Breaking: Active Shooter(s) In Mandalay Bay Hotel (NSFW)

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Campin_Cat
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04 Oct 2017, 10:01 am

EzraS wrote:
A percentage of 1 out of millions of gun owners go on shooting sprees. Gun laws aren't going to stop someone like that intent on mass murder from comitting it. There will always be tons of military weapons a person can obtain illegally.

Does anyone really think stronger gun laws would have stopped Paddock? With his money and resources? I seriously doubt it.

Personally I don't have a problem with gun laws. But I think it's ridiculous to believe they would prevent this from happening. Or prevent a future occurrence.

Yep, I totally agree with this!




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04 Oct 2017, 10:02 am

B19 wrote:
I have heard tonight a discussion with a professional who has worked in counter-terrorism for years, and he has a very different theory from the default reasons typically given.

He offers the theory that this was no mentally-ill-spree-rampage. It was a rampage, yes, but the rampage was a means to an end, not the overall objective. So what was the overall objective?

In his view, the end goal was a a political one, and the rampage itself was a political act to achieve a political goal beyond the killings. He thinks that Stephen Paddock could have been motivated quite consciously, in the hope that a massacre on this scale would finally force politicians of both sides to stop taking payoffs from the NRA and start acting to rein in the spread of more and more deadly weapons. He was an older man who had watched both liberal and republican representatives enable the proliferation of weaponry throughout his life, and chose a desperate strategy to enact while he still had time. Sprees like Sandy Hook and others like it may have been the last straw, and planning began some time after that, when it became obvious that despite all the words, nothing was going to change.

Outside the box thinking by the counter terrorist expert? Yes. Possible? Yes. Accurate? We will never really know. But it persuades me more than the default mental illness trope has.

Will things change now? Probably not, given the money trail. Politicians on both sides (he said) take NRA bribes.

Well, I think this "professional" needs to start payin' more for his drugs, cuz the cheap ones are obviously fryin' his brain, because this theory is BEYOND silly, IMO----and, anyway, even if this theory IS correct, I feel it still harkens-back to "mentally ill", cuz I just don't see how anyone who savagely kills / injures this many people, could be considered ANYTHING ELSE----ESPECIALLY, if it was for the reason this professional, theorizes!!




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04 Oct 2017, 10:07 am

Just like I thought - Paddock sent the girlfriend away before he did it.

Las Vegas Shooter Sent Girlfriend Marilou Danley Away to Spare Her, Sisters Say.

The Las Vegas gunman bought his girlfriend a ticket to the Philippines and “sent her away” to spare her life, her distraught sisters said Wednesday.

Stephen Paddock bought Marilou Danley “a cheap ticket” to her home country two weeks before he opened fire on a country music concert on the Las Vegas Strip.

Her sisters, who live in Australia, believe she knew nothing of Paddock’s deadly intentions.

“She didn’t even know that she was going to the Philippines, until Steve said ‘Marilou, I found you a cheap ticket to the Philippines,’” one of the sisters, who spoke on condition they not be identified, told NBC’s Australian partner, Channel 7.

“She was sent away," the woman said of Danley, "so that she will not be there to interfere with what he’s planning." She added that with her sister out of the country, Paddock could plan "without interruptions."

“In that sense I thank him for sparing my sister’s life, but that won’t be to compensate the 59 people’s lives," she said.


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04 Oct 2017, 10:18 am

PADDOCK PRESCRIBED VALIUM


Updated October 3, 2017 - 10:15 pm
Stephen Paddock, who killed at least 58 people and wounded hundreds more in Las Vegas on Sunday with high-powered rifles, was prescribed an anti-anxiety drug in June that can lead to aggressive behavior, the Las Vegas Review-Journal has learned.

Records from the Nevada Prescription Monitoring Program obtained Tuesday show Paddock was prescribed 50 10-milligram diazepam tablets by Henderson physician Dr. Steven Winkler on June 21.
A woman who answered the phone at Winkler’s office would not make him available to answer questions and would neither confirm nor deny that Paddock was ever a patient.
Paddock purchased the drug — its brand name is Valium — without insurance at a Walgreens store in Reno on the same day it was prescribed. He was supposed to take one pill a day.
Diazepam is a sedative-hypnotic drug in the class of drugs known as benzodiazepines, which studies have shown can trigger aggressive behavior. Chronic use or abuse of sedatives such as diazepam can also trigger psychotic experiences, according to drugabuse.com.
‘They can become aggressive’
“If somebody has an underlying aggression problem and you sedate them with that drug, they can become aggressive,” said Dr. Mel Pohl, chief medical officer of the Las Vegas Recovery Center. “It can disinhibit an underlying emotional state. … It is much like what happens when you give alcohol to some people … they become aggressive instead of going to sleep.”
Pohl, who spoke to the Review-Journal from the Netherlands, said the effects of the drug also can be magnified by alcohol.
A 2015 study published in World Psychiatry of 960 Finnish adults and teens convicted of homicide showed that their odds of killing were 45 percent higher during time periods when they were on benzodiazepines.
A year earlier, the Australian and New Zealand Journal of Psychiatry published a study titled, “Benzodiazepine Use and Aggressive Behavior.” The authors wrote: “It appears that benzodiazepine use is moderately associated with subsequent aggressive behavior.”


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04 Oct 2017, 10:29 am

Paddock had been stockpiling guns since 1982 and bought 33 of them, mostly rifles, over the past year alone, right up until three days before the attack, Jill Snyder, an agent with the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, told CBS on Wednesday.

Snyder said authorities would not have been notified of the rifle purchases but would have been informed if two or more guns were bought at one time.


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04 Oct 2017, 10:32 am

Regarding benzodiazepines: Well, that certainly seems like another possible explanation.

I'm thinking alot of people (either the person taking them, or the professionals) have no idea what drugs can do to a person----I've said, several times, on here, that Ritalin can make people aggressive (it did ME, anyway), and that that was, quite possibly, at least ONE factor that could've "driven" Adam Lanza.









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04 Oct 2017, 10:35 am

When I was 13, I was given a Ritalin pill. That was the last Ritalin pill I was ever given. It is a stimulant that was (is?) used to treat hyperactivity.



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04 Oct 2017, 10:36 am

nurseangela wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
nurseangela wrote:
It wasn't hard to find. Rallies were held in Nevada and the guy looks like Paddock. See, they don't want this to be political OR terrorism - especially the Democrats. It was assumed by most that only Conservatives listen to country music - even by the Left. I poo-pooed it cause they said that Paddock had no political ties. Since when has the government ever told the truth if it is going to hurt their agenda? This is the biggest mass murder in U.S. history and it could also become the biggest coverup.

I gotta call Ma.


Did you care to read my previous post on the subject?


Yes I did. Then life continued on. See what if this guy did target Conservatives? Why the hell would a Leftist have so many guns?! Do you realize if he was a Conservative, the Left would land all over that since we are all such "gun nuts" and "fanatics". One of their own doing the very stuff the Left is always accusing Conservatives of doing. The Democrats could kiss bye bye any gun control agenda because it wouldn't be the Conservatives who lost their marbles and went on a killing rampage. They are collecting every piece of information they can so then they can pick and choose what information we all get to know.


I have yet to see any news source I watch (CNN, MSNBC) claim they know why he murdered who he did. I haven't heard any of them say only conservatives like country, or that no liberals own guns (the late, great Hunter S. Thompson, and William Burroughs, both raging liberals, were gun nuts).


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04 Oct 2017, 10:44 am

Campin_Cat wrote:
Also, IMO, "no military history" has nothing to do with anything, either----in regard to being a gun enthusiast----cuz, we have several of THOSE, here, as well (I've been into guns / shooting, since I was a little kid----WAAAAAY before I was in the military).


Agreed
There was nothing military or reminiscent of military training about it. He selected a vantage point over a crowded location and made a "fish in a barrel" scenario out of it.


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04 Oct 2017, 10:48 am

Campin_Cat wrote:
Regarding benzodiazepines: Well, that certainly seems like another possible explanation.

I'm thinking alot of people (either the person taking them, or the professionals) have no idea what drugs can do to a person----I've said, several times, on here, that Ritalin can make people aggressive (it did ME, anyway), and that that was, quite possibly, at least ONE factor that could've "driven" Adam Lanza.


I'm thinking there is an underlying problem that led to all this. The valium was taken probably because he was having a hard time dealing with whatever the problem was.

Obviously, the doctor didn't think Paddock needed any other medication other than an anxiety drug. By this I mean that Paddock must not have been showing any signs of being psychotic. However, I am surprised that he would have been prescribed such a potent benzo like valium and such a high dosage. Usually they would give Xanax or klonopin before valium and in a much lower dosage. I bet he's been taking benzos for awhile.


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04 Oct 2017, 10:57 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
nurseangela wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
nurseangela wrote:
It wasn't hard to find. Rallies were held in Nevada and the guy looks like Paddock. See, they don't want this to be political OR terrorism - especially the Democrats. It was assumed by most that only Conservatives listen to country music - even by the Left. I poo-pooed it cause they said that Paddock had no political ties. Since when has the government ever told the truth if it is going to hurt their agenda? This is the biggest mass murder in U.S. history and it could also become the biggest coverup.

I gotta call Ma.


Did you care to read my previous post on the subject?


Yes I did. Then life continued on. See what if this guy did target Conservatives? Why the hell would a Leftist have so many guns?! Do you realize if he was a Conservative, the Left would land all over that since we are all such "gun nuts" and "fanatics". One of their own doing the very stuff the Left is always accusing Conservatives of doing. The Democrats could kiss bye bye any gun control agenda because it wouldn't be the Conservatives who lost their marbles and went on a killing rampage. They are collecting every piece of information they can so then they can pick and choose what information we all get to know.


I have yet to see any news source I watch (CNN, MSNBC) claim they know why he murdered who he did. I haven't heard any of them say only conservatives like country, or that no liberals own guns (the late, great Hunter S. Thompson, and William Burroughs, both raging liberals, were gun nuts).


I told you to listen to several news sources. Again you are only depending on your usual CNN and PMSNBC. No one knows yet why he did it - it's still all speculation. That's why I'm collecting info from several sources and posting it trying to piece it together and I want others to do the same.


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04 Oct 2017, 11:02 am

HOLY HELL!


BREAKING STORE
BREAKING: SHERIFF SAYS LAS VEGAS SHOOTER COULD HAVE BEEN “RADICALIZED”
Authorities admit potential motive for first time

During a live press conference, Clark County Sheriff Joe Lombardo revealed that the Las Vegas gunman, Stephen Paddock, may have been “radicalized” and that authorities were attempting to uncover the source of his radicalization.
“Did this person get radicalized unbeknownst to us? And we want to identify that source,” said Lombardo.
If confirmed, this suggests that there may have been a political motive behind the massacre.


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04 Oct 2017, 11:11 am

OK, I just listened to the tape and radicalization is just a possibility (the way I understood what was said).

Everyone can calm down and smoke 'em if you got 'em. I'm gonna have some extra strong coffee myself and then start on my crappy homework.


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04 Oct 2017, 11:15 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
nurseangela wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
nurseangela wrote:
It wasn't hard to find. Rallies were held in Nevada and the guy looks like Paddock. See, they don't want this to be political OR terrorism - especially the Democrats. It was assumed by most that only Conservatives listen to country music - even by the Left. I poo-pooed it cause they said that Paddock had no political ties. Since when has the government ever told the truth if it is going to hurt their agenda? This is the biggest mass murder in U.S. history and it could also become the biggest coverup.

I gotta call Ma.


Did you care to read my previous post on the subject?


Yes I did. Then life continued on. See what if this guy did target Conservatives? Why the hell would a Leftist have so many guns?! Do you realize if he was a Conservative, the Left would land all over that since we are all such "gun nuts" and "fanatics". One of their own doing the very stuff the Left is always accusing Conservatives of doing. The Democrats could kiss bye bye any gun control agenda because it wouldn't be the Conservatives who lost their marbles and went on a killing rampage. They are collecting every piece of information they can so then they can pick and choose what information we all get to know.


I have yet to see any news source I watch (CNN, MSNBC) claim they know why he murdered who he did. I haven't heard any of them say only conservatives like country, or that no liberals own guns (the late, great Hunter S. Thompson, and William Burroughs, both raging liberals, were gun nuts).

Yup,Hunter liked his guns.
Democrats or "leftists" in rural areas have guns.The majority of democrats who don't own usually reside in urban areas,they never grew up with guns and the only thing they know about them is what they see on the news or experience when getting mugged.So their veiw is different.They never shot cans with their grandpa or saw that a gun is a tool for survival.Hunting game for the table.
Wonder what his tox screen will show when the autopsy is done.Just becuse he was prescribed Valium dosent mean that's all that was in his system.He seemed to be the party time sort,maybe cocaine or other stimulants.


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04 Oct 2017, 11:40 am

Raptor wrote:
Campin_Cat wrote:
Also, IMO, "no military history" has nothing to do with anything, either----in regard to being a gun enthusiast----cuz, we have several of THOSE, here, as well (I've been into guns / shooting, since I was a little kid----WAAAAAY before I was in the military).

Agreed There was nothing military or reminiscent of military training about it. He selected a vantage point over a crowded location and made a "fish in a barrel" scenario out of it.

Yep. More-than-once, I've said "Geez, THAT was smart" ("smart" as in "thoughtful" [put alot of thought into it]), when I've heard-about, yet-another-something that he had included in his planning----I mean, having those cameras outside his hotel-room door, was EXTREMELY smart (well thought-out), IMO.




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04 Oct 2017, 11:42 am

nurseangela wrote:
Campin_Cat wrote:
Regarding benzodiazepines: Well, that certainly seems like another possible explanation.

I'm thinking alot of people (either the person taking them, or the professionals) have no idea what drugs can do to a person----I've said, several times, on here, that Ritalin can make people aggressive (it did ME, anyway), and that that was, quite possibly, at least ONE factor that could've "driven" Adam Lanza.

I'm thinking there is an underlying problem that led to all this. The valium was taken probably because he was having a hard time dealing with whatever the problem was.

Obviously, the doctor didn't think Paddock needed any other medication other than an anxiety drug. By this I mean that Paddock must not have been showing any signs of being psychotic. However, I am surprised that he would have been prescribed such a potent benzo like valium and such a high dosage. Usually they would give Xanax or klonopin before valium and in a much lower dosage. I bet he's been taking benzos for awhile.

Well, firstly, just because this is the only drug we've HEARD-OF that he was taking, doesn't mean that it was the ONLY drug, he was taking----I mean, if nothing else, he could've gotten one (or more drugs) from one doctor, then went to THIS doctor to get the Valium. I can't WAIT, for that autopsy report----the friggin' things take WEEKS, though!!

Secodly, yeah, when you first posted about him taking the Valium, I thought it sounded-like one of two things----that, either he had been taking it, for awhile, or that he had tried some of the others (Xanax, Klonopin), and they didn't agree with his system, or something.





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