atlanta public transit and for other such things thus forcing massive service cuts and tax rises for the heavily black areas. The plaintiffs maintain that the law was not properly followed in carrying out this scheme and that it is motivated by racism and civil rights denial.


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Kraichgauer
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14 Apr 2011, 11:07 pm

katzefrau wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
No one should have the right to dissolve anyone's city or town - not liberals in this case, and not conservatives in Wisconsin, where governor Walker and conservative state legislators are seeking this power.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


ideally, but it sounds like they are trying to rectify a republican redistricting move obviously intended to eliminate democratic voters from the district.

or .. this would certainly explain it:

xenon13 wrote:
These cities were just created as part of a scheme to carve out a mostly-white county out of Fultton and DeKalb Counties (they plan to call the new county Milton County). The purpose of this is to not have to pay for Atlanta public transit and for other such things thus forcing massive service cuts and tax rises for the heavily black areas. The plaintiffs maintain that the law was not properly followed in carrying out this scheme and that it is motivated by racism and civil rights denial.


I've actually come to agree with you and xenon now that I know the full story.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



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15 Apr 2011, 12:58 am

Or it's more of an attempt to undo the jerrymandering the Democrats did.



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15 Apr 2011, 1:07 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
katzefrau wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
No one should have the right to dissolve anyone's city or town - not liberals in this case, and not conservatives in Wisconsin, where governor Walker and conservative state legislators are seeking this power.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


ideally, but it sounds like they are trying to rectify a republican redistricting move obviously intended to eliminate democratic voters from the district.

or .. this would certainly explain it:

xenon13 wrote:
These cities were just created as part of a scheme to carve out a mostly-white county out of Fultton and DeKalb Counties (they plan to call the new county Milton County). The purpose of this is to not have to pay for Atlanta public transit and for other such things thus forcing massive service cuts and tax rises for the heavily black areas. The plaintiffs maintain that the law was not properly followed in carrying out this scheme and that it is motivated by racism and civil rights denial.


I've actually come to agree with you and xenon now that I know the full story.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

No civil rights were violated because nobody is entitled to live in districts designed to give power to a given group of people, and their right to vote was not violated. Furthermore, the economic boom the area has enjoyed from incorporation would make it foolish to disband the cities. In fact, it was an old district in that same territory that highlighted the absurdity of the race based gerrymandering and caused it to be struck down by the supreme court.


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DanielF
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15 Apr 2011, 11:35 am

John_Browning wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
katzefrau wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
No one should have the right to dissolve anyone's city or town - not liberals in this case, and not conservatives in Wisconsin, where governor Walker and conservative state legislators are seeking this power.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


ideally, but it sounds like they are trying to rectify a republican redistricting move obviously intended to eliminate democratic voters from the district.

or .. this would certainly explain it:

xenon13 wrote:
These cities were just created as part of a scheme to carve out a mostly-white county out of Fultton and DeKalb Counties (they plan to call the new county Milton County). The purpose of this is to not have to pay for Atlanta public transit and for other such things thus forcing massive service cuts and tax rises for the heavily black areas. The plaintiffs maintain that the law was not properly followed in carrying out this scheme and that it is motivated by racism and civil rights denial.


I've actually come to agree with you and xenon now that I know the full story.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

No civil rights were violated because nobody is entitled to live in districts designed to give power to a given group of people, and their right to vote was not violated. Furthermore, the economic boom the area has enjoyed from incorporation would make it foolish to disband the cities. In fact, it was an old district in that same territory that highlighted the absurdity of the race based gerrymandering and caused it to be struck down by the supreme court.
And that is a very valid reason for not disbanding those cities! :)


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15 Apr 2011, 12:36 pm

DanielF wrote:
John_Browning wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
katzefrau wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
No one should have the right to dissolve anyone's city or town - not liberals in this case, and not conservatives in Wisconsin, where governor Walker and conservative state legislators are seeking this power.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


ideally, but it sounds like they are trying to rectify a republican redistricting move obviously intended to eliminate democratic voters from the district.

or .. this would certainly explain it:

xenon13 wrote:
These cities were just created as part of a scheme to carve out a mostly-white county out of Fultton and DeKalb Counties (they plan to call the new county Milton County). The purpose of this is to not have to pay for Atlanta public transit and for other such things thus forcing massive service cuts and tax rises for the heavily black areas. The plaintiffs maintain that the law was not properly followed in carrying out this scheme and that it is motivated by racism and civil rights denial.


I've actually come to agree with you and xenon now that I know the full story.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

No civil rights were violated because nobody is entitled to live in districts designed to give power to a given group of people, and their right to vote was not violated. Furthermore, the economic boom the area has enjoyed from incorporation would make it foolish to disband the cities. In fact, it was an old district in that same territory that highlighted the absurdity of the race based gerrymandering and caused it to be struck down by the supreme court.
And that is a very valid reason for not disbanding those cities! :)


In other words the real reason is the Democrats want to stall the redistricting until they can hopefully regain power and then jerrymander the districts even more to prevent the voice of the people being heard.



Kraichgauer
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15 Apr 2011, 12:56 pm

Inuyasha wrote:
DanielF wrote:
John_Browning wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
katzefrau wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
No one should have the right to dissolve anyone's city or town - not liberals in this case, and not conservatives in Wisconsin, where governor Walker and conservative state legislators are seeking this power.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


ideally, but it sounds like they are trying to rectify a republican redistricting move obviously intended to eliminate democratic voters from the district.

or .. this would certainly explain it:

xenon13 wrote:
These cities were just created as part of a scheme to carve out a mostly-white county out of Fultton and DeKalb Counties (they plan to call the new county Milton County). The purpose of this is to not have to pay for Atlanta public transit and for other such things thus forcing massive service cuts and tax rises for the heavily black areas. The plaintiffs maintain that the law was not properly followed in carrying out this scheme and that it is motivated by racism and civil rights denial.


I've actually come to agree with you and xenon now that I know the full story.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

No civil rights were violated because nobody is entitled to live in districts designed to give power to a given group of people, and their right to vote was not violated. Furthermore, the economic boom the area has enjoyed from incorporation would make it foolish to disband the cities. In fact, it was an old district in that same territory that highlighted the absurdity of the race based gerrymandering and caused it to be struck down by the supreme court.
And that is a very valid reason for not disbanding those cities! :)


In other words the real reason is the Democrats want to stall the redistricting until they can hopefully regain power and then jerrymander the districts even more to prevent the voice of the people being heard.


Black people do have the right to have their voices heard, too.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



katzefrau
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15 Apr 2011, 10:38 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
Inuyasha wrote:
In other words the real reason is the Democrats want to stall the redistricting until they can hopefully regain power and then jerrymander the districts even more to prevent the voice of the people being heard.


Black people do have the right to have their voices heard, too.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


the only true voter disenfranchisement i've ever been aware of has been of voters that are likely democratic. you would never see an attempt to suppress voters in a white / wealthy / conservative area. progressives tend to encourage more people to vote, not make it more difficult for them to do so. but repubs propose things like disallowing college age people to vote, and crank out last minute lists (full of errors) of "felons". the college students are apparently too idealistic. other voters, yes, are too black.


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