Trump's impeachment

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26 Dec 2019, 3:49 pm

In New York State, if you are found "not guilty" at trial, it has the same effect as if you were found "innocent."

You were found "innocent" in New York State, in effect, if you are acquitted at trial.

If Trump is found to be "not guilty" at the impeachment trial in the Senate, this means that he will stay in office and be eligible to run in 2020.

But...once he leaves office, he is subject to indictments by both state and Federal jurisdictions.

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26 Dec 2019, 5:05 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:

Unless his lawyers can cleverly argue that jeopardy attached at the senate trial,we have a very conservative supreme court,he could pull it off.I personally don't know enough about the law to say whether such an argument in valid,we are in unchartered waters,no president have been charged with a crime after an impeachment.

It could be sucessfully argued that jeopardy did attach at the senate trial,I would be curious what Alan Dershowitz would have to say on this.

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kraftiekortie
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26 Dec 2019, 5:07 pm

He is being investigated for various crimes in NY State that have nothing to do what's going on federally.

He can't claim double-jeopardy whatsoever here. He'd have no chance.

He wouldn't be able to "pardon himself." The only possible pardon would be performed by the Governor of New York, who happens to dislike Trump intensely.

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29 Dec 2019, 1:32 pm

I read something recently that I never would have thought of regarding Pelosi's very possible motivation for not sending the articles of impeachment to the senate and it was a "lightbulb" moment for me after reading it:

If Ruth Bader Ginsburg dies or steps down as a Supreme Court Justice, the Supreme court will tip conservative for a generation. There are conflicting reports of her health, from her being perfectly fine at present to her possibly succumbing to cancer at any moment. It's impossible for the public to know her actual condition.

A very credible theory in my opinion is that Pelosi is holding the articles because if RBG dies, then Pelosi can make the politically motivated move of saying that a president going through an impeachment can't or shouldn't be able to fill a Supreme Court vacancy.

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29 Dec 2019, 10:55 pm

Magna wrote:

Possible, but I bet it’s just an interesting coincidence.. especially since I dunno how well that would go over - it there’s anything that says he can’t appoint a judge in that situation. You’d think if the Supreme Court justices were Pelosi’s angle that she’d move swiftly while RBG is still alive to work in her favour.

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29 Dec 2019, 10:57 pm

Until he’s convicted, Trump has full executive powers.

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29 Dec 2019, 11:39 pm

goldfish21 wrote:

Magna wrote:

Move swiftly in sending the articles of impeachment to the senate, you mean? No. The likelihood that a senate trial would end in a conviction is basically nil. For all intents and purposes, it's dead once it hits the senate.

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29 Dec 2019, 11:45 pm

24 non-Democrats would have to vote for conviction, as well as all Democrats.

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30 Dec 2019, 12:07 am

So what is Pelosi up to?

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30 Dec 2019, 12:33 am

EzraS wrote:

So what is Pelosi up to?

Pelosi's son should be worried, every bit as much as Hunter Biden. In my opinion there are quite a few who are guilty of being 'on the take' from Ukraine. They use their family members to be paid by other countries, launder the money.

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31 Dec 2019, 8:56 am

Lol Now there’s email evidence that pompeo, mulvaney, and esper has a meeting with trump and advised him to release the aid money because withholding it was bad/wrong & he knowingly did it anyways. This is awesome. Even more ironclad proof that this guy knew what he was doing was wrong And that he did it despite his top officials and advisers telling him he shouldn’t.

How much more evidence does there need to be for republicans to take their blinders off? Answer should be zero.. but I’m hoping for 4+ more witnesses.

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31 Dec 2019, 9:03 am

We have to find corroborating evidence of wrongdoing in multiple context...plus evidence that he is unfit to be President.

The only option might be if someone finds evidence of his unfitness, and makes use of the 25th Amendment.

24 non-Democrats are not going to vote for conviction.

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31 Dec 2019, 9:07 am

This is playing out like the scandals involving paedophile priests -- Donald Trump is obviously guilty of heinous crimes which he tries to either justify or deny, and his loyal supporters are either scrambling to silence or discredit the victims and witnesses. I hope it ends soon, with a new POTUS and a better future.

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31 Dec 2019, 9:10 am

kraftiekortie wrote:

There’s a Psychiatrist from Yale who keeps saying over and over that trump has lost his marbles and is unfit for office. No one is listening to her - Democrats included.

The rest of the world thinks he’s nuts and Americans are fools for keeping him as their representative. Makes no sense to anyone, from a mental health perspective.. but we all understand that certain greedy interests are getting what they want under trump, and certain “special interest groups,” in proverbial white hoods are also getting what they want.

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31 Dec 2019, 9:12 am

goldfish21 wrote:

There’s a Psychiatrist from Yale who keeps saying over and over that trump has lost his marbles and is unfit for office. No one is listening to her ...

I'm listening ... the behaviors exhibited by Mr. Trump are similar to symptoms observed in persons suffering from dementia. While no specific diagnosis can be definitively made or ruled out (especially by an untrained amateur on a social website), the behaviors displayed by Mr. Trump may be explained by one or more degenerative neurocognitive disorders.

Mr. Trump’s communicative abilities appear to be deteriorating. His rambling rants display most (if not all) of these signs of serious mental impairment:

• Confusing fantasy with fact.
• Confusing relatives and generations.
• Failure to recognize long-term friends and associates.
• Forgetting the names of famous people.
• Phonemic paraphasia.
• Semantic paraphasia.
• Slurred speech.
• Tangential speech.

As far as that last one is concerning, Mr. Trump's speech patterns appear even more disordered when you go beyond the sound bite and look at a whole speech. He careens from one thought to the next in a parade of non-sequiturs, frequently interrupting himself in the middle of a sentence to veer into another free association.

kraftiekortie
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31 Dec 2019, 9:39 am

I feel like some “whistleblower” has to come up with tangible evidence of mental instability, and present it to the public.

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