Joint Analysis| Bernie's plans will add $21 Trillion of debt

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Why? An economically irresponsible policy is economically irresponsible, regardless of the country in question...


Hugo Chavez was democratically elected president 4 times (1998, 2000, 2006 and 2012) by clear majorities...

Chavez also introduced several policies which are very similar to those proposed by Bernie Sanders:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mission_Sucre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mission_Barrio_Adentro

Realism isn't part of electoral politics, that does not get you elected. Bernie can have a plan that he runs on that adds $21 trillion of debt but good luck passing any of that thru either house of congress. Bernie as president I think would be very ineffective and would be despised by a great deal of the country (maybe even tossed out of office if the economy isn't doing well) since he doesn't have a loyal constituency like Obama does. I don't believe Bernie would win even if he were to get the nomination FWIW, limited demographic appeal and a lot of Bernie's votes are just anti-Hillary votes. In West Virginia; 44% of Bernie supporters were backing Trump against Hillary, 31% for neither, and only 23% for the Democratic nominee. I don't West Virginia was that enthusiastic about Bernie so much as they hated Hillary's guts, now every state isn't West Virginia of course but a significant number of Bernie supporters will not be with Hillary in November. If I were Hillary, I'd be begging Bernie to be my VP because that is the only way she'll be able to generate any excitement. The DNC plan seems to be pinning all their hopes in their election on racial politics instead, Julian Castro will be Hillary's VP guaranteed.

Trump will win because he is running the most positive pro-America campaign, what hope does Hillary offer? She is 30 years of the Washington establishment status quo and people HATE IT! Bernie at least is a pretty far out guy with some ambitious ideas but what is Hillary running on other than "don't vote for the other guy" and the fact that she's a woman? Her "realism" has gotten us into economic ruin and civil wars all over the middle east, we are less safe as a country because of Hillary Clinton, everything she has ever did in her political life was a failure or something egregious. What is the one accomplishment that she is proud of? She is pretending like she didn't have anything to do with her husband's administration(where she liked to fancy herself as a co-president rather than First Lady) The Clinton administration were anti-gay, pro-war, tough on crime, "free" traders that vowed to end welfare as we know it. People try to talk about Trump's inconsistencies but he says what's on his mind while Hillary needs five polls before she opens her mouth about anything. She is not fit or qualified to be president. Bernie at least as far as I know of him doesn't seem to be a totally unethical guy so he is much much preferable towards a legitimate criminal.

I believe that I already stated that the OP article is purely made up propaganda bulls**t. The establishment is lying about Bernie and Trump, and how much they will cost the U.S. if they become president. They are making money hand over fist while America is going through a fresh new wave of homelessness. They don't want either of these two candidates spoiling their gravy train. Duh...

I posted a link to an article showing how they have lied already. The internet is full of political propaganda.

But you haven't provided any evidence as to why the article in the OP is propaganda/BS... Dismissing an estimate without any factual basis is nothing more than hand-waving.

What - specifically - is it that you find unconvincing about the estimate that the plan by Bernie Sanders will increase the US debt by $ 21 Trillion?

What is being underestimated?
What is being overestimated?

I see no proof that the article isn't propaganda. I don't think it would matter anyway. Corporate media isn't trustworthy.

The media calls Bernie a socialist, even though he is a democratic socialist. They do this to him even while directly interviewing him on tv, they don't even try to respect him as a person. Not one ounce of journalistic integrity left in corporate media.



Not that it matters but, it's such a large number it should be obvious to anyone that it is nothing more than fear mongering B.S. .

You people believe the lies all you want. I have seen the truth about Bernie. Nothing anyone can say will ever change that.

I don't know much about this site but, it does show how Bernie as mayor of Burlington, Vermont made it a thriving town.

http://www.thenation.com/article/bernie ... le-future/

I can't find any site showing how Bernie somehow crashed the towns economy and left it in ruins.

And by the way. Treat me like an a**hole again and we won't debate jack s**t ever again.

I guess time will tell in regards to if Bernie is a revolutionary or another cog for the status quo, for a so called 'independent' his voting record in congress has been 90%+ lockstep with Democratic leadership and you don't raise that much money in the Democratic primary without making some promises to lobbyists. If he is who he says he is then he will not assist Hillary Clinton becoming president of the United States, I've never believed he was more than controlled opposition in the rigged scripted DNC primary. Obviously the plan is not going as expect because no matter how much you shove Hillary down our collective throats, the people will vote for the alternative whoever that is be it the first black president in American history as they did in 2008 and now a crusty 75 year old socialist from Vermont or Donald freakin' Trump in 2016. This was supposed to be a coronation for Hillary, she was never the strongest or most qualified candidate in the Democratic party but the Clinton Machine has survived all these years. Joe Biden if there ever was a presidential election in his life that he might of been able to win would of been in 2016, the VP was essentially not allowed to run for president as he was told he would receive no support from the DNC establishment.

I don't feel like him asking you to give evidence for your position was that unreasonable. You said that the original article was not accurate. He just wanted to know why you thought that

Bernie is a progressive, self described democratic socialist. If you mean Bernie is being controlled, then no I wouldn't agree with that. If not, then you believe the DNC is controlling his outcome (not sure how else to put this, it's late here)? I do agree with the primaries being rigged on both sides though. Voter suppression should never be a thing we should see here in America yet it is built right into the primaries. And with new legislation being introduced across America in the last few years, it is going to become more and more common.

Hillary is a weak candidate, but she still has a lot of support from democrats who falsely remember Bill Clinton's presidency as being good. I think Obama won because he was fairly charismatic, and a better speaker than Hillary. The reason Bernie is doing so well is that people are getting to know who he is and his message is resonating with the disenfranchised voters who are sick of establishment candidates. If he had the name recognition of Hillary or Trump, the race would already be over, Sanders would win in a landslide. Because he speaks to the people about the issues they care about, not the political issues that every politician spouts out every election cycle.

Trump and Hillary will both have the Never Hillary, Never Trump crowd voting for the opposition. They are both the least favorable candidate in a presidential race. Trump is about dead even with Hillary in some key states now though, which doesn't bode well for Hillary.



It's the waving hand. I interpret it as him believing that I am stupid. Maybe I'm misinterpreting it, but that's how I see it.

Some recent polls of Sander's supporters ...

-In the West Virginia primary, CBS reports 44% of Sander's supporters will vote for Trump in November [source 1]

-"POLL: 45% of Bernie voters say they’re #NeverHillary, 15% will vote for Trump" [source 2].

sources:
1. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... r-sanders/
2. http://redalertpolitics.com/2016/05/12/ ... ote-trump/

http://www.commondreams.org/views/2016/ ... over-seven



Surprise, surprise. The Urban Institute's current president, The Urban Institute being the author of the analysis in the OP article against Sanders, worked for Bill Clinton and has ties to Hillary's current campaign chair.