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b9
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01 Feb 2018, 3:09 am

auntblabby wrote:
bring on the test tube T-bone :chef:

no one can not do it right now.

saleable meat includes bones and fat and everything where it should be.

test tube meat substitutes will never be a hit yet because they are too simple.

meat is infused with blood and that is why it looks red.
test tube meat will look white because it was grown from a nutrient solution.
it will be tasteless and texture less.

i'm not going to go on about the mounting difficulties of solving all those problems.
instead, i propose a different but morally questionable solution.

what if we could clone a cow and interfere with it's brain development except for it's brain stem?

and then make clones of the same offspring for ever.

we could pipe the nutrients down their neck and they would grow normally.
maybe daily electric shock stimulation of it's muscles may be needed to improve the texture, but the cow was never alive?
i don't wan't to eat beautiful seeing beings, but maybe cows in a rack who are totally unconscious may not be such a hard decision.

dunno.



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01 Feb 2018, 3:29 am

bunnyb wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
bring on the test tube T-bone :chef:


Nah, lets just start on the Soylent Green project and the vegans can go first because they are the greenest. Yum!


I think vegans would taste a bit stringy and unsatisfying.


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auntblabby
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01 Feb 2018, 4:05 am

tastes like chicken :chef:



cyberdad
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01 Feb 2018, 4:56 am

I think vegans would taste just like grain fed pork or veal



auntblabby
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01 Feb 2018, 4:59 am

yeh you're prolly right about the grain fed, as I've known vegetarians who ate too much sugar and were a bit tubby. the vegans are closer to being "grass-fed."



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01 Feb 2018, 6:23 am

Cat and dog food is a good point. How come they're not protesting Alpo and Meow Mix? I wonder how many tons of meat domestic pets go though each year. I wonder how many eating-meat-is-murder vegans have meat eating pets. Plus those pets wear fur. Such hypocrisy.



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01 Feb 2018, 12:16 pm

Why can't they just tolerate other people's eating habits? Why must they force their opinions on others just because they happen to be different?

Oh right, they're human. :roll:

I'm an omnivore. That means I eat plants and animals. I always have been, always will be. I'm not entirely happy about eating meat, but I'm fed up with living in a society where if you like just about any kind of food, it's wrong. It'll make you sick it'll make you fat, and the "experts" all have conflicting beliefs about everything. Enough.



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01 Feb 2018, 3:49 pm

In Australia I'm called a vegetarian because I only eat chicken/fish and even then around once-twice a week
I think it's environmentally and humanely responsible to reduce consumption of hoof animals as they consume 10 x the amount of broadacre crops and water that is required for soybean or wheat etc...

However people should be internally motivated to switch to plant based diets rather than be frightened



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01 Feb 2018, 5:47 pm

bunnyb wrote:
So if these w#nkers get what they want and everybody stops eating meat, what then. How do we feed everybody? To provide plant based diets to all humans, we would have to clear extensive tracts of land leading to extra pressure and probable extinction of the wildlife. All consumable animals would become redundant and in the fight for plant based food, hungry people are unlikely to share acreage and crops with domesticated animals. Basically, massive numbers of animals would die.
People would also need to protect all the crops so there would be a horrifying increase in pesticides being released into the environment. Bees are already dying out and when they go, they're taking us with them. Is that what these vegans really want?
.


It doesn't work that way. If the whole human race switched to vegetarianism we would need to grow LESS plant crops, not more. That's because animal livestock needs to be fed too. And its more efficient to eat lower on the food chain than it is to add extra levels to the trophic pyramid. The rule of thumb is that it takes a ten to one ratio to go up a level in the food chain. Ten pounds of grain to produce one pound of beef, and then ten pounds of beef (worth 100 pounds of grain) to sustain one pound of human. If you go directly from plant to human, and skip the animal middleman, you actually eliminate the need to grow 90 pounds of plant matter per pound of human.

Not taking sides mind you. Just sayin. I didn't like it when our crazy vegan workmate served us all guilt about our diet during that carpool either. But on the other hand I do like to play around with cooking meatless meals every now and then.

On the other hand there are marginal lands that cant be used for any other agricultural use than grazing (like rangelands out in the American west). Only wild grass grows, and humans cant eat grass. So all you do is graze sheep or cattle. So in some cases you have no choice but to go first class!



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01 Feb 2018, 7:35 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
bunnyb wrote:
So if these w#nkers get what they want and everybody stops eating meat, what then. How do we feed everybody? To provide plant based diets to all humans, we would have to clear extensive tracts of land leading to extra pressure and probable extinction of the wildlife. All consumable animals would become redundant and in the fight for plant based food, hungry people are unlikely to share acreage and crops with domesticated animals. Basically, massive numbers of animals would die.
People would also need to protect all the crops so there would be a horrifying increase in pesticides being released into the environment. Bees are already dying out and when they go, they're taking us with them. Is that what these vegans really want?
.


It doesn't work that way. If the whole human race switched to vegetarianism we would need to grow LESS plant crops, not more. That's because animal livestock needs to be fed too. And its more efficient to eat lower on the food chain than it is to add extra levels to the trophic pyramid. The rule of thumb is that it takes a ten to one ratio to go up a level in the food chain. Ten pounds of grain to produce one pound of beef, and then ten pounds of beef (worth 100 pounds of grain) to sustain one pound of human. If you go directly from plant to human, and skip the animal middleman, you actually eliminate the need to grow 90 pounds of plant matter per pound of human.

Not taking sides mind you. Just sayin. I didn't like it when our crazy vegan workmate served us all guilt about our diet during that carpool either. But on the other hand I do like to play around with cooking meatless meals every now and then.

On the other hand there are marginal lands that cant be used for any other agricultural use than grazing (like rangelands out in the American west). Only wild grass grows, and humans cant eat grass. So all you do is graze sheep or cattle. So in some cases you have no choice but to go first class!


Where I live, growing garden type crops is very labor intensive. On the other hand, we can grow a section (square mile) of crops to feed cattle or pigs very efficiently except in terms of water (it would take as much water to grow garden type crops in the same area).

A large, efficient farming operation here can generally get by with one person per section or two. A section of garden type crops would take a large crew. When I was a kid, our garden was about one acre or maybe a bit bigger and four of us would spend at least one hour a day every day in the garden. Extend that out to 640 acres and it would take a crew of 320 working 8 hour days all summer.

So around here, at least, it is far more productive to feed cattle than to grow lettuce.



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01 Feb 2018, 11:32 pm

i'm glad nobody brought up eating bugs yet. ;)



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02 Feb 2018, 12:18 am

naturalplastic wrote:
bunnyb wrote:
So if these w#nkers get what they want and everybody stops eating meat, what then. How do we feed everybody? To provide plant based diets to all humans, we would have to clear extensive tracts of land leading to extra pressure and probable extinction of the wildlife. All consumable animals would become redundant and in the fight for plant based food, hungry people are unlikely to share acreage and crops with domesticated animals. Basically, massive numbers of animals would die.
People would also need to protect all the crops so there would be a horrifying increase in pesticides being released into the environment. Bees are already dying out and when they go, they're taking us with them. Is that what these vegans really want?
.


It doesn't work that way. If the whole human race switched to vegetarianism we would need to grow LESS plant crops, not more. That's because animal livestock needs to be fed too. And its more efficient to eat lower on the food chain than it is to add extra levels to the trophic pyramid. The rule of thumb is that it takes a ten to one ratio to go up a level in the food chain. Ten pounds of grain to produce one pound of beef, and then ten pounds of beef (worth 100 pounds of grain) to sustain one pound of human. If you go directly from plant to human, and skip the animal middleman, you actually eliminate the need to grow 90 pounds of plant matter per pound of human.

Not taking sides mind you. Just sayin. I didn't like it when our crazy vegan workmate served us all guilt about our diet during that carpool either. But on the other hand I do like to play around with cooking meatless meals every now and then.

On the other hand there are marginal lands that cant be used for any other agricultural use than grazing (like rangelands out in the American west). Only wild grass grows, and humans cant eat grass. So all you do is graze sheep or cattle. So in some cases you have no choice but to go first class!


I see your concept but that's assuming the primary production animals are grain fed. Here in Aus we have sheep and cattle stations that are over a million acres of mongrel land that would be unsuitable to crop. Several years ago, the government spent millions to try and set up cropping in the top end but the bugs put paid to that plan. Our outback is pretty fierce and most of Aus is outback. This is a quote from a rural land planning paper " Contrary to most beliefs, only 10 % of Australia’s land mass is arable land suitable for soil based agriculture and livestock production. Much of this is marginal with respect to water and nutrient regimes."
Cattle are super tough and survive in places that are of little use otherwise. Our good land is all on the coast which is where our major cities are and everyone wants to live. It makes me want to cry every time I see a new subdivision destroying good farming land. We shouldn't be building houses on it. I think it's lunacy but I'm just a kid from the bush. :ninja:


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02 Feb 2018, 12:20 am

why can't our brilliant scientists figure out a way to make edible animals better for our health? like pump 'em full of vitamins and minerals and omega 3s and such.



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02 Feb 2018, 12:52 am

auntblabby wrote:
i'm glad nobody brought up eating bugs yet. ;)

https://www.optimoz.com.au/products/roa ... ug-protein
Quite popular in Australia. Roasted crickets are currently out of stock



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02 Feb 2018, 12:55 am

I don't think I could eat bug guts.



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02 Feb 2018, 12:57 am

auntblabby wrote:
I don't think I could eat bug guts.

Cultivated Crickets taste exactly like shrimp but they are cheaper