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Mistrial declared in CA gay student killing

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visagrunt
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07 Sep 2011, 12:08 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
It's certainly first degree murder to me.


That is very shoddy legal thinking.

Certainly it creates a prima facie case for first-degree murder, but no act is first degree murder until each and every element of the offence is proved to the trier of fact beyond a reasonable doubt.

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And I think even the most bigoted juror in such a case, in this day and age, would understand that voting for acquittal would be an impossibility, as they had the kid dead to rights.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


Voting for acquittal is never an impossibility. It is, at the end of the day, the right of every jury to acquit for whatever reasons it thinks fit.

I respect your outrage, but passion is not a substitute for cogent legal thinking.


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Kraichgauer
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07 Sep 2011, 2:25 pm

visagrunt wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
It's certainly first degree murder to me.


That is very shoddy legal thinking.

Certainly it creates a prima facie case for first-degree murder, but no act is first degree murder until each and every element of the offence is proved to the trier of fact beyond a reasonable doubt.

Quote:
And I think even the most bigoted juror in such a case, in this day and age, would understand that voting for acquittal would be an impossibility, as they had the kid dead to rights.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


Voting for acquittal is never an impossibility. It is, at the end of the day, the right of every jury to acquit for whatever reasons it thinks fit.

I respect your outrage, but passion is not a substitute for cogent legal thinking.


I'll happily stick with my outrage.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



Sylkat
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07 Sep 2011, 8:13 pm

Hi, everyone, I did do some reading about this case; talk about contradictory views! Of course, when a child is killed there has to be outrage, however, there was so much going on that the school administration was aware of and chose not to deal with. Does anyone else but me find the circumstances and timing of McInerney's father's death extremely questionable? and a teacher giving a 14 year-old-boy a green chiffon strapless cocktail dress? I thought gifts between students and teachers were strictly regulated due to all of the recent molestation incidents. Apparently there was ongoing sexually oriented teasing,or antagonism from King directed to McInerney, but supposedly Administration said that King had the right to express himself. Whether or not he was really flirting, if unwanted heterosexual advances are prohibited and disciplined, so should any harassment be. McInerney still chose to load the gun and take it to school. he chose to shoot a boy whose back was to him. He was never in physical danger, though apparently being deliberately infuriated. He knew what the gunshot would do, he had done target practice with the gun. Acquittal would mean he did not intend to do what he did, did not know what his actions would result, did not know what he was doing (fugue state orDan White's hypoglycemia/ Twinkie defense..'his brain was blitzed from too much sugar, he knew not what he did'). I think that at this point I blame Administration, they allowed this toxic situation to happen and to continue, and they ruined 2 lives. one thing that surprised my to find out is that King's father never believed and still does not, that his son was 'really gay'...he thinks all of the behavior was 'for attention'. what do y'all think about that? sylkat 8O



Kraichgauer
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07 Sep 2011, 10:06 pm

Sylkat wrote:
Hi, everyone, I did do some reading about this case; talk about contradictory views! Of course, when a child is killed there has to be outrage, however, there was so much going on that the school administration was aware of and chose not to deal with. Does anyone else but me find the circumstances and timing of McInerney's father's death extremely questionable? and a teacher giving a 14 year-old-boy a green chiffon strapless cocktail dress? I thought gifts between students and teachers were strictly regulated due to all of the recent molestation incidents. Apparently there was ongoing sexually oriented teasing,or antagonism from King directed to McInerney, but supposedly Administration said that King had the right to express himself. Whether or not he was really flirting, if unwanted heterosexual advances are prohibited and disciplined, so should any harassment be. McInerney still chose to load the gun and take it to school. he chose to shoot a boy whose back was to him. He was never in physical danger, though apparently being deliberately infuriated. He knew what the gunshot would do, he had done target practice with the gun. Acquittal would mean he did not intend to do what he did, did not know what his actions would result, did not know what he was doing (fugue state orDan White's hypoglycemia/ Twinkie defense..'his brain was blitzed from too much sugar, he knew not what he did'). I think that at this point I blame Administration, they allowed this toxic situation to happen and to continue, and they ruined 2 lives. one thing that surprised my to find out is that King's father never believed and still does not, that his son was 'really gay'...he thinks all of the behavior was 'for attention'. what do y'all think about that? sylkat 8O


King's dad was in denial about his son's sexuality.
And while the administration should have told King to cool it, the fact remains, he was the victim here. All he did was make some bigot feel uncomfortable. I'm not going to shed any tears for McInerney because his abusive father had died not long before. He either knew what he did was wrong, which means he should be locked up, or he wasn't in control of himself, which means he should be locked up.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer