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The_Face_of_Boo
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10 Oct 2019, 12:11 am

VegetableMan wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
I seem to remember it was a Republican President, congress, and senate that got us in this whole mess in the first place.


The whole mess started when Obama was in office.


Obama never invaded Iraq when we were attacked by Muslim religious fanatics in Afghanistan.


Yeah, but he took us from two to seven wars in the Middle East. I'm sure you'll give him a pass for that. What about the war in Yemen, where we aiding Saudia Arabia as they commit genocide in that country? If you care about the genocide of the Turks, surely you have harsh words for Obama for that one.

Bush is a war criminal, and so is Obama.



The Yemen war was a Saudi decision; the US helped them out of shared interests.



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10 Oct 2019, 12:55 am

beneficii wrote:
Trump expects that the ISIS fighters he effectively set free with his actions this week to make their way to Europe, which doesn't concern him:

https://thehill.com/policy/defense/4651 ... -to-europe

These ISIS fighters had been imprisoned by our Kurdish allies, who Trump stabbed in the back. Since the Kurds are now having to protect themselves from getting bombed, they can't watch their prisoners anymore and so the prisoners are getting out.

Trump justifies this by asking where were the Kurds when we were invading Normandy during World War II?

https://thehill.com/homenews/administra ... n-normandy

So because the Kurds don't have a country and couldn't help us in World War II, now ISIS fighters will get to escape to Europe.


Most of them are from Europe anyway.

Syrian Kurds have been offered a truce. The world doesn't need US phony liberal tears and babysitting.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.haaret ... -1.7959175


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10 Oct 2019, 1:25 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
I believe the Roman Emperor, Julian the Apostate, had settled Frankish prisoners of war in Flanders and the rest of Belgium, and made them allies on Roman soil..


Yes I've mentioned before that Vortigern the last Celtic king of Britain appealed to the Romans for troops to stave off incursions from the pagan Picts in the north after the Romans retreated from Britain in the 5th Century AD. It's my strong belief that the Romans sent these Germanic troops (the ones you mention) who may have been Roman mercanaries to help Vortigern. Coincidentally the venerable Bede records in the 5th century AD the two brothers Hengist and Horsa and their band of Anglo-Saxon mercanries were "invited" by Vortigern to quell the Picts. The rest is history. The Anglo-Saxons defeated the Picts and then turned on the Britons basically overunning the entire east of Britain which became England and thanks to these two enterprising (but Machiavellian) brothers we are now communicating in modern English on this forum.


Indeed.


I realise I was going off topic of this thread..but forgot to mention that the saxon mercanaries would have been trained in warfare by the Romans, so although they were numerically inferior to the british celts, they were far superior in open warfare and likely Vortigern's men would have been no match.



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10 Oct 2019, 1:31 am

cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
I believe the Roman Emperor, Julian the Apostate, had settled Frankish prisoners of war in Flanders and the rest of Belgium, and made them allies on Roman soil..


Yes I've mentioned before that Vortigern the last Celtic king of Britain appealed to the Romans for troops to stave off incursions from the pagan Picts in the north after the Romans retreated from Britain in the 5th Century AD. It's my strong belief that the Romans sent these Germanic troops (the ones you mention) who may have been Roman mercanaries to help Vortigern. Coincidentally the venerable Bede records in the 5th century AD the two brothers Hengist and Horsa and their band of Anglo-Saxon mercanries were "invited" by Vortigern to quell the Picts. The rest is history. The Anglo-Saxons defeated the Picts and then turned on the Britons basically overunning the entire east of Britain which became England and thanks to these two enterprising (but Machiavellian) brothers we are now communicating in modern English on this forum.


Indeed.


I realise I was going off topic of this thread..but forgot to mention that the saxon mercanaries would have been trained in warfare by the Romans, so although they were numerically inferior to the british celts, they were far superior in open warfare and likely Vortigern's men would have been no match.


Possibly. But I think the Romano-Britons would have had the same training.


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cyberdad
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10 Oct 2019, 1:32 am

beneficii wrote:
Trump expects that the ISIS fighters he effectively set free with his actions this week to make their way to Europe, which doesn't concern him:

https://thehill.com/policy/defense/4651 ... -to-europe

These ISIS fighters had been imprisoned by our Kurdish allies, who Trump stabbed in the back. Since the Kurds are now having to protect themselves from getting bombed, they can't watch their prisoners anymore and so the prisoners are getting out.

Trump justifies this by asking where were the Kurds when we were invading Normandy during World War II?

https://thehill.com/homenews/administra ... n-normandy

So because the Kurds don't have a country and couldn't help us in World War II, now ISIS fighters will get to escape to Europe.


To be fair, the US policy toward the Kurds has always been inconsistent long before the current idiot Trump. The Kurds didn't help their cause when they formed armed insurgents within Turkey (the PKK) who have killed civilians and resulted in them being proscribed by the US as a terrorist organisation. The Peshmurga in Syria and Iraq and the Turkish PKK are brothers in arms. Turkey used to be democratic and pro-American, they wanted badly to join NATO but the current Erdogan regime is somewhat fundamentalist so relations are likely strained.



cyberdad
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10 Oct 2019, 1:36 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
Possibly. But I think the Romano-Britons would have had the same training.


Vortigern and his immediate predecessors lived under "pax romana" so probably never saw active service except for the odd skirmish.

The Saxons (Angles, Saxons, Jutes and Friesians) who were invited by Vortigern were seasoned mercanaries who had probably had seen active combat all over the Roman empire.



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10 Oct 2019, 1:49 am

cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Possibly. But I think the Romano-Britons would have had the same training.


Vortigern and his immediate predecessors lived under "pax romana" so probably never saw active service except for the odd skirmish.

The Saxons (Angles, Saxons, Jutes and Friesians) who were invited by Vortigern were seasoned mercanaries who had probably had seen active combat all over the Roman empire.


Possibly. I do know that when Attila the Hun had threatened the west, Roman Britain did send troops to fight alongside the Roman army, and their allies the Franks, Visigoths, and others. Just how big this force was is anyone's guess. There is a thought the Romano-British commander might have been in part the later basis for the legendary King Arthur. This man had died fighting in Gaul, and - I sh*t you not - was said to have been buried in a place called Avalon (!).


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10 Oct 2019, 4:00 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Possibly. But I think the Romano-Britons would have had the same training.


Vortigern and his immediate predecessors lived under "pax romana" so probably never saw active service except for the odd skirmish.

The Saxons (Angles, Saxons, Jutes and Friesians) who were invited by Vortigern were seasoned mercanaries who had probably had seen active combat all over the Roman empire.


Possibly. I do know that when Attila the Hun had threatened the west, Roman Britain did send troops to fight alongside the Roman army, and their allies the Franks, Visigoths, and others. Just how big this force was is anyone's guess. There is a thought the Romano-British commander might have been in part the later basis for the legendary King Arthur. This man had died fighting in Gaul, and - I sh*t you not - was said to have been buried in a place called Avalon (!).


Yes The Romans used the Sarmatians as mercanaries to fight the huns, often because they were equally good horseman to the huns. I think there's a lot of scope for the Arthurian legends revolving around a heroic Romanised Briton. Ultimately the Saxons hitched a ride across the English channel and some point made it theirs to control given the sea across northern Britain was named "Anglesea". I think it's possible they blockaded trade for the British people which might have also weakened the British romanised celts...hard to say as nothing was written down for another 200 years by the venerable Bede?



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10 Oct 2019, 9:48 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
I seem to remember it was a Republican President, congress, and senate that got us in this whole mess in the first place.


The whole mess started when Obama was in office.


Obama never invaded Iraq when we were attacked by Muslim religious fanatics in Afghanistan.


Yeah, but he took us from two to seven wars in the Middle East. I'm sure you'll give him a pass for that. What about the war in Yemen, where we aiding Saudia Arabia as they commit genocide in that country? If you care about the genocide of the Turks, surely you have harsh words for Obama for that one.

Bush is a war criminal, and so is Obama.


Yes, absolutely, Obama should have known better. And you should have known better than to have solely blamed Obama while giving Bush and the Republicans a pass. It was Bush who had gotten us into the region in the first place.
Besides, who seriously would have thought removing Qaddafi in the first place would have turned out so wrong?


We've f*****g around in the Middle East for decades. I don't give anyone a pass. You should know better than to differentiate between Dems and Pubs, because it doesn't matter who is power. Both will serve the Military Industrial Complex.


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beneficii
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10 Oct 2019, 10:00 am

VegetableMan wrote:
We've f*****g around in the Middle East for decades. I don't give anyone a pass. You should know better than to differentiate between Dems and Pubs, because it doesn't matter who is power. Both will serve the Military Industrial Complex.


Your view is way too black and white.


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10 Oct 2019, 11:57 am

This was from twitter so obviously hard to verify it is not fake news.

Fox news special correspondent Jennifer Griffen:
I just spoke to a distraught US Special Forces soldier who is among the 1000 or so US troops in Syria tonight who is serving alongside the SDF Kurdish forces. It was one of the hardest phone calls I have ever taken.

"I am ashamed for the first time in my career."

We met every single security agreement. The Kurds met every single agreement. There was NO threat to the Turks - NONE - from this side of the border." "This is insanity," the concerned US service member told me. ""I don't know what they call atrocities but they are happening“

This American soldier told me the Kurds have not left their positions guarding the ISIS prisoners. In fact "they prevented a prison break last night without us."
"They are not abandoning our side (yet)."
The Kurds are "pleading for our support." We are doing "nothing."

Troops on the ground in Syria and their commanders were "surprised" by the decision Sunday night.
Of the President's decision: "He doesn't understand the problem. He doesn't understand the repercussions of this. Erdogan is an Islamist, not a level headed actor."

Acc to this US soldier on the ground tonight in Syria: "The Kurds are as close to Western thinking in the Middle East as anyone. "It's a shame. It's horrible." "This is not helping the ISIS fight." Re: ISIS prisoners: "Many of them will be free in the coming days and weeks."

This US Special Forces soldier wanted me to know: "The Kurds are sticking by us. No other partner I have ever dealt with would stand by us."
Disappointed in the decisions coming from their senior leaders.


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10 Oct 2019, 12:00 pm

Hopefully, someone will get Trump to change his mind.



JohnPowell
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10 Oct 2019, 12:09 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
Hopefully, someone will get Trump to change his mind.


F**k no. He needs to be strong and get the US out of the Middle East. Syria does not want you in their country and you have no right to be there.


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JohnPowell
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10 Oct 2019, 12:11 pm

Should just give the ISIS fighters over to the Syrians.


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10 Oct 2019, 12:12 pm

beneficii wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
We've f*****g around in the Middle East for decades. I don't give anyone a pass. You should know better than to differentiate between Dems and Pubs, because it doesn't matter who is power. Both will serve the Military Industrial Complex.


Your view is way too black and white.


No it's not, it's true! What you mean is you make excuses when your team does it. And it's sickening.


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10 Oct 2019, 3:43 pm

VegetableMan wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
I seem to remember it was a Republican President, congress, and senate that got us in this whole mess in the first place.


The whole mess started when Obama was in office.


Obama never invaded Iraq when we were attacked by Muslim religious fanatics in Afghanistan.


Yeah, but he took us from two to seven wars in the Middle East. I'm sure you'll give him a pass for that. What about the war in Yemen, where we aiding Saudia Arabia as they commit genocide in that country? If you care about the genocide of the Turks, surely you have harsh words for Obama for that one.

Bush is a war criminal, and so is Obama.


Yes, absolutely, Obama should have known better. And you should have known better than to have solely blamed Obama while giving Bush and the Republicans a pass. It was Bush who had gotten us into the region in the first place.
Besides, who seriously would have thought removing Qaddafi in the first place would have turned out so wrong?


We've f*****g around in the Middle East for decades. I don't give anyone a pass. You should know better than to differentiate between Dems and Pubs, because it doesn't matter who is power. Both will serve the Military Industrial Complex.


It was you who initially had put the whole blame on Obama.


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