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[IMPORTANT] Hamas launches foot assault against settlements.

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TwilightPrincess
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15 Oct 2023, 9:05 pm

cyberdad wrote:
TwilightPrincess wrote:

Even more Palestinian children have died at this point. If someone murders your kids, it doesn't justify murdering their kids.

Maybe we have different views when it comes to morality.


You and I have no say in what Israel is deciding to do. I am however, putting myself in Israel's shoes now (I am not talking about past attacks by the IDF on Palestinian terroritories) and really can't see how else they can engage,

I am inviting you to advise the Israeli government and see (hypothetically) if your idea would work in stopping the shelling of Israeli cities or rescue the hostages held by HAMAS.
I didn't realize that opinions in this thread needed to be discussed with the governments involved, especially Israel. Noted.

I'm not sure why people are so intent on there being a clear good and bad guy unless this circles back to tribalism which I mentioned earlier. At this point, they're all bad in my opinion. Retrieving hostages does not justify killing a lot of innocent people or using chemical weapons. Israeli lives aren't worth more than Palestinian lives. Once again, you and I seem to have different views about morality.


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funeralxempire
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15 Oct 2023, 9:10 pm

cyberdad wrote:
I am inviting you to advise the Israeli government and see (hypothetically) if your idea would work in stopping the shelling of Israeli cities or rescue the hostages held by HAMAS.


I would advise them to worry about removing their dick from the hornet's nest, instead of hoping that a few more rounds of fierce pumping will pacify the hornets. No matter what they do they're going to continue to get stung, but only the former path might eventually lead to an end to the stinging.


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cyberdad
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15 Oct 2023, 9:15 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
I am inviting you to advise the Israeli government and see (hypothetically) if your idea would work in stopping the shelling of Israeli cities or rescue the hostages held by HAMAS.


I would advise them to worry about removing their dick from the hornet's nest, instead of hoping that a few more rounds of fierce pumping will pacify the hornets. No matter what they do they're going to continue to get stung, but only the former path might eventually lead to an end to the stinging.


8O



TwilightPrincess
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15 Oct 2023, 9:16 pm

It's the most sensible thing that's been said in this thread yet.


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cyberdad
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15 Oct 2023, 9:17 pm

TwilightPrincess wrote:
Retrieving hostages does not justify killing a lot of innocent people or using chemical weapons. Israeli lives aren't worth more than Palestinian lives. Once again, you and I seem to have different views about morality.


Didn't Israel ask civilians to leave these zones they planned to move into? Of course in the movement of thousands of people I suspect HAMAS will quietly slip away also along with the hostages.



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15 Oct 2023, 9:18 pm

TwilightPrincess wrote:
It's the most sensible thing that's been said in this thread yet.


You mean sticking one's dick into a hornet's nest?



TwilightPrincess
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15 Oct 2023, 9:18 pm

cyberdad wrote:
TwilightPrincess wrote:
Retrieving hostages does not justify killing a lot of innocent people or using chemical weapons. Israeli lives aren't worth more than Palestinian lives. Once again, you and I seem to have different views about morality.


Didn't Israel ask civilians to leave these zones they planned to move into? Of course in the movement of thousands of people I suspect HAMAS will quietly slip away also along with the hostages.

You know damn well that that's not feasible for a lot of these folks.


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TwilightPrincess
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15 Oct 2023, 9:23 pm

cyberdad wrote:
TwilightPrincess wrote:
It's the most sensible thing that's been said in this thread yet.


You mean sticking one's dick into a hornet's nest?

No. Removing it. :|


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15 Oct 2023, 9:30 pm

TwilightPrincess wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
TwilightPrincess wrote:
Retrieving hostages does not justify killing a lot of innocent people or using chemical weapons. Israeli lives aren't worth more than Palestinian lives. Once again, you and I seem to have different views about morality.


Didn't Israel ask civilians to leave these zones they planned to move into? Of course in the movement of thousands of people I suspect HAMAS will quietly slip away also along with the hostages.

You know damn well that that's not feasible for a lot of these folks.


Exactly.
If I’m old and crippled how would I walk out?
If I’m a young child and my parents are dead how would I walk out?
If I’m sick and in one of the hospitals how would I walk out?
If I’m injured from an explosion how would I walk out?


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15 Oct 2023, 9:40 pm

cyberdad wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
I am inviting you to advise the Israeli government and see (hypothetically) if your idea would work in stopping the shelling of Israeli cities or rescue the hostages held by HAMAS.


I would advise them to worry about removing their dick from the hornet's nest, instead of hoping that a few more rounds of fierce pumping will pacify the hornets. No matter what they do they're going to continue to get stung, but only the former path might eventually lead to an end to the stinging.


8O


Am I wrong, or is it just the choice of metaphor?

Is there a better metaphor?


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The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.
If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. —Malcolm X
Just a reminder: under international law, an occupying power has no right of self-defense, and those who are occupied have the right and duty to liberate themselves by any means possible.


cyberdad
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15 Oct 2023, 9:43 pm

I don't know? it's kinda weird to expect a country like Israel to just sit there and take terrorist attack without fighting back?
As if the US war on terror in response to 9-11 didn't take out collateral damage?
https://www.issuesonline.co.uk/articles ... -on-terror



TwilightPrincess
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15 Oct 2023, 9:46 pm

I was strongly opposed to the way the US handled things after 9/11. It was awful! Bush was a lousy President IMO. The US is no stranger to engaging in reprehensible behavior, just like many other places.


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funeralxempire
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15 Oct 2023, 9:53 pm

cyberdad wrote:
I don't know? it's kinda weird to expect a country like Israel to just sit there and take terrorist attack without fighting back?
As if the US war on terror in response to 9-11 didn't take out collateral damage?
https://www.issuesonline.co.uk/articles ... -on-terror


I've always been critical of the US war on terror and how it's been conducted.

But further, Israel keeps stealing Palestine piecemeal and that's not news, but when people who are radicalized from that experience retaliate we're supposed to act like their motives can't be understood and then cheer while Israel mows the lawn (aka, engages in mass punishment against a people they're slowly seeking to extirpate and exterminate).


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The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.
If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. —Malcolm X
Just a reminder: under international law, an occupying power has no right of self-defense, and those who are occupied have the right and duty to liberate themselves by any means possible.


cyberdad
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15 Oct 2023, 9:55 pm

There are always limits to what you can allow terrorists to do. You can't let them walk over you and then turn the other cheek.

The State of Israel was attacked in an unprovoked attack by all the Arab league in 1948. The trauma from WWII was already sitting with many of the refugees who faced this onslaught. They collectively decided never again. Despite winning the day, the trauma of Arab attacks on Israeli civilians over multiple wars leaves scars.



cyberdad
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15 Oct 2023, 9:57 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
we're supposed to act like their motives can't be understood and then cheer while Israel mows the lawn (aka, engages in mass punishment against a people they're slowly seeking to extirpate and exterminate).


Their motives are to drive the Israeli's into the sea. That was the declaration made by the founder of the PLO Yasser Arafat. The PLO were mild compared to HAMAS.



TwilightPrincess
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15 Oct 2023, 10:00 pm

cyberdad wrote:
There are always limits to what you can allow terrorists to do. You can't let them walk over you and then turn the other cheek.

The State of Israel was attacked in an unprovoked attack by all the Arab league in 1948. The trauma from WWII was already sitting with many of the refugees who faced this onslaught. They collectively decided never again. Despite winning the day, the trauma of Arab attacks on Israeli civilians over multiple wars leaves scars.

:|

Have you watched or read any content in this thread or elsewhere which describes things from a Palestinian perspective as far as history is concerned?


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