Houston voters reject transgender anti-discrimination prop

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Kraichgauer
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07 Nov 2015, 1:32 am

Meistersinger wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Besides, I think every man here has had to use the lady's room if the men's room was out of order, or if there's too long a line and you just can't wait. Does that mean in such emergencies, a man meaning no offense can be arrested?


Yes. It nearly happened to me a few times, even when I explained to the local storm troopers that I just had kidney surgery to remove kidney stones. If it weren't for a friend that was with me at those times, I'd be sitting in the county lockup, even if I had the written diagnosis from the urologist that performed the procedure and shown it to the officer and judge.



What you had to endure was total bullsh*t. I'm sorry you had to go through it.


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Kraichgauer
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07 Nov 2015, 1:42 am

Dillogic wrote:
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No, but seriously, white southerners - and sadly enough, too many northerners - couldn't stand the thought of sharing the same toilet facilities with black Americans, the same way trans persons are regarded today.


You're comparing two things that can only be compared superficially.

One was people of the same species using the gender appropriate facilities, and people were denied solely based on culture/race/color/whatever.

The other is a person of the opposite gender using the facilities without a clear distinction of what is classed as either gender.

Two entirely different things.

The latter is closer to a person using disabled facilities when there's no real distinction out there for what's disabled or not.

By all means, genuine trans should be allowed to use the facilities of their sex, but so far there's little burden of proof regarding that, unlike other disabilities people are born with/acquire.


No, they are both examples of despised minorities whose rights are violated.
And how is someone supposed to prove they are "genuine trans?" Are they supposed to carry with them a note from their psychologist? Again, there is no evidence that trans persons had ever sexually assaulted someone in a restroom. From the Anti-trans campaign, you'd think this proposed law would have made sexual assault in a restroom unprosecutable - this is a blatant lie by the right.
And regarding another poster who claimed trans rights drive a wedge between society and genuine gay rights - no, this is simply expanding civil rights to other marginalized groups who deserve their due.


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08 Nov 2015, 1:57 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
No, they are both examples of despised minorities whose rights are violated.
And how is someone supposed to prove they are "genuine trans?" Are they supposed to carry with them a note from their psychologist? Again, there is no evidence that trans persons had ever sexually assaulted someone in a restroom. From the Anti-trans campaign, you'd think this proposed law would have made sexual assault in a restroom unprosecutable - this is a blatant lie by the right.
And regarding another poster who claimed trans rights drive a wedge between society and genuine gay rights - no, this is simply expanding civil rights to other marginalized groups who deserve their due.


Being born with a different sex is a disability, whereas being born from people that evolved somewhere else on the planet isn't. The latter is entirely prejudice when we're talking about the same sex bathrooms being used, whereas the former needs a burden of proof for it to be genuine (you know, it is a mental disorder, right?). It's prejudice with that if the person is genuinely transgender and they're then barred simply for that reason.

A note? That'd be a good idea. We have "notes" for people that use disabled parking and bathrooms, after all. There's plenty of people that don't look disabled but need to use disability parking.

Perhaps we should just let people park in the disabled space because they think they're disabled, right? Or, we give people a disability pension for the same reason? This is the same thing as letting anyone use a facility simply by them saying they are this or that.

This is the way you go about it that is fair for everyone, not just for one of the two groups.

E: ironically, this way is actually more fair for those with transgenderism. It removes a lot of doubt when people say they have something if there's official documentation.



Kraichgauer
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08 Nov 2015, 2:48 am

Dillogic wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
No, they are both examples of despised minorities whose rights are violated.
And how is someone supposed to prove they are "genuine trans?" Are they supposed to carry with them a note from their psychologist? Again, there is no evidence that trans persons had ever sexually assaulted someone in a restroom. From the Anti-trans campaign, you'd think this proposed law would have made sexual assault in a restroom unprosecutable - this is a blatant lie by the right.
And regarding another poster who claimed trans rights drive a wedge between society and genuine gay rights - no, this is simply expanding civil rights to other marginalized groups who deserve their due.


Being born with a different sex is a disability, whereas being born from people that evolved somewhere else on the planet isn't. The latter is entirely prejudice when we're talking about the same sex bathrooms being used, whereas the former needs a burden of proof for it to be genuine (you know, it is a mental disorder, right?). It's prejudice with that if the person is genuinely transgender and they're then barred simply for that reason.

A note? That'd be a good idea. We have "notes" for people that use disabled parking and bathrooms, after all. There's plenty of people that don't look disabled but need to use disability parking.

Perhaps we should just let people park in the disabled space because they think they're disabled, right? Or, we give people a disability pension for the same reason? This is the same thing as letting anyone use a facility simply by them saying they are this or that.

This is the way you go about it that is fair for everyone, not just for one of the two groups.

E: ironically, this way is actually more fair for those with transgenderism. It removes a lot of doubt when people say they have something if there's official documentation.


Transgender people are mentally ill? No, they aren't even disabled due to being transgender. I have never heard a trans person refer to themselves as disabled (and yes, my wife and I are friends with a transwoman).
Instead of accommodating disabled persons rather than requiring them to prove their disability, for arguments sake, think of the situation where they are just banned outright from public facilities, because they might make others feel uncomfortable. Well, that situation is wrong. Same if that were done to persons of different races.


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08 Nov 2015, 10:08 am

Quote:
Being born with a different sex is a disability, whereas being born from people that evolved somewhere else on the planet isn't. The latter is entirely prejudice when we're talking about the same sex bathrooms being used, whereas the former needs a burden of proof for it to be genuine (you know, it is a mental disorder, right?). It's prejudice with that if the person is genuinely transgender and they're then barred simply for that reason.


What's the bold supposed to mean?


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