Kushner and Comey
Jacoby
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Location: Permanently banned by power tripping mods lol this forum is trash
28 May 2017, 11:17 pm
Kraichgauer wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
If there is smoke where there is fire then the Clintons and Obama belong in prison multiple times over.
Nobody disputes that the Clintons play fast with what's legal, though not to the extent as the right likes to believe. And what proof is there of corruption in the Obama White House? Just because he had overestimated the democratic Arab Spring revolts, and foolishly supplied people within their ranks who were fanatics with weapons, hardly means he belongs in prison.
Nobody denies that now about Clinton's?
Spying on millions of Americans including congress, SCOTUS, celebrities, etc. and using this information for their political ends is pretty criminal. Supplying ISIS and screwing up the whole Middle East(this is after he ran against Bush's foreign policy too) is just a bonus crime on top of everything he did domestically. Obama's ongoing sedition against the Trump administration is bordering on treason as said General Kelly because of this organized network of leakers.
The claim that Obama is somehow directing seditious action against Trump's administration is Trumpanzee fantasy, and National Enquirer headlines.
Funny, you guys on the right had no problem when Bush was spying on people, and certainly had no problem with attempts to thwart Obama's government at every turn.
Not really, it's pretty obvious that Obama administration officials are working to undermine the president and its pretty silly to deny that Obama doesn't know anything about it.
I think Obama and Bush should both go to prison, put them on trial for treason and mass murder.
Bush spied on people but he didn't spy on literally almost everybody and use it the information gathered against his political enemies, that's Nixonian stuff if there ever was. The GOP never attempted to 'thwart' Obama by extralegal means, they simply turned to the voters and our democratic system. Nobody tried to sabotage the Obama administration, his buddy Bush did everything he could to facilitate the peaceful transfer of power which Obama has done none of like a third world dictator who refuses to leave.
28 May 2017, 11:46 pm
I actually hope they don't find anything and he's actually cleared. Pence, being of the same political thought as Trump, could actually get things done because he knows how politics and thus government operate. Trump can't adapt, he'll continue to derail his own agenda with self created distractions if kept in power. Not to mention drive opposition passion for the upcoming mid-term. Long live president chump, at least for another 3.5 years.
Kraichgauer
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Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,190
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
29 May 2017, 12:16 am
Jacoby wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
If there is smoke where there is fire then the Clintons and Obama belong in prison multiple times over.
Nobody disputes that the Clintons play fast with what's legal, though not to the extent as the right likes to believe. And what proof is there of corruption in the Obama White House? Just because he had overestimated the democratic Arab Spring revolts, and foolishly supplied people within their ranks who were fanatics with weapons, hardly means he belongs in prison.
Nobody denies that now about Clinton's?
Spying on millions of Americans including congress, SCOTUS, celebrities, etc. and using this information for their political ends is pretty criminal. Supplying ISIS and screwing up the whole Middle East(this is after he ran against Bush's foreign policy too) is just a bonus crime on top of everything he did domestically. Obama's ongoing sedition against the Trump administration is bordering on treason as said General Kelly because of this organized network of leakers.
The claim that Obama is somehow directing seditious action against Trump's administration is Trumpanzee fantasy, and National Enquirer headlines.
Funny, you guys on the right had no problem when Bush was spying on people, and certainly had no problem with attempts to thwart Obama's government at every turn.
Not really, it's pretty obvious that Obama administration officials are working to undermine the president and its pretty silly to deny that Obama doesn't know anything about it.
I think Obama and Bush should both go to prison, put them on trial for treason and mass murder.
Bush spied on people but he didn't spy on literally almost everybody and use it the information gathered against his political enemies, that's Nixonian stuff if there ever was. The GOP never attempted to 'thwart' Obama by extralegal means, they simply turned to the voters and our democratic system. Nobody tried to sabotage the Obama administration, his buddy Bush did everything he could to facilitate the peaceful transfer of power which Obama has done none of like a third world dictator who refuses to leave.
Again, all that talk about Obama plotting against Trump is paranoid fantasy. Obama is having fun wind surfing, and enjoying his freedom from eight years of hell.
And seriously, what hard evidence is there of Obama acting against the current White House? Show me legitimate connections, as Kushner and Flynn meeting with Russian intelligence agents.
_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
Kraichgauer
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Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,190
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
29 May 2017, 12:18 am
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
If there's nothing to the Trump/Russia story, why didn't Trump come clean in the first place that his people were secretly talking to Putin's agent? His denials, despite clear evidence that Kushner, Flynn, and others had had these meetings with the Russians suggests there's something there.
That's still just conjecture and accusation based on circumstance. It's something suggestive rather than anything of substance. Which has always been the pattern of this thing.
Round and round it goes like a dog chasing its tail.
To be clear, I'm not defending Trump. He can spend the rest of his life in a federal prison for all I care. I'm just pointing out the fact that there's nothing there for him to get convicted of or impeached over. Nothing. That's just reality.
Where there's smoke, there's usually fire, and Trump and company are going out of their way to deny there's any smoke. The investigation isn't done with yet, and incriminating evidence may still be found.
In the meantime the Washington Post et al will keep shouting "fire fire!" as more and more people get tired of making rebuttals to virtually the same thing over and over and continue losing interest.
In the end if nothing comes out of all this, my guess is that it will be viewed as nothing more than a witch hunt against both Trump and Co and Russia. And therefore will probably end up generating support for them.
And what will you do if the evidence against Trump is proven undeniable? And why such an eagerness to defend Russia, even at America's expense?
_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
29 May 2017, 12:57 am
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
If there's nothing to the Trump/Russia story, why didn't Trump come clean in the first place that his people were secretly talking to Putin's agent? His denials, despite clear evidence that Kushner, Flynn, and others had had these meetings with the Russians suggests there's something there.
That's still just conjecture and accusation based on circumstance. It's something suggestive rather than anything of substance. Which has always been the pattern of this thing.
Round and round it goes like a dog chasing its tail.
To be clear, I'm not defending Trump. He can spend the rest of his life in a federal prison for all I care. I'm just pointing out the fact that there's nothing there for him to get convicted of or impeached over. Nothing. That's just reality.
Where there's smoke, there's usually fire, and Trump and company are going out of their way to deny there's any smoke. The investigation isn't done with yet, and incriminating evidence may still be found.
In the meantime the Washington Post et al will keep shouting "fire fire!" as more and more people get tired of making rebuttals to virtually the same thing over and over and continue losing interest.
In the end if nothing comes out of all this, my guess is that it will be viewed as nothing more than a witch hunt against both Trump and Co and Russia. And therefore will probably end up generating support for them.
And what will you do if the evidence against Trump is proven undeniable? And why such an eagerness to defend Russia, even at America's expense?
I have no emotional investment in this or preoccupation over it. I will say throw the book at him, lock him up, hang him from the highest yardarm, what's for dinner?
When have I defended Russia, much less eagerly? You're confusing my lack of worry, panic, paranoia and the like as some sort of endorsement. I'm simply not hysterical over Russia, that is all.
My lacking Trump derangement syndrome or Putin/Russia derangement syndrome, doesn't mean I'm a fan of either. Just because someone isn't hysterical over something, doesn't mean it entirely meets with their approval.
Kraichgauer
Veteran
Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,190
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
29 May 2017, 1:15 am
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
If there's nothing to the Trump/Russia story, why didn't Trump come clean in the first place that his people were secretly talking to Putin's agent? His denials, despite clear evidence that Kushner, Flynn, and others had had these meetings with the Russians suggests there's something there.
That's still just conjecture and accusation based on circumstance. It's something suggestive rather than anything of substance. Which has always been the pattern of this thing.
Round and round it goes like a dog chasing its tail.
To be clear, I'm not defending Trump. He can spend the rest of his life in a federal prison for all I care. I'm just pointing out the fact that there's nothing there for him to get convicted of or impeached over. Nothing. That's just reality.
Where there's smoke, there's usually fire, and Trump and company are going out of their way to deny there's any smoke. The investigation isn't done with yet, and incriminating evidence may still be found.
In the meantime the Washington Post et al will keep shouting "fire fire!" as more and more people get tired of making rebuttals to virtually the same thing over and over and continue losing interest.
In the end if nothing comes out of all this, my guess is that it will be viewed as nothing more than a witch hunt against both Trump and Co and Russia. And therefore will probably end up generating support for them.
And what will you do if the evidence against Trump is proven undeniable? And why such an eagerness to defend Russia, even at America's expense?
I have no emotional investment in this or preoccupation over it. I will say throw the book at him, lock him up, hang him from the highest yardarm, what's for dinner?
When have I defended Russia, much less eagerly? You're confusing my lack of worry, panic, paranoia and the like as some sort of endorsement. I'm simply not hysterical over Russia, that is all.
My lacking Trump derangement syndrome or Putin/Russia derangement syndrome, doesn't mean I'm a fan of either. Just because someone isn't hysterical over something, doesn't mean it entirely meets with their approval.
Expatriate, German artist, and naturalized American citizen, George Gross, had warned people in the 30s that Nazi Germany was a threat to not just freedom, but civilization, but he was called a left wing alarmist - - till it was almost too late. I think we would ignore Russia at our own peril.
_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
29 May 2017, 1:27 am
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
If there's nothing to the Trump/Russia story, why didn't Trump come clean in the first place that his people were secretly talking to Putin's agent? His denials, despite clear evidence that Kushner, Flynn, and others had had these meetings with the Russians suggests there's something there.
That's still just conjecture and accusation based on circumstance. It's something suggestive rather than anything of substance. Which has always been the pattern of this thing.
Round and round it goes like a dog chasing its tail.
To be clear, I'm not defending Trump. He can spend the rest of his life in a federal prison for all I care. I'm just pointing out the fact that there's nothing there for him to get convicted of or impeached over. Nothing. That's just reality.
Where there's smoke, there's usually fire, and Trump and company are going out of their way to deny there's any smoke. The investigation isn't done with yet, and incriminating evidence may still be found.
In the meantime the Washington Post et al will keep shouting "fire fire!" as more and more people get tired of making rebuttals to virtually the same thing over and over and continue losing interest.
In the end if nothing comes out of all this, my guess is that it will be viewed as nothing more than a witch hunt against both Trump and Co and Russia. And therefore will probably end up generating support for them.
And what will you do if the evidence against Trump is proven undeniable? And why such an eagerness to defend Russia, even at America's expense?
I have no emotional investment in this or preoccupation over it. I will say throw the book at him, lock him up, hang him from the highest yardarm, what's for dinner?
When have I defended Russia, much less eagerly? You're confusing my lack of worry, panic, paranoia and the like as some sort of endorsement. I'm simply not hysterical over Russia, that is all.
My lacking Trump derangement syndrome or Putin/Russia derangement syndrome, doesn't mean I'm a fan of either. Just because someone isn't hysterical over something, doesn't mean it entirely meets with their approval.
Expatriate, German artist, and naturalized American citizen, George Gross, had warned people in the 30s that Nazi Germany was a threat to not just freedom, but civilization, but he was called a left wing alarmist - - till it was almost too late. I think we would ignore Russia at our own peril.
Instead of one George Gross, there have been hundreds of people proclaiming "look it's Nazi Germany again!" "Look there's the next Hitler!" year after year, decade after decade over and over and over and over and over again and again and again.
However not being paranoid and hysterical over Russia, doesn't equal ignoring Russia or defending Russia or being in love with Russia or even particularly trusting Russia.
There is a middle ground.
Last edited by EzraS on 29 May 2017, 1:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
Kraichgauer
Veteran
Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,190
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
29 May 2017, 1:36 am
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
If there's nothing to the Trump/Russia story, why didn't Trump come clean in the first place that his people were secretly talking to Putin's agent? His denials, despite clear evidence that Kushner, Flynn, and others had had these meetings with the Russians suggests there's something there.
That's still just conjecture and accusation based on circumstance. It's something suggestive rather than anything of substance. Which has always been the pattern of this thing.
Round and round it goes like a dog chasing its tail.
To be clear, I'm not defending Trump. He can spend the rest of his life in a federal prison for all I care. I'm just pointing out the fact that there's nothing there for him to get convicted of or impeached over. Nothing. That's just reality.
Where there's smoke, there's usually fire, and Trump and company are going out of their way to deny there's any smoke. The investigation isn't done with yet, and incriminating evidence may still be found.
In the meantime the Washington Post et al will keep shouting "fire fire!" as more and more people get tired of making rebuttals to virtually the same thing over and over and continue losing interest.
In the end if nothing comes out of all this, my guess is that it will be viewed as nothing more than a witch hunt against both Trump and Co and Russia. And therefore will probably end up generating support for them.
And what will you do if the evidence against Trump is proven undeniable? And why such an eagerness to defend Russia, even at America's expense?
I have no emotional investment in this or preoccupation over it. I will say throw the book at him, lock him up, hang him from the highest yardarm, what's for dinner?
When have I defended Russia, much less eagerly? You're confusing my lack of worry, panic, paranoia and the like as some sort of endorsement. I'm simply not hysterical over Russia, that is all.
My lacking Trump derangement syndrome or Putin/Russia derangement syndrome, doesn't mean I'm a fan of either. Just because someone isn't hysterical over something, doesn't mean it entirely meets with their approval.
Expatriate, German artist, and naturalized American citizen, George Gross, had warned people in the 30s that Nazi Germany was a threat to not just freedom, but civilization, but he was called a left wing alarmist - - till it was almost too late. I think we would ignore Russia at our own peril.
Ah back to the 500 trillionth Nazi Germany/Hitler analogies. Has no one ever heard the story of the boy who cried wolf, much less understood it?
Instead of one George Gross, there have been hundreds of people proclaiming "look it's Nazi Germany again!" "Look there's the next Hitler!" year after year, decade after decade over and over and over and over and over again and again and again.
Nazi Germany is just an example I was using. But that doesn't mean Russia isn't a threat that should be underestimated.
George Gross, by the way, was a first rate artist, and a first rate American citizen, though he came to this country as an adult.
_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
29 May 2017, 1:59 am
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
If there's nothing to the Trump/Russia story, why didn't Trump come clean in the first place that his people were secretly talking to Putin's agent? His denials, despite clear evidence that Kushner, Flynn, and others had had these meetings with the Russians suggests there's something there.
That's still just conjecture and accusation based on circumstance. It's something suggestive rather than anything of substance. Which has always been the pattern of this thing.
Round and round it goes like a dog chasing its tail.
To be clear, I'm not defending Trump. He can spend the rest of his life in a federal prison for all I care. I'm just pointing out the fact that there's nothing there for him to get convicted of or impeached over. Nothing. That's just reality.
Where there's smoke, there's usually fire, and Trump and company are going out of their way to deny there's any smoke. The investigation isn't done with yet, and incriminating evidence may still be found.
In the meantime the Washington Post et al will keep shouting "fire fire!" as more and more people get tired of making rebuttals to virtually the same thing over and over and continue losing interest.
In the end if nothing comes out of all this, my guess is that it will be viewed as nothing more than a witch hunt against both Trump and Co and Russia. And therefore will probably end up generating support for them.
And what will you do if the evidence against Trump is proven undeniable? And why such an eagerness to defend Russia, even at America's expense?
I have no emotional investment in this or preoccupation over it. I will say throw the book at him, lock him up, hang him from the highest yardarm, what's for dinner?
When have I defended Russia, much less eagerly? You're confusing my lack of worry, panic, paranoia and the like as some sort of endorsement. I'm simply not hysterical over Russia, that is all.
My lacking Trump derangement syndrome or Putin/Russia derangement syndrome, doesn't mean I'm a fan of either. Just because someone isn't hysterical over something, doesn't mean it entirely meets with their approval.
Expatriate, German artist, and naturalized American citizen, George Gross, had warned people in the 30s that Nazi Germany was a threat to not just freedom, but civilization, but he was called a left wing alarmist - - till it was almost too late. I think we would ignore Russia at our own peril.
Ah back to the 500 trillionth Nazi Germany/Hitler analogies. Has no one ever heard the story of the boy who cried wolf, much less understood it?
Instead of one George Gross, there have been hundreds of people proclaiming "look it's Nazi Germany again!" "Look there's the next Hitler!" year after year, decade after decade over and over and over and over and over again and again and again.
Nazi Germany is just an example I was using. But that doesn't mean Russia isn't a threat that should be underestimated.
Nor should it be overestimated or overexaggerated or overdramatized.
androbot01
Veteran
Joined: 17 Sep 2014
Age: 54
Gender: Female
Posts: 6,746
Location: Kingston, Ontario, Canada
29 May 2017, 4:59 am
Aristophanes wrote:
I actually hope they don't find anything and he's actually cleared. Pence, being of the same political thought as Trump, could actually get things done because he knows how politics and thus government operate. Trump can't adapt, he'll continue to derail his own agenda with self created distractions if kept in power. Not to mention drive opposition passion for the upcoming mid-term. Long live president chump, at least for another 3.5 years.
Yes Pence would certainly be more effective at getting things done ... making the world a better place by viewing women as reproductive machines. He makes me sick. He won't even be alone with a woman because he can't trust himself.
What concerns me about Trump is not the damage to U.S. policy. The elevation of a such a buffoon to the position of U.S. President tells me that the U.S. is in decline. This scares me because the U.S. has always been a leader of Western values, and this is no longer the case.
Merkel has said that Europe is on their own after Trump's trip. I think his scolding of the institution's members for past dues in front of the 911 statue said it all.
Now I see that North Korea has landed a missile in Japanese waters. Great.
And Ezra, ... hysterical, paranoid, deranged ... I get it. You don't think there's anything to the "Russian Connection," but enough with the ad hominems already.
Kraichgauer
Veteran
Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,190
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
29 May 2017, 5:04 am
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
If there's nothing to the Trump/Russia story, why didn't Trump come clean in the first place that his people were secretly talking to Putin's agent? His denials, despite clear evidence that Kushner, Flynn, and others had had these meetings with the Russians suggests there's something there.
That's still just conjecture and accusation based on circumstance. It's something suggestive rather than anything of substance. Which has always been the pattern of this thing.
Round and round it goes like a dog chasing its tail.
To be clear, I'm not defending Trump. He can spend the rest of his life in a federal prison for all I care. I'm just pointing out the fact that there's nothing there for him to get convicted of or impeached over. Nothing. That's just reality.
Where there's smoke, there's usually fire, and Trump and company are going out of their way to deny there's any smoke. The investigation isn't done with yet, and incriminating evidence may still be found.
In the meantime the Washington Post et al will keep shouting "fire fire!" as more and more people get tired of making rebuttals to virtually the same thing over and over and continue losing interest.
In the end if nothing comes out of all this, my guess is that it will be viewed as nothing more than a witch hunt against both Trump and Co and Russia. And therefore will probably end up generating support for them.
And what will you do if the evidence against Trump is proven undeniable? And why such an eagerness to defend Russia, even at America's expense?
I have no emotional investment in this or preoccupation over it. I will say throw the book at him, lock him up, hang him from the highest yardarm, what's for dinner?
When have I defended Russia, much less eagerly? You're confusing my lack of worry, panic, paranoia and the like as some sort of endorsement. I'm simply not hysterical over Russia, that is all.
My lacking Trump derangement syndrome or Putin/Russia derangement syndrome, doesn't mean I'm a fan of either. Just because someone isn't hysterical over something, doesn't mean it entirely meets with their approval.
Expatriate, German artist, and naturalized American citizen, George Gross, had warned people in the 30s that Nazi Germany was a threat to not just freedom, but civilization, but he was called a left wing alarmist - - till it was almost too late. I think we would ignore Russia at our own peril.
Ah back to the 500 trillionth Nazi Germany/Hitler analogies. Has no one ever heard the story of the boy who cried wolf, much less understood it?
Instead of one George Gross, there have been hundreds of people proclaiming "look it's Nazi Germany again!" "Look there's the next Hitler!" year after year, decade after decade over and over and over and over and over again and again and again.
Nazi Germany is just an example I was using. But that doesn't mean Russia isn't a threat that should be underestimated.
Nor should it be overestimated or overexaggerated or overdramatized.
When a soulless spy master seeks to rebuild his country's lost stature through deceit and force, especially when he blames the west for his country's lost power and prestige, one can not over exaggerate the threat he presents.
_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
29 May 2017, 7:09 am
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
If there's nothing to the Trump/Russia story, why didn't Trump come clean in the first place that his people were secretly talking to Putin's agent? His denials, despite clear evidence that Kushner, Flynn, and others had had these meetings with the Russians suggests there's something there.
That's still just conjecture and accusation based on circumstance. It's something suggestive rather than anything of substance. Which has always been the pattern of this thing.
Round and round it goes like a dog chasing its tail.
To be clear, I'm not defending Trump. He can spend the rest of his life in a federal prison for all I care. I'm just pointing out the fact that there's nothing there for him to get convicted of or impeached over. Nothing. That's just reality.
Where there's smoke, there's usually fire, and Trump and company are going out of their way to deny there's any smoke. The investigation isn't done with yet, and incriminating evidence may still be found.
In the meantime the Washington Post et al will keep shouting "fire fire!" as more and more people get tired of making rebuttals to virtually the same thing over and over and continue losing interest.
In the end if nothing comes out of all this, my guess is that it will be viewed as nothing more than a witch hunt against both Trump and Co and Russia. And therefore will probably end up generating support for them.
And what will you do if the evidence against Trump is proven undeniable? And why such an eagerness to defend Russia, even at America's expense?
I have no emotional investment in this or preoccupation over it. I will say throw the book at him, lock him up, hang him from the highest yardarm, what's for dinner?
When have I defended Russia, much less eagerly? You're confusing my lack of worry, panic, paranoia and the like as some sort of endorsement. I'm simply not hysterical over Russia, that is all.
My lacking Trump derangement syndrome or Putin/Russia derangement syndrome, doesn't mean I'm a fan of either. Just because someone isn't hysterical over something, doesn't mean it entirely meets with their approval.
Expatriate, German artist, and naturalized American citizen, George Gross, had warned people in the 30s that Nazi Germany was a threat to not just freedom, but civilization, but he was called a left wing alarmist - - till it was almost too late. I think we would ignore Russia at our own peril.
Ah back to the 500 trillionth Nazi Germany/Hitler analogies. Has no one ever heard the story of the boy who cried wolf, much less understood it?
Instead of one George Gross, there have been hundreds of people proclaiming "look it's Nazi Germany again!" "Look there's the next Hitler!" year after year, decade after decade over and over and over and over and over again and again and again.
Nazi Germany is just an example I was using. But that doesn't mean Russia isn't a threat that should be underestimated.
Nor should it be overestimated or overexaggerated or overdramatized.
When a soulless spy master seeks to rebuild his country's lost stature through deceit and force, especially when he blames the west for his country's lost power and prestige, one can not over exaggerate the threat he presents.
Apparently not.
29 May 2017, 7:28 am
androbot01 wrote:
And Ezra, ... hysterical, paranoid, deranged ... I get it. You don't think there's anything to the "Russian Connection," but enough with the ad hominems already.
Ad hominem is Latin for "to the person". My comments regarding mass hysteria et al don't pertain to any specific individual.
And I don't think there isn't anything to the "Russia Connection", I know there isn't anything to the Russia Connection". If there was anything to it, I would be reading about it, instead of the usual daily tabloid tripe that's fodder for the desperate, the hysterical and the obsessed.
Last edited by EzraS on 29 May 2017, 8:22 am, edited 2 times in total.
29 May 2017, 7:53 am
androbot01 wrote:
Aristophanes wrote:
I actually hope they don't find anything and he's actually cleared. Pence, being of the same political thought as Trump, could actually get things done because he knows how politics and thus government operate. Trump can't adapt, he'll continue to derail his own agenda with self created distractions if kept in power. Not to mention drive opposition passion for the upcoming mid-term. Long live president chump, at least for another 3.5 years.
Yes Pence would certainly be more effective at getting things done ... making the world a better place by viewing women as reproductive machines. He makes me sick. He won't even be alone with a woman because he can't trust himself.
What concerns me about Trump is not the damage to U.S. policy. The elevation of a such a buffoon to the position of U.S. President tells me that the U.S. is in decline. This scares me because the U.S. has always been a leader of Western values, and this is no longer the case.
Merkel has said that Europe is on their own after Trump's trip. I think his scolding of the institution's members for past dues in front of the 911 statue said it all.
Now I see that North Korea has landed a missile in Japanese waters. Great.
And Ezra, ... hysterical, paranoid, deranged ... I get it. You don't think there's anything to the "Russian Connection," but enough with the ad hominems already.
The 'past dues' of NATO members isn't even close to accurate, it's one of the ways Trump is trying to manipulate reality. There are no membership fees for NATO and thus no 'past dues', they don't owe money to anyone. NATO members reached an agreement at the Wales summit in 2014 that each individual nation will spend 2% of GDP on their militaries, many countries are below that threshold-- in some cases well behind. The problem is that agreement set a target date of 2024 for those numbers to be hit. As it stands, no nation in NATO is in violation because the target date isn't even close to being reached yet.
NY Times article on the issue
The actual Wales Summit Declaration
edit: The clause in question is point 14 of the second link and states:
Quote:
Allies currently meeting the NATO guideline to spend a minimum of 2% of their Gross Domestic Product (GDP) on defence will aim to continue to do so. Likewise, Allies spending more than 20% of their defence budgets on major equipment, including related Research & Development, will continue to do so.
Allies whose current proportion of GDP spent on defence is below this level will:
halt any decline in defence expenditure;
aim to increase defence expenditure in real terms as GDP grows;
aim to move towards the 2% guideline within a decade with a view to meeting their NATO Capability Targets and filling NATO's capability shortfalls.
Allies whose current proportion of GDP spent on defence is below this level will:
halt any decline in defence expenditure;
aim to increase defence expenditure in real terms as GDP grows;
aim to move towards the 2% guideline within a decade with a view to meeting their NATO Capability Targets and filling NATO's capability shortfalls.
androbot01
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Joined: 17 Sep 2014
Age: 54
Gender: Female
Posts: 6,746
Location: Kingston, Ontario, Canada
29 May 2017, 9:20 am
Aristophanes wrote:
The actual Wales Summit Declaration
edit: The clause in question is point 14 of the second link and states:
edit: The clause in question is point 14 of the second link and states:
Quote:
Allies currently meeting the NATO guideline to spend a minimum of 2% of their Gross Domestic Product (GDP) on defence will aim to continue to do so. Likewise, Allies spending more than 20% of their defence budgets on major equipment, including related Research & Development, will continue to do so.
Allies whose current proportion of GDP spent on defence is below this level will:
halt any decline in defence expenditure;
aim to increase defence expenditure in real terms as GDP grows;
aim to move towards the 2% guideline within a decade with a view to meeting their NATO Capability Targets and filling NATO's capability shortfalls.
Allies whose current proportion of GDP spent on defence is below this level will:
halt any decline in defence expenditure;
aim to increase defence expenditure in real terms as GDP grows;
aim to move towards the 2% guideline within a decade with a view to meeting their NATO Capability Targets and filling NATO's capability shortfalls.
Unbelievable. He makes a national embarrassment of himself and he's not even in the right.
Ezra, ad hominem refers to attacking the holder of the ideas, rather than the ideas themselves. Your descriptions of those holding an opposing view to yourself as desperate, hysterical and obsessed are akin to saying "Your mother is fat." It's the most base and desperate of arguments and your use of it, repeatedly, makes me wonder if you have anything else to contribute.
jrjones9933
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Joined: 13 May 2011
Age: 56
Gender: Male
Posts: 13,144
Location: The end of the northwest passage
29 May 2017, 9:25 am
I've decided that those two simply want to make discussion of the news about DJT and crew as difficult as possible.
_________________
"I find that the best way [to increase self-confidence] is to lie to yourself about who you are, what you've done, and where you're going." - Richard Ayoade
