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auntblabby
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18 Jan 2021, 12:40 am

against stupidity, even the gods themselves contend in vain. [Nietzsche]



ASPartOfMe
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18 Jan 2021, 1:58 am

Trump allies behind rally that ignited Capitol riot

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Members of President Donald Trump’s failed presidential campaign played key roles in orchestrating the Washington rally that spawned a deadly assault on the U.S. Capitol, according to an Associated Press review of records, undercutting claims the event was the brainchild of the president's grassroots supporters.

A pro-Trump nonprofit group called Women for America First hosted the “Save America Rally” on Jan. 6 at the Ellipse, an oval-shaped, federally owned patch of land near the White House. But an attachment to the National Park Service public gathering permit granted to the group lists more than half a dozen people in staff positions for the event who just weeks earlier had been paid thousands of dollars by Trump’s 2020 reelection campaign. Other staff scheduled to be “on site” during the demonstration have close ties to the White House.

Since the siege, several of them have scrambled to distance themselves from the rally.

Women for America First, which applied for and received the Park Service permit, did not respond to messages seeking comment about how the event was financed and about the Trump campaign’s involvement. The rally drew tens of thousands of people.

In a statement, the president’s reelection campaign said it “did not organize, operate or finance the event.” No campaign staff members were involved in the organization or operation of the rally, according to the statement. It said that if any former employees or independent contractors for the campaign took part, “they did not do so at the direction of the Trump campaign.”


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ASPartOfMe
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18 Jan 2021, 1:32 pm

Capitol Rioter Threatened to Shoot His Kids If They Snitched: Feds

Quote:
The FBI on Monday announced charges against more alleged Capitol attackers, including a Texas member of a far-right militia.

Reffitt, the Texas man busted for his alleged involvement in the attack, also had extremist ties, the FBI said. Reffitt attended the riot in a helmet outfitted with a camera, and what appeared to be a tactical vest, according to pictures included in court filings.

According to prosecutors, Reffitt was part of the Texas Freedom Fighters, a militant group that lobbies to protect Confederate symbols, and has spent the past weeks on Twitter accusing the left of being the real rioters.

Reffitt allegedly admitted to his family that he’d participated in the attacks, telling the family that “we” (likely the TFF, according to a criminal filing) had “stormed the Capitol.” He also allegedly told family that he’d brought a gun with him to D.C.

Reffitt’s children allegedly were “disturbed” by his “extreme” statements. When they expressed alarm, he allegedly told them that “if you turn me in, you’re a traitor and you know what happens to traitors...traitors get shot.”

His wife provided information on the fight to investigators.


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cyberdad
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18 Jan 2021, 5:57 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
I think America is beginning to understand what had happened to the Germans in the 1930's.


Yes the Asch experiments back in the 1950s show that when people are too lazy to think for themselves they conform to social consensus as they assume others know more than they do.

This is why I keep saying conservative people live in silos and talk in echo chambers where they see people who only look like them and hear things every day that reinforce values that don't work in a modern cosmopolitan world.

Trump/Bannon triggered those old values and took 74 million people on a journey where they were offered a chance to make America back to a time where those values flourished. They drank from this well and became intoxicated with the idea that sent many of these nutjobs on a crusade,



cyberdad
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18 Jan 2021, 6:02 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:
Capitol Rioter Threatened to Shoot His Kids If They Snitched: Feds
Quote:
The FBI on Monday announced charges against more alleged Capitol attackers, including a Texas member of a far-right militia.

Reffitt, the Texas man busted for his alleged involvement in the attack, also had extremist ties, the FBI said. Reffitt attended the riot in a helmet outfitted with a camera, and what appeared to be a tactical vest, according to pictures included in court filings.

According to prosecutors, Reffitt was part of the Texas Freedom Fighters, a militant group that lobbies to protect Confederate symbols, and has spent the past weeks on Twitter accusing the left of being the real rioters.

Reffitt allegedly admitted to his family that he’d participated in the attacks, telling the family that “we” (likely the TFF, according to a criminal filing) had “stormed the Capitol.” He also allegedly told family that he’d brought a gun with him to D.C.

Reffitt’s children allegedly were “disturbed” by his “extreme” statements. When they expressed alarm, he allegedly told them that “if you turn me in, you’re a traitor and you know what happens to traitors...traitors get shot.”

His wife provided information on the fight to investigators.


While this story is disturbing, it might be the tip of the iceberg. Symptom of a much deeper problem in American society that wasn't addressed in 1865.



Redd_Kross
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18 Jan 2021, 10:19 pm

cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
I think America is beginning to understand what had happened to the Germans in the 1930's.


Yes the Asch experiments back in the 1950s show that when people are too lazy to think for themselves they conform to social consensus as they assume others know more than they do.

This is why I keep saying conservative people live in silos and talk in echo chambers where they see people who only look like them and hear things every day that reinforce values that don't work in a modern cosmopolitan world.

Trump/Bannon triggered those old values and took 74 million people on a journey where they were offered a chance to make America back to a time where those values flourished. They drank from this well and became intoxicated with the idea that sent many of these nutjobs on a crusade,


Don't forget "diffusion of responsibility" too.

Many people like being told what to do, especially if it justifies prejudices they already had. It means they can say "It wasn't my choice, I was told to do it" afterwards.

It's interesting that the pro-Trump protestors stormed in, but didn't have a clue what to do once inside. He hadn't given detailed instructions about that.



cyberdad
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18 Jan 2021, 10:39 pm

Redd_Kross wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
I think America is beginning to understand what had happened to the Germans in the 1930's.


Yes the Asch experiments back in the 1950s show that when people are too lazy to think for themselves they conform to social consensus as they assume others know more than they do.

This is why I keep saying conservative people live in silos and talk in echo chambers where they see people who only look like them and hear things every day that reinforce values that don't work in a modern cosmopolitan world.

Trump/Bannon triggered those old values and took 74 million people on a journey where they were offered a chance to make America back to a time where those values flourished. They drank from this well and became intoxicated with the idea that sent many of these nutjobs on a crusade,


Don't forget "diffusion of responsibility" too.

Many people like being told what to do, especially if it justifies prejudices they already had. It means they can say "It wasn't my choice, I was told to do it" afterwards.

It's interesting that the pro-Trump protestors stormed in, but didn't have a clue what to do once inside. He hadn't given detailed instructions about that.


Exactly right...that too



TwisterUprocker
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19 Jan 2021, 2:31 am

ASPartOfMe wrote:
Capitol Rioter Threatened to Shoot His Kids If They Snitched: Feds
Quote:
The FBI on Monday announced charges against more alleged Capitol attackers, including a Texas member of a far-right militia.

Reffitt, the Texas man busted for his alleged involvement in the attack, also had extremist ties, the FBI said. Reffitt attended the riot in a helmet outfitted with a camera, and what appeared to be a tactical vest, according to pictures included in court filings.

According to prosecutors, Reffitt was part of the Texas Freedom Fighters, a militant group that lobbies to protect Confederate symbols, and has spent the past weeks on Twitter accusing the left of being the real rioters.

That's what we call a self fulfilling prophecy.

Reffitt allegedly admitted to his family that he’d participated in the attacks, telling the family that “we” (likely the TFF, according to a criminal filing) had “stormed the Capitol.” He also allegedly told family that he’d brought a gun with him to D.C.

Reffitt’s children allegedly were “disturbed” by his “extreme” statements. When they expressed alarm, he allegedly told them that “if you turn me in, you’re a traitor and you know what happens to traitors...traitors get shot.”

His wife provided information on the fight to investigators.


That's what they call a self fulfilling prophecy.



Pepe
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19 Jan 2021, 2:51 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
Pepe wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
QuantumChemist wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
he oughta hate himself then, the GDPOS.


He thinks he's better than his supporters


There are news reports that Trump was unhappy that the rioters looked to be low class. He does not like low class things to be associated with him. It tends to tarnish his “image” of being rich and successful.


A White House insider had claimed Trump said: "The virus is a good thing; now I won't have to shake hands with disgusting people."


Do you have supporting verifiable evidence on this, or it is simply more gossip? 8)

I heard that Joe Biden is a hair sniffer. :P
Oops, bad example. :mrgreen:

League_Girl wrote:
Anyone notice how neither of them had on face masks? Let's hope they all get sick and die. Less white suprimists but sadly they multiply.


You do know that :"Hate begets hate."
I don't think that is particularly helpful and is best left unsaid.
There is more than enough hate to go around, already.
I'd rather rationality than emotionalism be a feature of this website. 8)

Pepe has spoken. 8)


https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl ... -b480406.h

Being that he had also said how disappointed that so many of his supporters were so "low class" during the riot, it's easy to see how he'd have a history of making such derogatory statements about his cultists.


The link didn't work.
Quote:
Sorry – we can't find that page

The address could have been entered incorrectly, or the page could have gone missing.



Pepe
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19 Jan 2021, 2:56 am

League_Girl wrote:
Pepe wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
QuantumChemist wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
he oughta hate himself then, the GDPOS.


He thinks he's better than his supporters


There are news reports that Trump was unhappy that the rioters looked to be low class. He does not like low class things to be associated with him. It tends to tarnish his “image” of being rich and successful.


A White House insider had claimed Trump said: "The virus is a good thing; now I won't have to shake hands with disgusting people."


Do you have supporting verifiable evidence on this, or it is simply more gossip? 8)

I heard that Joe Biden is a hair sniffer. :P
Oops, bad example. :mrgreen:

League_Girl wrote:
Anyone notice how neither of them had on face masks? Let's hope they all get sick and die. Less white suprimists but sadly they multiply.


You do know that :"Hate begets hate."
I don't think that is particularly helpful and is best left unsaid.
There is more than enough hate to go around, already.
I'd rather rationality than emotionalism be a feature of this website. 8)

Pepe has spoken. 8)



It's bigoted to hate bigots? Well this bigotry I am okay with, hate the hate groups.


I didn't say you were bigoted.
I said your hate rants are not helpful.



Pepe
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19 Jan 2021, 3:04 am

Redd_Kross wrote:
League_Girl wrote:
It's bigoted to hate bigots? Well this bigotry I am okay with, hate the hate groups.

No no, you should always let horrible people have their way, because stopping them would be naughty.

That's why there's no need for armies or the police.


Sarcasm noted.

The context is this website.
Hate posts are not wanted here, I believe.



Pepe
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19 Jan 2021, 3:19 am

cyberdad wrote:
Pepe wrote:
I wonder if any antifa members left pipe-bombs and hand ties at the capitol hill violent protest?
It is simply speculation, at this time.


There's no evidence antifa have killed anyone. But in any case the comparison isn't valid. The majority of BLM and antifa protestors were peaceful. Those who chose to loot and cause damage to public weren't actually associated with the BLM movement beyond infiltrating the crowds.


Wasn't "CHAD/CHOP/CHAZ/POOP/WHATEVER-it was called" an antifa enclave?
There were antifa 'guards' chasing away reporters.
I personally watched the footage.
Please don't re-write history. :wink:

cyberdad wrote:
In comparison you have literally hundreds of proud card carrying MAGAs breaking into the capitol building or getting caught on camera abusing or assaulting police or civilians. A mere handful have been arrested but there are still hundreds at large who are facing jail time.


This is too easy. :mrgreen:
The leftist riots burnt down a police station and a CNN office and caused 2 billion dollars worth of damage.
19 people were killed.
Hardly the work of angels.

Really, cyber, I do question your objectivity. :?



Pepe
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19 Jan 2021, 3:20 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Pepe wrote:
I wonder if any antifa members left pipe-bombs and hand ties at the capitol hill violent protest?
It is simply speculation, at this time.


There's no evidence antifa have killed anyone. But in any case the comparison isn't valid. The majority of BLM and antifa protestors were peaceful. Those who chose to loot and cause damage to public weren't actually associated with the BLM movement beyond infiltrating the crowds.

In comparison you have literally hundreds of proud card carrying MAGAs breaking into the capitol building or getting caught on camera abusing or assaulting police or civilians. A mere handful have been arrested but there are still hundreds at large who are facing jail time.


Trump and the rioters are trying to cover their backsides by blaming Antifa for their own wrong doing. That's very much representative of Trump and his minions - - pass the blame when caught.


[Pepe chants]
"A$$holes on both sides." :mrgreen:



Pepe
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19 Jan 2021, 3:23 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Trump and the rioters are trying to cover their backsides by blaming Antifa for their own wrong doing. That's very much representative of Trump and his minions - - pass the blame when caught.


Yes it worked swimmingly for Trump so why not his minions eh....

Call your accusers claims "fake news" and say everything you say/do is not your fault as somebody else is to blame.
Apparently for 74 million Americans a leader with the emotional intelligence of a 5 year old child is good enough to lead the world's biggest country and (heck) while they are it give him the nuclear weapon launch codes.


I think America is beginning to understand what had happened to the Germans in the 1930's.


What, did America unconditionally surrender and be force to accept a Versailles style humiliation, destroying the economy with millions of marks required to purchase a loaf of bread?
Hardly. 8)



Brictoria
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19 Jan 2021, 4:12 am

Pepe wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Trump and the rioters are trying to cover their backsides by blaming Antifa for their own wrong doing. That's very much representative of Trump and his minions - - pass the blame when caught.


Yes it worked swimmingly for Trump so why not his minions eh....

Call your accusers claims "fake news" and say everything you say/do is not your fault as somebody else is to blame.
Apparently for 74 million Americans a leader with the emotional intelligence of a 5 year old child is good enough to lead the world's biggest country and (heck) while they are it give him the nuclear weapon launch codes.


I think America is beginning to understand what had happened to the Germans in the 1930's.


What, did America unconditionally surrender and be force to accept a Versailles style humiliation, destroying the economy with millions of marks required to purchase a loaf of bread?
Hardly. 8)


Maybe you're looking at this from the wrong direction...

It's more likely he was referring to having a leader sworn in, surrounded by troops picked for their political alleigence, and whose supporters are actively trying to silence political dissent... :)



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19 Jan 2021, 4:17 am

Pepe wrote:
Hate posts are not wanted here, I believe.


I'd hazard a guess that anyone on the political right (or politically neutral) may not see things quite that way, looking at the News and PPR sections...

On the positive side, it has been interesting to see various members true character being revealed through how they react to those with whose opinions\beliefs they disagree...