Board index › General Discussion › News and Current Events

Hawaii café bans Trump voters - "no Nazis" allowed

Page 5 of 10 [ 150 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 ... 10  Next

Previous topic | Next topic

Kraichgauer
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,751
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.

02 Jan 2017, 11:38 pm

Tim_Tex wrote:
How can the owners of the café spot a patron's political affiliation, unless they're flaunting clothing that shows it?


Well, I guess they hope the Trumpites go on the honor system.


_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


Kiprobalhato
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Mar 2014
Age: 29
Gender: Female
Posts: 29,119
Location: מתחת לעננים

03 Jan 2017, 12:43 am

thank you for clearing up the awful quote trees.

Kraichgauer wrote:
Putin has done it before, interfering with the elections in the Baltic States, Ukraine, and Germany, so why not in America?


it's unprecedented because the united states lacks the geographical, political and historical closeness those states have had with russia, germany to a lesser extent. the US is also a much larger nation with greater ability to retaliate, so i can see why he would hesitate, or why he waited until a more "pro russia" candidate appeared.


_________________
הייתי צוללת עכשיו למים
הכי, הכי עמוקים
לא לשמוע כלום
לא לדעת כלום
וזה הכל אהובי, זה הכל.


LoveNotHate
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 Oct 2013
Gender: Female
Posts: 6,195
Location: USA

03 Jan 2017, 2:46 am

Kiprobalhato wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
I imagine most modern NAZI party recruitment speeches go like this ...

They tell you your life sucks because of capitalism, evil corporations, free trade, open immigration, and rich people.

the (actual) nazis were pretty big corporatists and "big business" types, IIRC.

Controlling private industry is not capitalism though

The right wing argues for freedom from government control.

The left wing likes government control of industry ("corporatists").

In the US, our right wing groups fight against gov. health care, while the left wing groups fight to force us to buy corporate health insurance.



Kiprobalhato
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Mar 2014
Age: 29
Gender: Female
Posts: 29,119
Location: מתחת לעננים

03 Jan 2017, 3:13 am

from my observations, it was the right who wanted us to buy private medical insurance.

to be free from the government's health care.


_________________
הייתי צוללת עכשיו למים
הכי, הכי עמוקים
לא לשמוע כלום
לא לדעת כלום
וזה הכל אהובי, זה הכל.


Kraichgauer
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,751
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.

03 Jan 2017, 3:33 am

LoveNotHate wrote:
Kiprobalhato wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
I imagine most modern NAZI party recruitment speeches go like this ...

They tell you your life sucks because of capitalism, evil corporations, free trade, open immigration, and rich people.

the (actual) nazis were pretty big corporatists and "big business" types, IIRC.

Controlling private industry is not capitalism though

The right wing argues for freedom from government control.

The left wing likes government control of industry ("corporatists").

In the US, our right wing groups fight against gov. health care, while the left wing groups fight to force us to buy corporate health insurance.


How will the poor get healthcare, other than by means of the government? I have yet to see a large scale give away of medicine and medical care by the medical industry, or any industry for that matter.


_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


EzraS
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 24 Sep 2013
Gender: Male
Posts: 27,828
Location: Twin Peaks

03 Jan 2017, 3:34 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Putin has done it before, interfering with the elections in the Baltic States, Ukraine, and Germany, so why not in America?


That's plenty good reasoning, but it's just speculation. Looking through some news stories today it's still being referred to as "alleged Russian espionage".

Kraichgauer wrote:
Plus, US intelligence has identified the earmarks of their Russian counterparts in the hacking operation. Don't forget the Russian compounds Obama had shut down in New York and Maryland, begging the question: why the hell would another country run secret bases in another country, unless no good was intended?


I'm still reluctant to call a phishing email a hacking operation.

And were they secret bases or just posh estates for Russian diplomats? From what I'm reading their existence was well know to the State Department who made a deal with them back in the 70's for two properties in Moscow in return. They were described as containing luxuries and hosting dinner parties. I didn't read anything about them being any kind of military compound or containing any kind of espionage equipment. Them being shut down is being described as payback for alleged Russian interference in the election.


I'd expect intelligence operations being run out of some compound like these than out of the Russian embassy.
And you can ask the Ukrainians and the people of the Baltic States how "alleged" that hacking war was.


I'd expect Russian intelligence to run something more sophisticated than a phishing scam a high school student could pull off from anywhere.

And I take it that the hacking war involving the Ukrainians people of the Baltic States was considerably more sophisticated than the world's oldest and most basic phishing scam.

I mean that's a good point. Since Russia has a history of cyber warfare, did the email Podesta fall for fit the m/o of a Russian intelligence operation carried out by Putin himself?



Kraichgauer
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,751
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.

03 Jan 2017, 3:36 am

EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Putin has done it before, interfering with the elections in the Baltic States, Ukraine, and Germany, so why not in America?


That's plenty good reasoning, but it's just speculation. Looking through some news stories today it's still being referred to as "alleged Russian espionage".

Kraichgauer wrote:
Plus, US intelligence has identified the earmarks of their Russian counterparts in the hacking operation. Don't forget the Russian compounds Obama had shut down in New York and Maryland, begging the question: why the hell would another country run secret bases in another country, unless no good was intended?


I'm still reluctant to call a phishing email a hacking operation.

And were they secret bases or just posh estates for Russian diplomats? From what I'm reading their existence was well know to the State Department who made a deal with them back in the 70's for two properties in Moscow in return. They were described as containing luxuries and hosting dinner parties. I didn't read anything about them being any kind of military compound or containing any kind of espionage equipment. Them being shut down is being described as payback for alleged Russian interference in the election.


I'd expect intelligence operations being run out of some compound like these than out of the Russian embassy.
And you can ask the Ukrainians and the people of the Baltic States how "alleged" that hacking war was.


I'd expect Russian intelligence to run something more sophisticated than a phishing scam a high school student could pull off from anywhere.

And I take it that the hacking war involving the Ukrainians people of the Baltic States was considerably more sophisticated than the world's oldest and most basic phishing scam.

I mean that's a good point. Since Russia has a history of cyber warfare, did the email Podesta fall for fit the m/o of a Russian intelligence operation carried out by Putin himself?


That all remains to be seen. That's what Obama's investigation is for.
And if there is nothing to this, why is Trump so eager for everyone to forget it?


_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


EzraS
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 24 Sep 2013
Gender: Male
Posts: 27,828
Location: Twin Peaks

03 Jan 2017, 3:47 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:

I'd expect intelligence operations being run out of some compound like these than out of the Russian embassy.
And you can ask the Ukrainians and the people of the Baltic States how "alleged" that hacking war was.


I'd expect Russian intelligence to run something more sophisticated than a phishing scam a high school student could pull off from anywhere.

And I take it that the hacking war involving the Ukrainians people of the Baltic States was considerably more sophisticated than the world's oldest and most basic phishing scam.

I mean that's a good point. Since Russia has a history of cyber warfare, did the email Podesta fall for fit the m/o of a Russian intelligence operation carried out by Putin himself?


That all remains to be seen. That's what Obama's investigation is for.
And if there is nothing to this, why is Trump so eager for everyone to forget it?


Exactly, it remains to be seen. As in there's no proof. Which is what I have been saying all along. So US policy under Obama is to kick a bunch of Russian families out of their homes at Christmas time as payback over something that remains to be seen. And I heard Trump said he was going to make an official statement regarding the hacking and sanctions today or Wednesday, so that doesn't sound like he dodging the subject. And he already said, "it could have been Russia". He's certainly going to have to deal with the sanction mess when he's president, which I'm sure was part of Obama's obstruction plan.



Darmok
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 18 Dec 2015
Gender: Male
Posts: 12,030
Location: New England

03 Jan 2017, 3:58 am

EzraS wrote:
I'd expect Russian intelligence to run something more sophisticated than a phishing scam a high school student could pull off from anywhere.

And I take it that the hacking war involving the Ukrainians people of the Baltic States was considerably more sophisticated than the world's oldest and most basic phishing scam.

I mean that's a good point. Since Russia has a history of cyber warfare, did the email Podesta fall for fit the m/o of a Russian intelligence operation carried out by Putin himself?


Or it could be that the whole "Russia hacked the election" fake news scam is just another example of the Leftist Obama administration coordinating with the Leftist media to lie to the American people:

WikiLeaks founder: Obama admin trying to ‘delegitimize' Trump

WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange says there’s an “obvious” reason the Obama administration has focused on Russia’s alleged role in Democratic hacks leading up to Donald Trump‘s electoral win.

“They’re trying to delegitimize the Trump administration as it goes into the White House,” Assange said during an interview with Fox News’s Sean Hannity airing Tuesday night, according to a transcript of excerpts from the network.

“They are trying to say that President-elect Trump is not a legitimate president,” Assange said during the interview, which was conducted at the Ecuadorian embassy in London where he has been staying.

“Our publications had wide uptake by the American people, they’re all true,” Assange continued. “But that’s not the allegation that’s being presented by the Obama White House.”

Assange reiterated the group’s denial that Russia was the source of the Democratic documents released over the summer.

“Our source is not a state party, so the answer for our interactions is no,” he said.

In December, Assange told Hannity that the documents the anti-secrecy group received looked “very much like they’re from the Russians” but said his source was not them....

“Did [WikiLeaks] change the outcome of the election? Who knows, it’s impossible to tell," Assange said.

"But if it did, the accusation is that the true statements of Hillary Clinton and her campaign manager, John Podesta, and the DNC head Debbie Wasserman Schultz, their true statements is what changed the election.”

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing- ... mize-trump


_________________
 
There Are Four Lights!


EzraS
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 24 Sep 2013
Gender: Male
Posts: 27,828
Location: Twin Peaks

03 Jan 2017, 4:55 am

It seems blatantly obvious what's going on with this. I didn't even need need to read statements like those to come to the same conclusions. I can't believe anyone is falling for something this obvious.

The Russians don't need to bother with obstructing the integrity of the United States election process, they have James Comey and Barack Obama to do that for them.



Kraichgauer
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,751
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.

03 Jan 2017, 9:51 pm

EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:

I'd expect intelligence operations being run out of some compound like these than out of the Russian embassy.
And you can ask the Ukrainians and the people of the Baltic States how "alleged" that hacking war was.


I'd expect Russian intelligence to run something more sophisticated than a phishing scam a high school student could pull off from anywhere.

And I take it that the hacking war involving the Ukrainians people of the Baltic States was considerably more sophisticated than the world's oldest and most basic phishing scam.

I mean that's a good point. Since Russia has a history of cyber warfare, did the email Podesta fall for fit the m/o of a Russian intelligence operation carried out by Putin himself?


That all remains to be seen. That's what Obama's investigation is for.
And if there is nothing to this, why is Trump so eager for everyone to forget it?


Exactly, it remains to be seen. As in there's no proof. Which is what I have been saying all along. So US policy under Obama is to kick a bunch of Russian families out of their homes at Christmas time as payback over something that remains to be seen. And I heard Trump said he was going to make an official statement regarding the hacking and sanctions today or Wednesday, so that doesn't sound like he dodging the subject. And he already said, "it could have been Russia". He's certainly going to have to deal with the sanction mess when he's president, which I'm sure was part of Obama's obstruction plan.


Again, our intelligence agencies say Russian hackers were involved in a coordinated effort. I am going to trust them long before I trust Trump.


_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


EzraS
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 24 Sep 2013
Gender: Male
Posts: 27,828
Location: Twin Peaks

04 Jan 2017, 1:09 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:

I'd expect intelligence operations being run out of some compound like these than out of the Russian embassy.
And you can ask the Ukrainians and the people of the Baltic States how "alleged" that hacking war was.


I'd expect Russian intelligence to run something more sophisticated than a phishing scam a high school student could pull off from anywhere.

And I take it that the hacking war involving the Ukrainians people of the Baltic States was considerably more sophisticated than the world's oldest and most basic phishing scam.

I mean that's a good point. Since Russia has a history of cyber warfare, did the email Podesta fall for fit the m/o of a Russian intelligence operation carried out by Putin himself?


That all remains to be seen. That's what Obama's investigation is for.
And if there is nothing to this, why is Trump so eager for everyone to forget it?


Exactly, it remains to be seen. As in there's no proof. Which is what I have been saying all along. So US policy under Obama is to kick a bunch of Russian families out of their homes at Christmas time as payback over something that remains to be seen. And I heard Trump said he was going to make an official statement regarding the hacking and sanctions today or Wednesday, so that doesn't sound like he dodging the subject. And he already said, "it could have been Russia". He's certainly going to have to deal with the sanction mess when he's president, which I'm sure was part of Obama's obstruction plan.


Again, our intelligence agencies say Russian hackers were involved in a coordinated effort. I am going to trust them long before I trust Trump.


That means the plan is working. On some at least.



Kraichgauer
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 49,751
Location: Spokane area, Washington state.

04 Jan 2017, 1:19 am

EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:

I'd expect intelligence operations being run out of some compound like these than out of the Russian embassy.
And you can ask the Ukrainians and the people of the Baltic States how "alleged" that hacking war was.


I'd expect Russian intelligence to run something more sophisticated than a phishing scam a high school student could pull off from anywhere.

And I take it that the hacking war involving the Ukrainians people of the Baltic States was considerably more sophisticated than the world's oldest and most basic phishing scam.

I mean that's a good point. Since Russia has a history of cyber warfare, did the email Podesta fall for fit the m/o of a Russian intelligence operation carried out by Putin himself?


That all remains to be seen. That's what Obama's investigation is for.
And if there is nothing to this, why is Trump so eager for everyone to forget it?


Exactly, it remains to be seen. As in there's no proof. Which is what I have been saying all along. So US policy under Obama is to kick a bunch of Russian families out of their homes at Christmas time as payback over something that remains to be seen. And I heard Trump said he was going to make an official statement regarding the hacking and sanctions today or Wednesday, so that doesn't sound like he dodging the subject. And he already said, "it could have been Russia". He's certainly going to have to deal with the sanction mess when he's president, which I'm sure was part of Obama's obstruction plan.


Again, our intelligence agencies say Russian hackers were involved in a coordinated effort. I am going to trust them long before I trust Trump.


That means the plan is working. On some at least.


Or maybe it means Trump is too shame faced to admit he got help from Putin.


_________________
-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


Kiprobalhato
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Mar 2014
Age: 29
Gender: Female
Posts: 29,119
Location: מתחת לעננים

04 Jan 2017, 1:39 am

EzraS wrote:
I'd expect Russian intelligence to run something more sophisticated than a phishing scam a high school student could pull off from anywhere.

And I take it that the hacking war involving the Ukrainians people of the Baltic States was considerably more sophisticated than the world's oldest and most basic phishing scam.


"the world's oldest and most basic phishing scam" has apparently gotten russian intelligence the exact result they were hoping for.

in that case, why would they need to do something more elaborate?


_________________
הייתי צוללת עכשיו למים
הכי, הכי עמוקים
לא לשמוע כלום
לא לדעת כלום
וזה הכל אהובי, זה הכל.


EzraS
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 24 Sep 2013
Gender: Male
Posts: 27,828
Location: Twin Peaks

04 Jan 2017, 3:30 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:

I'd expect intelligence operations being run out of some compound like these than out of the Russian embassy.
And you can ask the Ukrainians and the people of the Baltic States how "alleged" that hacking war was.


I'd expect Russian intelligence to run something more sophisticated than a phishing scam a high school student could pull off from anywhere.

And I take it that the hacking war involving the Ukrainians people of the Baltic States was considerably more sophisticated than the world's oldest and most basic phishing scam.

I mean that's a good point. Since Russia has a history of cyber warfare, did the email Podesta fall for fit the m/o of a Russian intelligence operation carried out by Putin himself?


That all remains to be seen. That's what Obama's investigation is for.
And if there is nothing to this, why is Trump so eager for everyone to forget it?


Exactly, it remains to be seen. As in there's no proof. Which is what I have been saying all along. So US policy under Obama is to kick a bunch of Russian families out of their homes at Christmas time as payback over something that remains to be seen. And I heard Trump said he was going to make an official statement regarding the hacking and sanctions today or Wednesday, so that doesn't sound like he dodging the subject. And he already said, "it could have been Russia". He's certainly going to have to deal with the sanction mess when he's president, which I'm sure was part of Obama's obstruction plan.


Again, our intelligence agencies say Russian hackers were involved in a coordinated effort. I am going to trust them long before I trust Trump.


That means the plan is working. On some at least.


Or maybe it means Trump is too shame faced to admit he got help from Putin.


Or maybe it means Obama is too full of crap to produce any non-anonymous sources or any solid evidence.



EzraS
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 24 Sep 2013
Gender: Male
Posts: 27,828
Location: Twin Peaks

04 Jan 2017, 3:54 am

Kiprobalhato wrote:
EzraS wrote:
I'd expect Russian intelligence to run something more sophisticated than a phishing scam a high school student could pull off from anywhere.

And I take it that the hacking war involving the Ukrainians people of the Baltic States was considerably more sophisticated than the world's oldest and most basic phishing scam.


"the world's oldest and most basic phishing scam" has apparently gotten russian intelligence the exact result they were hoping for.

in that case, why would they need to do something more elaborate?


What I'm asking is, if Russian intelligence has such a long history of cyber warfare, does this fit in with their standard methods of operation? Also, the reason why they would utilize more sophisticated methods, would be to cover up how such information was obtained, which I believe is one of the key components of espionage.

Of course all this is hypothetical since Obama has not and will never provide tangible sources or proof. Not that he has too. He already knows how gullible most of society is.