Alternative Facts and American Carnage

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23 Jan 2017, 7:34 am

Conflict of interest laws do not apply to the President or Vice President, Trump is under no obligation to surrender control of companies and could legally be president and run his businesses at the same time if he choose to do so. This isn't without precedent. George Washington and Thomas Jefferson were very rich men for their time and ran all sorts of businesses off their estates while president. Blind trusts don't mean anything when the company is named after you and is your personal brand. Not too worried about the conflicts of interest with real estate, it's pretty straight forward. This is the law, he is giving control of his company to his kids and if that isn't enough for some people then too bad since they would of never been happy to begin with.

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23 Jan 2017, 7:35 am

jrjones9933 wrote:

Remember the big news conference with the stacks of manila folders which reporters were not allowed to examine? Shockingly, it all seems to have been lies. Trump has not filed any documents to separate him from control of his business.

http://www.propublica.org/article/trump ... es-done-so

Sorry, but we moved on to the next page without comment on this new verified falsehood.

Quote:

Trump and his associates “are not doing what they said they would do,” said Richard Painter, the chief ethics lawyer for President George W. Bush. “And even that was completely inadequate.”

Trump loves a good prop, which is what the manila envelopes were. You can't believe a word he says.

EzraS
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23 Jan 2017, 7:36 am

underwater wrote:

Yes. Who's venting on twitter? About what?

Donald Trump, about anything. *rimshot*

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23 Jan 2017, 7:41 am

RetroGamer87 wrote:

underwater wrote:

jrjones9933 wrote:

RetroGamer87 wrote:

EzraS wrote:

I'm surprised bureaus and the department had Twitter accounts in the first place. Anything they have to say should go though official channels. The idea of government agencies not go spouting off to the world individually is hardly dictatorial.

In Australia that would be illegal. I work for a government department and no, we can't use social media to vent our personal views on the government. We're not even supposed to that on our personal accounts but the idea of having a social media account and using that to criticise the administration would be quite unthinkable here. People have been fired for less.

underwater wrote:

It's been like that for years, and it's like that in every democratic country.

Not here.

It's this administration which characterizes the normal release of facts as an attack. They don't use the accounts to personally vent, obviously; worst. deflection. ever. They use them to release data or announce publications, events, facility closures and the like.

Yes. Who's venting on twitter? About what?

Are you asking me or jrjones9933?

Sorry, quoted the wrong post. Below is what I was answering to. I wanted to know who exactly was criticizing the government from within, and about what.

RetroGamer87 wrote:

We're not required to like the government but we can't criticize them in our capacity as state employees. Just like how when I'm working for a corporation I can't criticise them in public.

I personally see Trump disputing the number of visitors at the ceremony as setting the tone for the next four years. I think his aim is to make people distrust any information that comes from reliable sources. This time it's about something small, and people get hung up on Trump's fragile ego rather than focus on what a betrayal of democracy it is. Later, the disputes will be about bigger and bigger things, but by then people will feel that nothing is reliable unless they've experienced it themselves.

Later, various persons in the administration will be set up as fall guys whenever Trump's policies don't deliver. There will be public firings of previously trusted advisors.

If, in four years, I turn out to be wrong about this, I'll be very happy to say so.

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underwater
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23 Jan 2017, 7:42 am

EzraS wrote:

underwater wrote:

Yes. Who's venting on twitter? About what?

Donald Trump, about anything. *rimshot*

No s**t.

I meant among state employees?

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Last edited by underwater on 23 Jan 2017, 7:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

EzraS
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23 Jan 2017, 7:43 am

androbot01 wrote:

Trump loves a good prop, which is what the manila envelopes were.

I'm more interested in what a prop represents, rather than the prop itself.

androbot01 wrote:

You can't believe a word he says.

That's a bit extreme.

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23 Jan 2017, 7:45 am

EzraS wrote:

androbot01 wrote:

Trump loves a good prop, which is what the manila envelopes were.

I'm more interested in what a prop represents, rather than the prop itself.

"This way to the great egress."

The only thing it represents is that Trump wouldn't know what truth is if it smacked him in the face.

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23 Jan 2017, 7:51 am

Jacoby wrote:

Nice summary of Trump's assertions. Experts disagree.

No, I am not being nice in the face of gaslighting anymore. Experts call Trump's assertions nonsense.

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EzraS
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23 Jan 2017, 7:53 am

androbot01 wrote:

EzraS wrote:

androbot01 wrote:

Trump loves a good prop, which is what the manila envelopes were.

I'm more interested in what a prop represents, rather than the prop itself.

"This way to the great egress."

P.T. Barnum is a different thread

androbot01 wrote:

The only thing it represents is that Trump wouldn't know what truth is if it smacked him in the face.

I'll have to take a pass on debating metaphors. They're catchy, but shouldn't be equated with facts, even though they often are.

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23 Jan 2017, 7:55 am

jrjones9933 wrote:

Jacoby wrote:

Nice summary of Trump's assertions. Experts disagree.

No, I am not being nice in the face of gaslighting anymore. Experts call Trump's assertions nonsense.

The 'experts' you listen to are partisan hacks on cable news. That is the law, read it and weep.

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23 Jan 2017, 7:59 am

A chain of soundbites does not make a valid argument, but you aren't trying to make a valid argument. Each post consists of a more frenzied appeal to truth by repetition. Trying to refute each point would only waste my time and energy, so I'll just stick with the simple facts as already stated.

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EzraS
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23 Jan 2017, 8:04 am

Jacoby wrote:

jrjones9933 wrote:

Jacoby wrote:

Nice summary of Trump's assertions. Experts disagree.

No, I am not being nice in the face of gaslighting anymore. Experts call Trump's assertions nonsense.

The 'experts' you listen to are partisan hacks on cable news. That is the law, read it and weep.

I never saw stating factual law and established history defined as gasslighting before. Anyways I'm wondering why this story has been relegated to an obscure source and ignored by mainstream media?

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23 Jan 2017, 8:16 am

I'll just keep asking the simple question. It's funny when you get mad at that, and say I'm mad.

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23 Jan 2017, 8:23 am

You haven't asked simple question that hasn't been answered numerous times, you're trying to convince yourself that you're right and doing a poor job of it I might add.

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23 Jan 2017, 9:14 am

It's probably better to stick to the subject matter rather than to let yourself get sucked into circular bickering, accusing and whining along with childish mudslinging.

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23 Jan 2017, 9:55 am

EzraS wrote:

It's probably better to stick to the subject matter rather than to let yourself get sucked into circular bickering, accusing and whining along with childish mudslinging.

I fully endorse this sentiment.

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