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Cornflake
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31 May 2021, 8:32 am

The_Znof wrote:
Deliberately fake or paraphrased?
Deliberately mis-paraphrased? :lol:
Mikah wrote:
To be fair to the meme maker, what is paraphrased is heavily implied in what she says in the word-for-word quote.
Nope - the point the word-for-word quote makes is, in reference to criticism of her "fuzzy math", that [people] "being precisely, factually, and semantically correct" can mean the greater, moral point is missed. On Cooper's challenge she goes on to emphasise factual correctness: "It's absolutely important".

It could have been put better (at least then it might have avoided being "mis-memed") but the meme quote nevertheless implies as factual something she didn't say to make a cheap, misleading, anti-AOC political dig: 'See - she just doesn't care about facts, only about being right!'.


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Pepe
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31 May 2021, 4:32 pm

Mikah wrote:
Cornflake wrote:
Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez: If people want to really blow up one figure here or one word there, I would argue that they're missing the forest for the trees. I think that there's a lot of people more concerned about being precisely, factually, and semantically correct than about being morally right.


To be fair to the meme maker, what is paraphrased is heavily implied in what she says in the word-for-word quote.


QFT.

I also noted, that when AOC realised her gaffe, she back-peddled @ 100 miles per hour.
A true politician. :mrgreen:



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31 May 2021, 4:33 pm

Quote:
Lefties make ‘handbrake U-turn’: Yesterday's COVID-19 ‘conspiracy theory’ is now ‘perfectly feasible’
30/05/2021|6min

Sky News host Rowan Dean says “yesterday's conspiracy theory” about the Wuhan lab leak theory is now “perfectly feasible and highly likely” despite being previously dismissed as “heresy”.

“Long before anyone else was talking about it secretary Pompeo also told Outsiders about his suspicions that the bat soup story was baloney and the virus had leaked from a Wuhan biotech lab,” Mr Dean said.

“Facebook and social media were soon censoring anyone who dared even suggest the virus came from a Chinese biotech lab, and, of course, the devious American COVID adviser Dr Anthony Fauci, the director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, dismissed any such suggestion, presumably because it came from Donald Trump.

“Now, a year later, Facebook and all the lefties have done a massive handbrake U-turn, and what was yesterday's conspiracy theory is now perfectly feasible and highly likely.

“All these issues we raised on this show months ago now finally being picked up by the mainstream media.”

Mr Dean said the previous US administration suspected the virus had come “not only from a Chinese lab but a Chinese weapons lab”, yet the Biden administration immediately closed down that investigation.

“We also learned this week that one of the first actions of Joe Biden's presidency was to cancel a special secret US investigation set up late last year by Mike Pompeo to determine whether or not the coronavirus was actually the result of China's biotech weapons programs,” Mr Dean said.

“You have to ask yourself, why? What were they afraid of? What did they think it might have uncovered? Was Dr Fauci involved in that decision?” Mr Dean said.

“Xi Jinping's legitimacy and leadership could come into question within China because of this.”

https://www.skynews.com.au/details/_625 ... 20feasible



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31 May 2021, 4:37 pm

Quote:
US COVID-19 adviser Dr Anthony Fauci supported virus experiments
29/05/2021|1min

America's top COVID-19 medical adviser has been revealed to have supported contagious virus experiments before the pandemic.

Dr Anthony Fauci argued the benefits of experimenting on contagious viruses was worth the risk of a laboratory accident, calling it 'important work'.

United States President Biden has backed an inquiry into the origins of COVID which some fear may have been caused by contentious gain-of function experiments in a Wuhan laboratory.

These experiments often, with bat-derived coronaviruses, manipulate, splice, and recombine viruses.

https://www.skynews.com.au/details/_625 ... xperiments



Cornflake
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31 May 2021, 4:38 pm

:roll: You can lead a horse to water, you can even fetch it a glass and a straw - but you still can't make it drink.

It's difficult to add any meaning to this other than what it says: "I think that there's a lot of people more concerned about being precisely, factually, and semantically correct than about being morally right."

What do you think it says, Pepe? C'mon, break it down for me.


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31 May 2021, 4:43 pm

Quote:
‘Worst cover up in history’: CNN jump on lab leak theory bandwagon
31/05/2021|6min

Texas lawmaker Michael McCaul says the origins of COVID-19 is the “worst coverup in human history," as mainstream media are backing an investigation into the theory after a year of dismissing it.

“Let me say this is the worst cover up in human history,” Mr McCaul told CNN.

“Resulting in 3.5 million deaths, creating economic devastation around the globe.

“It was just declassified that three of the researchers were actually hospitalised in November 2019 with flu like symptoms consistent with COVID.”

Last week President Biden issued a 90 day directive for intelligence agencies to investigate two origin theories including that the virus could have come from a Chinese lab.

Mr McCaul said the move was "long overdue" because China had "destroyed everything at the lab".

Mainstream media hesitated from reporting the theory, one that President Trump had backed, and frequently slammed outlets that did.

CNN’s Chris Cuomo falsely claimed the theory was a “newer” notion and something the US government hadn’t pursed yet.

However, the anchor reported the theory back in April 2020 and called it a “story to watch”.

https://www.skynews.com.au/details/_625 ... 0bandwagon



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31 May 2021, 5:02 pm

Cornflake wrote:


What do you think it says, Pepe? C'mon, break it down for me.


sorry to but in but this is too much fun. :P

it says Subjectivity is Truth :twisted:



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01 Jun 2021, 6:37 am

^ And avoiding basic analysis at all costs is king. :roll:


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01 Jun 2021, 9:38 am

From day one, I really wanted to believe this virus had occurred naturally. Who wants the prospect of a war with a super power increased? It's looked pretty obvious for a while though for anybody following sensible conversations between people willing to look at and understand the evidence, rather than listening to the media, that Covid-19 probably has come out of a lab and, if that is the case, then it's only a stone's throw between a leak and a deliberate release.

If it is a leak, then it isn't a great look for science in this particular field in terms of safety and public trust, which may impact on funding and profits. I hope it was a leak and not deliberate for the same reason I'd hoped it was natural, but if it was deliberate, it was deliberate, there is no good going to come from pretending otherwise. Either way, there's a situation that needs to be addressed and dealt with, not wasting more time trying to cover up the truth.



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01 Jun 2021, 11:01 am

Cornflake wrote:
:roll: You can lead a horse to water, you can even fetch it a glass and a straw - but you still can't make it drink.

It's difficult to add any meaning to this other than what it says: "I think that there's a lot of people more concerned about being precisely, factually, and semantically correct than about being morally right."

What do you think it says, Pepe? C'mon, break it down for me.


Simplified: She said there's a lot of people more concerned with A over B.

So either, to her, it's a good thing that people prefer A over B, or it's a bad thing that people prefer A over B (the 3rd alternative, that neither is more important than the alternative, would have had no need for "a lot of people": Had that been her message, then she would have said "There's a group who prefer A and a group who prefer B - both views are equally valuable")

Therefore either she's saying:
It's good that a lot of people prefer being factually correct over being morally right. (Which, paraphrased, is "being factually correct is more important than being morally right")
Or:
It's bad that a lot of people prefer being correct over being morally right. (Which, paraphrased, is "It's more important to be morally right than factually correct")

Which you believe is the intended message would probably depend on whether you see her as primarily appealing to people's emotions, or to their intellect when presenting issues.

Of course, maybe you have a different view (I don't recall seeing what you believe was meant, despite asking others to explain it to you), so it would be interesting to see how you interpret her message...



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01 Jun 2021, 12:35 pm

Brictoria wrote:
Of course, maybe you have a different view (I don't recall seeing what you believe was meant, despite asking others to explain it to you), so it would be interesting to see how you interpret her message...
viewtopic.php?f=21&t=397239&p=8797088#p8796291

Sources (also posted earlier):
Anderson Cooper/AOC interview wrote:
Anderson Cooper: One of the criticisms of you is that— that your math is fuzzy. The Washington Post recently awarded you four Pinocchios—

Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez: Oh my goodness—

Anderson Cooper: —for misstating some statistics about Pentagon spending?

Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez: If people want to really blow up one figure here or one word there, I would argue that they're missing the forest for the trees. I think that there's a lot of people more concerned about being precisely, factually, and semantically correct than about being morally right.

Anderson Cooper: But being factually correct is important—

Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez: It's absolutely important. And whenever I make a mistake. I say, "Okay, this was clumsy." and then I restate what my point was. But it's— it's not the same thing as— as the president lying about immigrants. It's not the same thing, at all.

The full transcript from 2019: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/alexandria ... 019-01-06/
Video of the quoted part: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-LZeklv9lQ


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The_Znof
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01 Jun 2021, 3:43 pm

Cornflake wrote:
^ And avoiding basic analysis at all costs is king. :roll:


Yes, so read the whole book before you laugh.

Lessing has said If God held all truth enclosed in his right hand, and in his left hand the one and only ever-striving drive for truth, even with the corollary of erring forever and ever, and if he were to say to me: Choose!—I would humbly fall down to him at his left hand and say: Father, give! Pure truth is indeed only for you alone!

http://sorenkierkegaard.org/concluding- ... cript.html

ps - I thought my [recent] posting history may be controiversial, but that I would be seen as an evil bot, not one who avoids analysis. and btw your a dog. :wink:

can you be a good dog and change my snowy owl to "evil bot" :?:

pps - the only time i did get called out it was for calling sombody a bot! and not an evil bot like me! now you see I mean the slang meaning in not as mean a way as most use it,



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01 Jun 2021, 3:57 pm

I have no idea what you're talking about. I was responding to/about a meme featuring AOC, earlier, not you personally. I rather thought my response following yours was in basic agreement, so my apologies if that's not how it came across.

Sadly the only way of changing a rank is by posting and unfortunately, it doesn't include a bot of any type. :wink:


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The_Znof
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01 Jun 2021, 4:05 pm

its mostly my fault for assimilating AOC to Kierkegaard, when it is becoming increasingly clear to me she is no Kierkegaard.

And I like birds way more than bots, so its all good till you turn me into some s**t creature.

and speak of the devil :twisted: I am caught up in controversy [similar topic nother thread] as usual. Ill try to keep it informative and civil :mrgreen:

Edit: in the case of pentagon spending, I would say it is immoral to botch stats, as pentagon staff will jump all over that to their advantage. If she cant do the math hire she should hire someone better and get it checked by lots of people.



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01 Jun 2021, 4:11 pm

The_Znof wrote:
its mostly my fault for assimilating AOC to Kierkegaard, when it is becoming increasingly clear to me she is no Kierkegaard.
Well strictly speaking (aka "pedantically" :wink: ) no-one is Kierkegaard except possibly what's left of him. :nerdy:
Quote:
and speak of the devil :twisted: I am caught up in controversy [similar topic nother thread] as usual. Ill try to keep it informative and civil :mrgreen:
:thumright:


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01 Jun 2021, 8:19 pm

Cornflake wrote:
Brictoria wrote:
Of course, maybe you have a different view (I don't recall seeing what you believe was meant, despite asking others to explain it to you), so it would be interesting to see how you interpret her message...
viewtopic.php?f=21&t=397239&p=8797088#p8796291


So, let's try and translate:
Cornflake wrote:
Nope - the point the word-for-word quote makes is, in reference to criticism of her "fuzzy math", that [people] "being precisely, factually, and semantically correct" can mean the greater, moral point is missed.

This sounds like you have interpreted her words to mean that she sees the emphasis on being factually correct, at the expence of being "morally correct" as being a bad thing, given this would be the only way the "greater, moral point" coud be missed...

Cornflake wrote:
On Cooper's challenge she goes on to emphasise factual correctness: "It's absolutely important".

Again, this appears to be claiming she acknowledges that being factually correct is "important" - But it is noteworthy that neither she nor you clarify whether she sees the "factual" as being as valuable as (or more, or less than) the "moral", leaving us with the impression from her initial remark - Just because A is more important than B doesn't mean B is not important...

To illustrate in simple terms:
People need oxygen and water (among other things) to survive.
Are both important - Yes.
A person would die without oxygen before they would die without water.
So, oxygen must be more important.
Does oxygen being more important than water mean water is not\no longer important?

Cornflake wrote:
It could have been put better (at least then it might have avoided being "mis-memed") but the meme quote nevertheless implies as factual something she didn't say to make a cheap, misleading, anti-AOC political dig: 'See - she just doesn't care about facts, only about being right!'.


You seem to be the only person here asserting that she doesn't care about facts... Nothing was said about not caring about facts: Just that in order of importance, she appeared to be valuing "moral" correctness over "factual" correctness.

So, unless my translation of what you have claimed here is mistaken, we are back to "It's more important to be morally right than factually correct" - Nothing in there states that being "factually correct" is a bad thing, or that it is not important, merely that being "morally right" is of higher importance\value to her ("more important").