Criminality & debt along partisan lines

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Kraichgauer
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01 Jan 2020, 5:22 am

TheRobotLives wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
TheRobotLives wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:

Right.

"Under this proposed rule, people whose gross income is 130 percent above the federal poverty line (slightly more than $16,000 for one person) or have more than $2,250 in assets, will no longer qualify to receive federal food benefits"

However, $16,000 + $12, 400 (standard deduction) + any other tax deductions.

So, a little more than $28, 400 for a single person.

Of course, more with children, more for a spouse.

A family with children could make $50,000 and still qualify.


Are you taking into account cost of living and medical coverage? Because those things can, and often do, leave people destitute.

At that income level, they likely get free ACA health care too.


Which is comparatively recent, and which the Republicans have been trying to destroy.


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EzraS
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01 Jan 2020, 5:39 am

TheRobotLives wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
TheRobotLives wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:

Right.

"Under this proposed rule, people whose gross income is 130 percent above the federal poverty line (slightly more than $16,000 for one person) or have more than $2,250 in assets, will no longer qualify to receive federal food benefits"

However, $16,000 + $12, 400 (standard deduction) + any other tax deductions.

So, a little more than $28, 400 for a single person.

Of course, more with children, more for a spouse.

A family with children could make $50,000 and still qualify.


Are you taking into account cost of living and medical coverage? Because those things can, and often do, leave people destitute.

At that income level, they likely get free ACA health care too.


Not if their employer provides a high premium, sky high deductible, low coverage healthcare insurance plan for them. When that is the case they do not qualify for a subsidy.



TheRobotLives
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01 Jan 2020, 6:07 am

EzraS wrote:
TheRobotLives wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
TheRobotLives wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:

Right.

"Under this proposed rule, people whose gross income is 130 percent above the federal poverty line (slightly more than $16,000 for one person) or have more than $2,250 in assets, will no longer qualify to receive federal food benefits"

However, $16,000 + $12, 400 (standard deduction) + any other tax deductions.

So, a little more than $28, 400 for a single person.

Of course, more with children, more for a spouse.

A family with children could make $50,000 and still qualify.


Are you taking into account cost of living and medical coverage? Because those things can, and often do, leave people destitute.

At that income level, they likely get free ACA health care too.


Not if their employer provides a high premium, sky high deductible, low coverage healthcare insurance plan for them. When that is the case they do not qualify for a subsidy.

Here is the answer ...

A. What happens if I decline my health insurance through my employer?
"If you decline individual health insurance through your employer, you can enroll in an Obamacare plan through the Marketplace"

You will only be able to qualify for cost savings if the following applies:

1. Your employer-sponsored health plan doesn’t meet the “minimum value standard.”

"If your employer-provided plan does not include substantial coverage (including physician and inpatient hospital services), it doesn’t meet the standards. And if it doesn’t pay for at least 60% of covered medical costs, it won’t either"

2. The cheapest plan through your employer costs more than a certain percentage of your household income.

https://www.healthsherpa.com/blog/can-i ... insurance/


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EzraS
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01 Jan 2020, 6:15 am

From what I saw the Obamacare plans were about the same as the employer plans.



TheRobotLives
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01 Jan 2020, 6:21 am

EzraS wrote:
From what I saw the Obamacare plans were about the same as the employer plans.

I think so, so it's unaffordable for most who don't get subsidies.

It's called "the unaffordable act".


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01 Jan 2020, 7:22 am

Meanwhile, the rest of the first world thinks it’s insane that you allow both of your political parties to continue preventing you from having basic nationalized healthcare. Now that’s a crime both parties have committed - but again, way more so republicans as at least Obama tried & May have done better if it weren’t for republican opposition.


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01 Jan 2020, 9:21 am

goldfish21 wrote:
Meanwhile, the rest of the first world thinks it’s insane that you allow both of your political parties to continue preventing you from having basic nationalized healthcare. Now that’s a crime both parties have committed - but again, way more so republicans as at least Obama tried & May have done better if it weren’t for republican opposition.


I don't know if you have noticed, but the citizens of the US who vote Republican don't usually tend to care what the rest of the first world thinks. You should be harassing your government to stop treating the first nations people in your country like second class citizens. Canada bends over backwards for every other of color/race/religion/creed/nationality except the aboriginal population of its own. And this isn't a thing of the past, your country is still doing this and you know they are still doing it. Please, don't try an diminish your superior knowledge of all things political and the cure for autism with a cheap comeback like, 'prove it.' I just watched a news report on it less than a week ago.

And the statistics you're so proud of don't demonstrate if the suits are legitimate. They only demonstrate the vindictive nature of Democrats who file suit when they don't win the general elections.


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TheRobotLives
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01 Jan 2020, 1:29 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
Meanwhile, the rest of the first world thinks it’s insane that you allow both of your political parties to continue preventing you from having basic nationalized healthcare. Now that’s a crime both parties have committed - but again, way more so republicans as at least Obama tried & May have done better if it weren’t for republican opposition.

Government health care likely results in broader yet, poorer, and less immediately available care.

Canada is infamous for their "waitlists" where people wait many months (years) for surgery.

Frustrated by long waits, some Canadians are heading to the U.S. for medical treatment.
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countr ... ealth-care

"Waitlists" for like knee and hip surgery are unheard of in the US.

There are doctors everywhere ready to do surgery on you next week, *if you can pay*.

Canadian health care is brutal as to make these people wait months (years) in pain.

My local dentists won't take US government patients (Medicare) for the same reason. The US government doesn't pay enough.


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goldfish21
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01 Jan 2020, 9:08 pm

TheRobotLives wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Meanwhile, the rest of the first world thinks it’s insane that you allow both of your political parties to continue preventing you from having basic nationalized healthcare. Now that’s a crime both parties have committed - but again, way more so republicans as at least Obama tried & May have done better if it weren’t for republican opposition.

Government health care likely results in broader yet, poorer, and less immediately available care.

Canada is infamous for their "waitlists" where people wait many months (years) for surgery.

Frustrated by long waits, some Canadians are heading to the U.S. for medical treatment.
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countr ... ealth-care

"Waitlists" for like knee and hip surgery are unheard of in the US.

There are doctors everywhere ready to do surgery on you next week, *if you can pay*.

Canadian health care is brutal as to make these people wait months (years) in pain.

My local dentists won't take US government patients (Medicare) for the same reason. The US government doesn't pay enough.


People can’t wait for surgeries, but they don’t go bankrupt paying for them.

Also, people don’t get sick and die because they can’t afford to go to a clinic or an ER or pay an exorbitant ambulance fee.

Overall, on average, Canadians have better coverage than Americans at a lower price. There’s a reason that no other country on Earth aspires to copy the American healthcare system.


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Persephone29
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01 Jan 2020, 10:41 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
TheRobotLives wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Meanwhile, the rest of the first world thinks it’s insane that you allow both of your political parties to continue preventing you from having basic nationalized healthcare. Now that’s a crime both parties have committed - but again, way more so republicans as at least Obama tried & May have done better if it weren’t for republican opposition.

Government health care likely results in broader yet, poorer, and less immediately available care.

Canada is infamous for their "waitlists" where people wait many months (years) for surgery.

Frustrated by long waits, some Canadians are heading to the U.S. for medical treatment.
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countr ... ealth-care

"Waitlists" for like knee and hip surgery are unheard of in the US.

There are doctors everywhere ready to do surgery on you next week, *if you can pay*.

Canadian health care is brutal as to make these people wait months (years) in pain.

My local dentists won't take US government patients (Medicare) for the same reason. The US government doesn't pay enough.


People can’t wait for surgeries, but they don’t go bankrupt paying for them.

Also, people don’t get sick and die because they can’t afford to go to a clinic or an ER or pay an exorbitant ambulance fee.

Overall, on average, Canadians have better coverage than Americans at a lower price. There’s a reason that no other country on Earth aspires to copy the American healthcare system.



I really don't recall trying to inspire others. The US healthcare system is what it is. Those who don't like it should adapt or move.


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goldfish21
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02 Jan 2020, 12:41 am

:roll:

Persephone29 wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
TheRobotLives wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Meanwhile, the rest of the first world thinks it’s insane that you allow both of your political parties to continue preventing you from having basic nationalized healthcare. Now that’s a crime both parties have committed - but again, way more so republicans as at least Obama tried & May have done better if it weren’t for republican opposition.


Government health care likely results in broader yet, poorer, and less immediately available care.

Canada is infamous for their "waitlists" where people wait many months (years) for surgery.

Frustrated by long waits, some Canadians are heading to the U.S. for medical treatment.
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countr ... ealth-care

"Waitlists" for like knee and hip surgery are unheard of in the US.

There are doctors everywhere ready to do surgery on you next week, *if you can pay*.

Canadian health care is brutal as to make these people wait months (years) in pain.

My local dentists won't take US government patients (Medicare) for the same reason. The US government doesn't pay enough.


People can’t wait for surgeries, but they don’t go bankrupt paying for them.

Also, people don’t get sick and die because they can’t afford to go to a clinic or an ER or pay an exorbitant ambulance fee.

Overall, on average, Canadians have better coverage than Americans at a lower price. There’s a reason that no other country on Earth aspires to copy the American healthcare system.



I really don't recall trying to inspire others. The US healthcare system is what it is. Those who don't like it should adapt or move.


Did you really not get my post? :?

The reason it isn’t copied is that it’s terrible and no one else wants anything like it.

Why wouldn’t Americans be want better basic care for all at lower prices? It boggles the mind.


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Persephone29
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02 Jan 2020, 2:21 am

goldfish21 wrote:
:roll:
Persephone29 wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
TheRobotLives wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Meanwhile, the rest of the first world thinks it’s insane that you allow both of your political parties to continue preventing you from having basic nationalized healthcare. Now that’s a crime both parties have committed - but again, way more so republicans as at least Obama tried & May have done better if it weren’t for republican opposition.


Government health care likely results in broader yet, poorer, and less immediately available care.

Canada is infamous for their "waitlists" where people wait many months (years) for surgery.

Frustrated by long waits, some Canadians are heading to the U.S. for medical treatment.
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countr ... ealth-care

"Waitlists" for like knee and hip surgery are unheard of in the US.

There are doctors everywhere ready to do surgery on you next week, *if you can pay*.

Canadian health care is brutal as to make these people wait months (years) in pain.

My local dentists won't take US government patients (Medicare) for the same reason. The US government doesn't pay enough.


People can’t wait for surgeries, but they don’t go bankrupt paying for them.

Also, people don’t get sick and die because they can’t afford to go to a clinic or an ER or pay an exorbitant ambulance fee.

Overall, on average, Canadians have better coverage than Americans at a lower price. There’s a reason that no other country on Earth aspires to copy the American healthcare system.



I really don't recall trying to inspire others. The US healthcare system is what it is. Those who don't like it should adapt or move.


Did you really not get my post? :?

The reason it isn’t copied is that it’s terrible and no one else wants anything like it.

Why wouldn’t Americans be want better basic care for all at lower prices? It boggles the mind.



It's my experience that you get what you pay for.


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Kraichgauer
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02 Jan 2020, 4:06 am

goldfish21 wrote:
:roll:
Persephone29 wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
TheRobotLives wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Meanwhile, the rest of the first world thinks it’s insane that you allow both of your political parties to continue preventing you from having basic nationalized healthcare. Now that’s a crime both parties have committed - but again, way more so republicans as at least Obama tried & May have done better if it weren’t for republican opposition.


Government health care likely results in broader yet, poorer, and less immediately available care.

Canada is infamous for their "waitlists" where people wait many months (years) for surgery.

Frustrated by long waits, some Canadians are heading to the U.S. for medical treatment.
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countr ... ealth-care

"Waitlists" for like knee and hip surgery are unheard of in the US.

There are doctors everywhere ready to do surgery on you next week, *if you can pay*.

Canadian health care is brutal as to make these people wait months (years) in pain.

My local dentists won't take US government patients (Medicare) for the same reason. The US government doesn't pay enough.


People can’t wait for surgeries, but they don’t go bankrupt paying for them.

Also, people don’t get sick and die because they can’t afford to go to a clinic or an ER or pay an exorbitant ambulance fee.

Overall, on average, Canadians have better coverage than Americans at a lower price. There’s a reason that no other country on Earth aspires to copy the American healthcare system.



I really don't recall trying to inspire others. The US healthcare system is what it is. Those who don't like it should adapt or move.


Did you really not get my post? :?

The reason it isn’t copied is that it’s terrible and no one else wants anything like it.

Why wouldn’t Americans be want better basic care for all at lower prices? It boggles the mind.


Can't speak for Persephone or the Robot, but I'd like nothing more than the best healthcare that's either free or of a reasonable cost.


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Persephone29
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02 Jan 2020, 11:16 am

I don't want what you have, I want what I have.

It's never an option when discussing Universal Healthcare to leave the people who are doing fine alone. It's always take what they have away from them and give back the same thing to everyone.

Why is it not acceptable to leave the people who don't need it alone? And do whatever for the people who do? I'll tell you why, because you're gonna tax the s**t outta me for it (in addition to your very reasonable premium) and the people who were always paying nothing, will continue paying nothing because they are 'less fortunate, vulnerable, etc...'

Meanwhile, they kick back and have zero stress because what's the point? It's not like they have bills to pay. While the rest of us who feel it's moral to at least try to meet standards assigned to us lose our hair, have heart attacks and other stress associated illness. And the least among us have zero pressure...

Excuse my french, but f**k that.I'll raise their blood pressure and they can keel over dead at 1 year prior to retirement, just like the rest of us.


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kraftiekortie
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02 Jan 2020, 11:37 am

You should have "what you've got," too.

Canada allows one to either use their public system, or a private health care provider.

I believe other nations with national health care also have this option.

It was wrong, under Obamacare, to deny people their old insurances.



Kraichgauer
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02 Jan 2020, 5:57 pm

Persephone29 wrote:
I don't want what you have, I want what I have.

It's never an option when discussing Universal Healthcare to leave the people who are doing fine alone. It's always take what they have away from them and give back the same thing to everyone.

Why is it not acceptable to leave the people who don't need it alone? And do whatever for the people who do? I'll tell you why, because you're gonna tax the s**t outta me for it (in addition to your very reasonable premium) and the people who were always paying nothing, will continue paying nothing because they are 'less fortunate, vulnerable, etc...'

Meanwhile, they kick back and have zero stress because what's the point? It's not like they have bills to pay. While the rest of us who feel it's moral to at least try to meet standards assigned to us lose our hair, have heart attacks and other stress associated illness. And the least among us have zero pressure...

Excuse my french, but f**k that.I'll raise their blood pressure and they can keel over dead at 1 year prior to retirement, just like the rest of us.


Well, some us us consider having healthcare to be a right, not a privilege.
And yes, poor people do have bills to pay, which is why they too often don't have enough left over for medical care.
I thought that the right was supposed to be so pro-life. Being pro-life means more than just caring about a person's welfare before they're born and after they die, but not in between.
It has absolutely nothing to do with morality to try getting by without help. If you need help, there isn't anything immoral about it.
Trust me, the needy lose their hair and have heart conditions due to stress as much or more than anyone else.
Pardon my French, but F*CK the tax payers! Public assistance gets only a small portion of revenue collected by the government, and yet gets the lion share of blame for the tax burden.


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