Birds Are Vanishing From North America Even More Now

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naturalplastic
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22 Sep 2019, 12:25 pm

Donald Morton wrote:

A measurable portion of bird deaths can be attributed to cats, both ferrel and inconsiderate cat owners who allow their pets to roam outdoors. Cats are skilled hunters and will hunt even when not hungry.

Weve lost 29 percent since 1970. Domestic cats had already been around for centuries before 1970. So unless you're saying that the cat population vaulted after 1970 its not obvious how that relates as a cause.

Donald Morton
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22 Sep 2019, 2:52 pm

naturalplastic wrote:

Donald Morton wrote:

In 2004 there was a conservative estimate feral cat population of over 70 million. Domestic felines have been around for centuries, but not in such numbers. I am not saying that cats are the only or even the main reason for the bird population decrease, only that they are a measurable contributor.

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cyberdad
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22 Sep 2019, 5:40 pm

EzraS wrote:

cyberdad wrote:

EzraS wrote:

So how is a warmer climate decreasing the insect population?

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... tists-warn

I take that means you don't know.

Actually trying to educate you by posting a link since your default position is to mistrust anything I say

cyberdad
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22 Sep 2019, 5:43 pm

Donald Morton wrote:

naturalplastic wrote:

Donald Morton wrote:

Feral animals have always been a problem for native birds (and other native animals/fish) from as early as the 1800s. I think the OP is referring to the sudden decline in bird populations the last couple of decades and the unusual accelerated rate in the last few years.

VegetableMan
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22 Sep 2019, 5:47 pm

Donald Morton wrote:

Cats are skilled hunters and will hunt even when not hungry.

Much like human hunters. I'll bet you every mother f****r wearing a camouflage suit and carrying a rifle has a full stomach -- that probably spills over his belt buckle.

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EzraS
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22 Sep 2019, 7:25 pm

cyberdad wrote:

EzraS wrote:

cyberdad wrote:

EzraS wrote:

So how is a warmer climate decreasing the insect population?

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... tists-warn

I take that means you don't know.

Actually trying to educate you by posting a link since your default position is to mistrust anything I say

Nah, you always have plenty to say in your own words regarding things you know about.

Redpaws
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22 Sep 2019, 8:11 pm

EzraS wrote:

What do birds eat all the cold months there are almost no insects around?

They hunt for dormant insects in the bark and crevices of trees and search for any remaining seeds, nuts and fruit that are still available. Some birds will cache food for future use, and they do so all year round.
And of course some birds (like some owls) go for prey like rodents even in winter

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cyberdad
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23 Sep 2019, 2:13 am

EzraS wrote:

cyberdad wrote:

EzraS wrote:

cyberdad wrote:

EzraS wrote:

So how is a warmer climate decreasing the insect population?

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... tists-warn

I take that means you don't know.

Actually trying to educate you by posting a link since your default position is to mistrust anything I say

Nah, you always have plenty to say in your own words regarding things you know about.

Ecosystems are very complicated and delicate, a shift in temperature impacting on one biome can have something of a butterfly effect on literally all ecosystems globally.

For example the rise in sea temperatures has resulted in release of labile dissolved carbon resulting in acidification of ocean water which kills zooplankton and therefore impacts on fish numbers and hence numbers of coastal birds that feed on fish. A number of pathways are impacting on bird populations everywhere.

cyberdad
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23 Sep 2019, 2:16 am

Redpaws wrote:

EzraS wrote:

What do birds eat all the cold months there are almost no insects around?

A more sophisticated way of saying borers and crawlers....

Owls have an all year round supply of rodents but their food source spikes conveniently in Spring (owls nest and feed chicks) when the rodent population explodes due to new plant growth.

EzraS
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23 Sep 2019, 5:25 am

cyberdad wrote:

EzraS wrote:

cyberdad wrote:

EzraS wrote:

cyberdad wrote:

EzraS wrote:

So how is a warmer climate decreasing the insect population?

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... tists-warn

I take that means you don't know.

Actually trying to educate you by posting a link since your default position is to mistrust anything I say

Nah, you always have plenty to say in your own words regarding things you know about.

But shifting temratures have always been part of the ecosystem. And life is most abundant when the climate is at its warmest seasonally.

Don't sea temperatures rise significantly seasonally anyways? Part of the year one can dive off a boat and swim comfortably in the ocean. The rest of the year one would suffer hypothermia. Doesn't spawning take place when the sea is warm?

Why hasn't there been a significant shortage of seafood? Why haven't prices risen dramatically? Why is a can of tuna still only 99 cents?

What about mosquito repellent, bug zappers and bug spray? Any significant decrease in those markets?

The thing is, those are things one can easily verify. It would make it abundantly obvious to anyone there is a significant shortage of sea life and insects.

With some article written making claims of dramatic reductions in the number of birds, sea creatures and insects, one pretty much has to be a believer. On has to have faith the information is accurate and that the conclusions are correct.

cyberdad
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23 Sep 2019, 4:59 pm

EzraS wrote:

Why hasn't there been a significant shortage of seafood? Why haven't prices risen dramatically? Why is a can of tuna still only 99 cents?

Sea birds predominantly feed on bait fish which directly feed on zooplankton are these are in decline due to climate change. Birds don't feed on larger ocean fish species like Tuna or salmon where seafood prices are maintained due to fish farming which reduces pressure on wild stock (although we know commercial fishing is impacting on wild fish populations).

EzraS
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23 Sep 2019, 5:17 pm

cyberdad wrote:

EzraS wrote:

Why hasn't there been a significant shortage of seafood? Why haven't prices risen dramatically? Why is a can of tuna still only 99 cents?

Currently ocean going fish numbers are in decline but that's more due to commercial fishing.

Sea birds predominantly feed on bait fish which directly feed on zooplankton are these are in decline due to climate change. Birds don't feed on larger ocean fish species like Tuna or salmon where seafood prices are maintained due to fish farming which reduces pressure on wild stock.

Juvenile tuna and salmon eat zooplankton and then go on to eat small fish which eat zooplankton. If there was a shortage of fish due to a shortage of zooplankton, there would be a noticeable shortage of seafood, which there isn't, and there a wide verity of ocean seafood abundantly available. And there's definitely not a shortage of seagulls. I can't go a couple of minutes without seeing or hearing them. If anything they're like an epidemic. Same with bees. If bees are becoming extinct why is there zillions of liters of honey available. If insects in general are becoming extinct why is there such a big market of bug light bulbs, bug zappers, bug repellent and insecticides?

It's a situation where I have to go on faith that such shortages exist.

Last edited by EzraS on 23 Sep 2019, 5:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

cyberdad
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23 Sep 2019, 5:24 pm

Seagulls are opportunistic feeders and will feed on available food sources anywhere on the coast and even inland. Australian silver gulls are even known to fly into desert regions after rain/tides bring water to feed.

Our rubbish tips are swarming with flocks of gulls picking food refuse.

Sweetleaf
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23 Sep 2019, 5:34 pm

Well that can happen when seeds used in agriculture are coated in Monsanto/Bayer pesticides.

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Last edited by Sweetleaf on 23 Sep 2019, 5:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

EzraS
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23 Sep 2019, 5:36 pm

cyberdad wrote:

We don't have rubbish heaps here. The zillions of seagulls here primarily subsist on small fish and other small sea creatures. When I'm at the wharf at night it looks like raindrops are falling on the water. But when I shine my flashlight into the sea water I see it's actually zillions of little fish jumping around. I assume they're going after tiny insects. The same is true of any rivers I'm at at dusk. Fish are jumping all over going after insects. And all the people out fishing are reeling them in.

Why is it that the only thing there is to go by that there is a shortage of any of this stuff are articles on the internet saying so.

kraftiekortie
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23 Sep 2019, 5:43 pm

I don't feel "global warming" is some "liberal conspiracy."

I believe it is happening.

I don't believe it will cause a catastrophe, though.

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