CCP Lied About Covid Virus. Was COVID Created in a Lab?

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magz
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01 Mar 2023, 7:46 am

DeathFlowerKing wrote:
But what baffles me is the fact that not only were so many "experts" here in the West willingly accepting and promoting the CCP's obvious cover-up but anyone who dared to question it was being labeled as a Trump-supporting bigot.

The same reason why East Europeans warning against dangers of Russian imperialism were routinely dismissed as paranoid nationalists.

It's hard to leave the comforts of "end of history" narrative, especially when you have quite a lot of money invested in it.


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DeathFlowerKing
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01 Mar 2023, 7:57 am

magz wrote:
DeathFlowerKing wrote:
But what baffles me is the fact that not only were so many "experts" here in the West willingly accepting and promoting the CCP's obvious cover-up but anyone who dared to question it was being labeled as a Trump-supporting bigot.

The same reason why East Europeans warning against dangers of Russian imperialism were routinely dismissed as paranoid nationalists.

It's hard to leave the comforts of "end of history" narrative, especially when you have quite a lot of money invested in it.


Oh yes you're right, I still remember how right before Russia actually invaded Ukraine our own news was full of headlines basically dismissing those who worried about the invasion saying it would never happen.

And now here we are...

I think of that now every time I read any news headlines dismissing anything about the tension between the US and China or the idea of my country having another civil war in the future. :|



magz
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01 Mar 2023, 8:02 am

I think it's really hard to be realistic about dangers - not to dismiss them and not to overestimate them. In public discourse, all dangers tend to be overblown by some and dismissed by others - from global warming to covid to economical risks, to international tensions and intranational conflicts...

Humans suck at being realistic about dangers.


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DeathFlowerKing
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01 Mar 2023, 8:07 am

Well when and if the US has that new civil war that people are increasingly talking about, I'm going to have to fight the urge to tell people "I told you so!" :P



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01 Mar 2023, 3:12 pm

Fnord wrote:
Did the claim also cite the “Grassy Knoll” aspect?


No. 8)

Are you still maintaining that a lab leak isn't even a POSSIBILITY?



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01 Mar 2023, 3:13 pm

Kitty4670 wrote:
I heard stories about them lying.


The CCP has NO credibility.
No AUTHORITARIAN government has.



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01 Mar 2023, 3:21 pm

catto_catto wrote:
I think this is more of an "infected lab animal got sold to wet market" kind of fked up than a man-made bioweapon accident kind of fked up(like those USSR lab accidents). Let's be real here, COVID sucks from a weapon perspective, what kind of bioweapons only has a 1-2% of death rate?? Even SARS can do better than that.


The evidence doesn't support this.

There are an estimated 6.8 million fatalities to date.
It virtually shut down the entire world for at least 2 years.
It was an economic disaster that we have not seen for decades.

To me, it is an effective biological weapon.
I wonder what the next biological weapon will look like.
Perhaps fauci can give us an idea.



magz
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01 Mar 2023, 3:23 pm

With all respect - covid sucks as a possible biological weapon.
The very idea of any weapon is to harm your enemies without harming yourself.
Easily transmittable and usually mild diseases that often spread undetected but 1-2% turn out deadly are extremely poor for this purpose.


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01 Mar 2023, 3:30 pm

magz wrote:
Pepe, I believe you remember I stated this many times:

Covid would be awful as a bioweapon and I don't think the Chinese are that dumb.
However, cutting-edge regular virology with insufficient safety measures can't be ruled out. Both cutting-edge science and insufficient safety are known to exist in China in massive amounts. Something could leak outside, then all the natural processes started. And then the state trying to cover it up to avoid legal consequences and a blow to their prestige, basically destroing all they invested into their position in the world of science and that's a lot.

This is my position on the "covid might have escaped from a lab" suspicion and I haven't seen convincing evidence against it so far.


We will have to agree to disagree.

The military was involved in the bio-lab, based on credible investigative reporters such as Sharri Markson.
Why wouldn't it be in an authoritarian government?

The initial position, that the virus leak was absolutely not possible, is now considered possible and even probable.
Klearly, those rejecting the POSSIBILITY were wrong.
Klearly, many opinions denying the possibility were the result of political interference.
Politics is STILL in play today, imo.



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01 Mar 2023, 3:35 pm

magz wrote:
With all respect - covid sucks as a possible biological weapon.
The very idea of any weapon is to harm your enemies without harming yourself.
Easily transmittable and usually mild diseases that often spread undetected but 1-2% turn out deadly are extremely poor for this purpose.


This is a secondary discussion.
I explained why I considered it a POSSIBLE bio-weapon, above.

Getting back on topic, I have little doubt that the virus leak was an accident.
Interestingly, Trump believes the same.

Did I say "Trump"? :eew:
I need to wash my mouth out. :mrgreen:



magz
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01 Mar 2023, 4:02 pm

Well, if covid was intended as a bioweapon, it clearly sucks.
I still find regular research a more probable option because up to 2020, Chinese scientists were accelerating in every area, including mine. Do you know I was invited to a conference in physics that was going to take place in Wuhan in Spring 2020?
I expect them to have had plenty of research of all kinds in this city, the vast majority of it being entirely regular research.


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01 Mar 2023, 9:43 pm

Fnord wrote:
Did the claim also cite the “Grassy Knoll” aspect?
I was skeptical at first, but the "COVID created in a lab" theory now seems to bear up under heavier scrutiny than the "COVID arose from boiled bat soup" theory.

We may never know for certain, of course.
:shrug:



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01 Mar 2023, 9:59 pm

Fnord wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Did the claim also cite the “Grassy Knoll” aspect?
I was skeptical at first, but the "COVID created in a lab" theory now seems to bear up under heavier scrutiny than the "COVID arose from boiled bat soup" theory.

We may never know for certain, of course.
:shrug:


:thumright:



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01 Mar 2023, 10:04 pm

magz wrote:
Well, if covid was intended as a bioweapon, it clearly sucks.
I still find regular research a more probable option because up to 2020, Chinese scientists were accelerating in every area, including mine. Do you know I was invited to a conference in physics that was going to take place in Wuhan in Spring 2020?
I expect them to have had plenty of research of all kinds in this city, the vast majority of it being entirely regular research.


Assuming the virus was man/woman made:
The virus was designed to SPECIFICALLY infect HUMANS.
Add to this a more lethal variation sometime down the line.

Professor Skunk has spoken. 8)

fauci, you bastardo... :evil:



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01 Mar 2023, 10:15 pm

[opinion=mine]

I believe that Dr. Fauci was caught between "the devil and the deep blue sea", and is now being made everybody's scapegoat.

[/opinion]



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02 Mar 2023, 12:11 am

If it was a biowopen it did not suck. It shut down a lot of the world. In the U.S. it exacerbated political divisions and helped undercut America's belief in its scientists. Such things as quiet quitting are an indication that the work ethic that made America the economic powerhouse it is took a hit.

My problem is with all these "it was a lab leak" people doing a victory dance, bragging they were right all along about how evil the CCP is, scolding those wet market theorists who shamed, dismissed, and othered them is that they are doing almost the same damn thing about the possibility it was a deliberately released bioweapon.

The CCP is evil, but that evil? No, No, No. Obviously, the CCP intentionally doing something that would hurt their own people to such a degree would be depraved to the extreme. There is CCP precident. Does the cultural revolution ring a bell? That was half a century ago you say. What about the Uyghurs?


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