Trump wants to deport people here for medical reasons.
For number 2, if we are not going to live by the words written on it then let's get rid it.
No, I don't hate democracy (I thought we was a constitutional republic and not a democracy) and freedom but what I hate is hypocrisy. And, that is one difference between our nation and others.
1. Jesus and his disciples took care of their own poor. Took care of the children of Abraham. When a foreign woman askd Jesus for aid he said "it is not right to take the childrens (of Abraham) bread and toss it to the dogs".
Now that doesn't mean that Jesus was agaist foreign aid, because he did end up helping her. But it sems pretty clear the children of Abraham took priority.
2. The Statue of Liberty did not come with that inscribed plague. Also the poem inscribed on it is very derogatory, literally referring to immigrants as garbage. Those going on what Emma Lazarus wrote don't seem to acknowledge how un-PC it is.
That's only half the story. Jesus helped her anyhow when she replied, "But even dogs eat crumbs from the master's table." As Jesus had helped a Roman centurion whose slave he loved like a son was sick, he obviously was only testing the woman's faith. Regardless, it's hardly a great argument against foreign aid.
Who cares if the poem wasn't originally on the statue? It's still keeping with the idealism behind the statue.
Bill, I already wrote in the second pragraph of my post that Jesus helped her. Please read my entire posts before committing on them. I'm usually very succinct so that's not asking for much.
I may have worded my response clumsily, as I did see your post. I was mostly illustrating how Christ was willing to help anyone.
And I was illustrating how the children of Israel were the primary recipients of help. Jesus made it clear his job was to help them. His disciples wanted to send her away. iow send her back where she came from. It seems to me that Jesus helping the Canaanite woman and the Roman centurian were the exception to the rule.
Btw there was nothing clumsy about your reply. You just went off on the first part of what I wrote instead of reading the whole thing and taking a minute to digest it.
No, Ezra, I've been up writing and I just got tired. I think I got more than one thought in my head when I responded to you.
So I write in the second half of my statement, "Now that doesn't mean that Jesus was aganist foreign aid, because he did end up helping her." And your response was, "That's only half the story. Jesus helped her anyhow". Deductive reasoning tells me that you only read the first half of what I wrote.
We ARE a nation of immigrants, most demonstrably and which can be proven beyond any doubt. My grandmother was an immigrant.
Immigrants were called “huddled masses,” not “garbage,” in the poem. The allusion was to how poor many immigrants were when they arrived in the US. It was meant to be illustrative for purposes of encouraging compassion for those folks.
Like I said many times, there should be more accountability, more monitoring of immigrants. There should be an Ellis Island type place to document these folks (without the abuses which occurred in the actual Ellis Island).
Try to put yourself in the place of immigrants seeking a better life for themselves.
We must also take care of our own much better.
Immigrants were called “huddled masses,” not “garbage,” in the poem.
I guess folks develop a blind spot when they get to the part about them being "wretched refuse".
If I referred to the immigrants in the ICE facilities as "miserable garbage" which is the same as "wretched refuse", I'd most likely get banned for it.
America wanted that "wretched refuse" to exploit as cheap labor.
Democrat politicians want Latin American immigrants to use them for votes.
Last edited by EzraS on 23 Sep 2019, 10:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
I would interpret that line as the poet implying that the immigrants were "the wretched refuse" of whatever land they were immigrating from, from the viewpoint of their "old country."
They were thought of as being "wretched refuse" by their "old country." Not by the poet.
Anybody who read the poem during the generation from which it was written would not interpret the line as meaning that the poet thought the "huddled masses" were "wretched refuse." Otherwise, the poem would not have been placed on a prominent location within the Statue of Liberty.
Many of the immigrants who came here were quite literate; no mention was made of the potential "offensiveness" of the "wretched refuse" line back in the time of Ellis island.
Amongst other reasons, this notion that they were "wretched refuse" as far as the "old country" was concerned was behind them seeking a land (the United States) where they would be accepted as relative equals.
Anybody who read the poem during the generation from which it was written would not interpret the line as meaning that the poet thought the "huddled masses" were "wretched refuse." Otherwise, they wouldn't have put the poem on the Statue of Liberty.
How could they not think that when they were specifically referred to as such. And Americans probably did think of them that way. Think of how many demeaning jokes and slurs about Italians and Polish etc immigrants there were back in the early 20th century.
And did you know that Ellis Island’s role as a gateway for immigrants began to change in the early 1920s, when a series of federal laws ended the open door immigration policy and established quotas for the number of new arrivals to the United States and later on became a detention and deportation center?
Some Americans did, indeed, think of them as "wretched refuse." Of course they did.
The immigrants, for the most part, felt like they had to "prove themselves." And, for the most part, "prove themselves" they did.
The difference, today, is that nativists don't want to give the immigrants the opportunity for them to "prove themselves" like the Irish, Jews, Italians, etc. before them.
The intent of the poem was to emphasize that the "huddled masses" were thought of as being "wretched" refuse by their "old countries."
Yeah...I know about the 1924 laws. They restricted immigration severely. The "golden age" of immigration ended right there.
Like I said, I feel we have to monitor immigrants entering our country more. We have to be vigilant about our security.
But I wouldn't call people seeking a better life "criminals." If they had more avenues to pursue in legally immigrating to the United States, like what occurred before 1924, I am sure the vast majority would pursue it.
Right, nearly 100 years ago. Yet people keep bringing it up like it was a recent policy.
And the The New Colossus poem plaque isn't even a part of the Statue of Liberty itself but rather is mounted inside the lower level of the pedestal built for it years later. And then disregarded almost a century ago. And after that Ellis Island became more famous for deportations.
And the funny thing is people are using that poem and Ellis Island against those who are not against immigration, but rather are against illegal immigration.
The poem is beautiful, and any reference to immigrants as garbage is in a "One country's trash is another country's treasure" kind of way.
However, a beautiful poem and sentiment does not make sound real world policy. Currently immigrants (legal and illegal) in the US make up 47 million. That is 20% of the worlds total immigrants and 14% of the U.S. population. The U.S. is 4.3% of the world's population, so we are taking on a much greater share of the world's immigrants relative to our population.
In the year 1900, there were 10 million total immigrants in the US against a population of 76 million. That is 13% of the U.S. population or lower than the number of immigrants we have now.
The U.S. can not absorb all the people in the world. It's just not practical.
_________________
"Ignorance may be bliss, but knowledge is power."
One thing I would like is a coherent vision on immigration from the democrats/left/liberals etc. It seems all I hear is: Immigrants good, Trump bad. I liken it to the republican stance on healthcare. They're anti-Obamacare but have no idea what to actually replace it with.
A few questions I would like straight answers to:
Do you support open borders where anyone who wants to can come to U.S.?
If not, what is the penalty for coming to the U.S. without proper approval?
How many immigrants is a reasonable number to be approved to come to the U.S., and how will you decide who can come to the U.S.?
_________________
"Ignorance may be bliss, but knowledge is power."
I understand what you're saying. We can't take in "everybody."
But what would YOU do if you were a Guatemalan who's had years of crop failures, and is beset by drug-dealing gangs? Who has to support a family? And who detests drugs and drug-dealing more than any American can imagine?
I'm not for totally "open" borders----but I am certainly for an Ellis Island type of situation as was constituted circa 1900. I'm sure most of the "illegal" immigrants would go that route, too----rather than spending thousands of dollars on "coyotes" who sneak them into the US.
But what would YOU do if you were a Guatemalan who's had years of crop failures, and is beset by drug-dealing gangs? Who has to support a family? And who detests drugs and drug-dealing more than any American can imagine?
I'm not for totally "open" borders----but I am certainly for an Ellis Island type of situation as was constituted circa 1900. I'm sure most of the "illegal" immigrants would go that route, too----rather than spending thousands of dollars on "coyotes" who sneak them into the US.
Suck it up and work to fix your nation instead of moving and making trouble in another nation.
There’s billions of people with crap lives they can’t all come here.
What’s a homless American stuck on streets with drug dealers and treated like crap suppose to do? How about after every single last American has a home and income then we can consider letting others in.
if the left had half as much compassion for Americans as illgeal immigrants maybe we have no homeless.
_________________
There is no place for me in the world. I'm going into the wilderness, probably to die
Ellis Island pretty much only just asked a few questions, did a quick check for communicable diseases and sent them through.
And US still processes millions of immigrants per year. According to the Center for Immigration Studies, the number stood at 44.5 million in 2017.
Meanwhile there are millions of US citizens who are experiencing a housing crisis.
Kraichgauer
Veteran

Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,192
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.
For number 2, if we are not going to live by the words written on it then let's get rid it.
No, I don't hate democracy (I thought we was a constitutional republic and not a democracy) and freedom but what I hate is hypocrisy. And, that is one difference between our nation and others.
1. Jesus and his disciples took care of their own poor. Took care of the children of Abraham. When a foreign woman askd Jesus for aid he said "it is not right to take the childrens (of Abraham) bread and toss it to the dogs".
Now that doesn't mean that Jesus was agaist foreign aid, because he did end up helping her. But it sems pretty clear the children of Abraham took priority.
2. The Statue of Liberty did not come with that inscribed plague. Also the poem inscribed on it is very derogatory, literally referring to immigrants as garbage. Those going on what Emma Lazarus wrote don't seem to acknowledge how un-PC it is.
That's only half the story. Jesus helped her anyhow when she replied, "But even dogs eat crumbs from the master's table." As Jesus had helped a Roman centurion whose slave he loved like a son was sick, he obviously was only testing the woman's faith. Regardless, it's hardly a great argument against foreign aid.
Who cares if the poem wasn't originally on the statue? It's still keeping with the idealism behind the statue.
Bill, I already wrote in the second pragraph of my post that Jesus helped her. Please read my entire posts before committing on them. I'm usually very succinct so that's not asking for much.
I may have worded my response clumsily, as I did see your post. I was mostly illustrating how Christ was willing to help anyone.
And I was illustrating how the children of Israel were the primary recipients of help. Jesus made it clear his job was to help them. His disciples wanted to send her away. iow send her back where she came from. It seems to me that Jesus helping the Canaanite woman and the Roman centurian were the exception to the rule.
Btw there was nothing clumsy about your reply. You just went off on the first part of what I wrote instead of reading the whole thing and taking a minute to digest it.
No, Ezra, I've been up writing and I just got tired. I think I got more than one thought in my head when I responded to you.
So I write in the second half of my statement, "Now that doesn't mean that Jesus was aganist foreign aid, because he did end up helping her." And your response was, "That's only half the story. Jesus helped her anyhow". Deductive reasoning tells me that you only read the first half of what I wrote.
I apologized. Take a chill pill.
_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer
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