"The science around this virus is settled,"

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kitesandtrainsandcats
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25 Jan 2021, 4:37 pm

The science is settled?

Seriously?

We actually now know everything we need to know about Covid 19?

Quote:
""The science around this virus is settled, and if we can all wear masks and be very smart about congregating, and not do it unless it's necessary, washing our hands, doing that social distancing, we will be in a strong position in a few weeks," Whitmer said during a press conference. "


https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/ ... 668851002/


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25 Jan 2021, 4:40 pm

kitesandtrainsandcats wrote:
The science is settled?  Seriously?  We actually now know everything we need to know about Covid 19?
Why, do you know some facts that the rest of us do not know?


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kitesandtrainsandcats
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25 Jan 2021, 4:48 pm

What I know is that in a section of The Model Rocketry Forum the several model rocket hobbyists who are currently practicing civilian and military doctors are saying we still have things to learn about this virus.


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kitesandtrainsandcats
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25 Jan 2021, 4:51 pm

Now, granted, this from the British Medical Journal was October 2020 and not 2 milliseconds ago,

Quote:
George Davey Smith, professor in clinical epidemiology1, Michael Blastland, writer and broadcaster2, Marcus Munafò, professor of biological psychology1

1University of Bristol, Bristol, UK
2Winton Centre for Risk and Evidence Communication, Centre for Mathematical Sciences, University of Cambridge, Cambridge, UK

Correspondence to: G Davey Smith PA-ieudirector{at}bristol.ac.uk

The more certain someone is about covid-19, the less you should trust them


https://www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m3979


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kitesandtrainsandcats
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25 Jan 2021, 4:55 pm

And this likewise is not from merely a few nanoseconds ago, it is from, Nov. 17, 2020 https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-con ... t-20490351

[b]Many long-term COVID-19 effects still unknown

Much is still unknown about how COVID-19 will affect people over time. However, researchers recommend that doctors closely monitor people who have had COVID-19 to see how their organs are functioning after recovery.[/b]


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kitesandtrainsandcats
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25 Jan 2021, 5:00 pm

From what the currently practicing physicians on the covid section of the Rocketry Forum were saying this morning, this debate mentioned in November has not ended,

Quote:
Thus, the incidence of cardiac involvement with COVID-19 infection continues to be debated.

https://www.eplabdigest.com/cardiac-con ... ted-waters

And the active duty military physician was saying that is a real concern for the military since though not professional atheletes, military members engage in operations and physical fitness which require sometimes intense athletic activity.


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Fnord
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25 Jan 2021, 5:06 pm

Heck, when you out it that way, "we" are still learning things about the cold virus!  So why all the fear?


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kitesandtrainsandcats
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25 Jan 2021, 5:09 pm

Fnord wrote:
kitesandtrainsandcats wrote:
The science is settled?  Seriously?  We actually now know everything we need to know about Covid 19?
Why, do you know some facts that the rest of us do not know?

Go back and logically think this through for a minute: by definition the science isn't settled since we can not yet know the long term effects of having had the virus.


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kitesandtrainsandcats
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25 Jan 2021, 5:24 pm

Fnord wrote:
Heck, when you out it that way, "we" are still learning things about the cold virus!  So why all the fear?

That is something which those who have all the fear will have to provide a response for.

When I am watching and participating in conversation with currently practicing physicians who are actively treating covid patients, and at least one who is currently recovering from covid himself, and they are talking about things still unknown about covid 19, that leads me to regard a politician who says "the science around this virus is settled", as either ignorant, as lying through their teeth, or as an idiot, or some combination of those.


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naturalplastic
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25 Jan 2021, 7:03 pm

kitesandtrainsandcats wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Heck, when you out it that way, "we" are still learning things about the cold virus!  So why all the fear?

That is something which those who have all the fear will have to provide a response for.

When I am watching and participating in conversation with currently practicing physicians who are actively treating covid patients, and at least one who is currently recovering from covid himself, and they are talking about things still unknown about covid 19, that leads me to regard a politician who says "the science around this virus is settled", as either ignorant, as lying through their teeth, or as an idiot, or some combination of those.


You gotta check your autism once in a while. The guy is a politician, so he is addressing the aspects of the disease that have become politicized.

The pol said that "the science around" [the aspects of the disease that he was talking about] ...which is the topic of how the thing is spread "are settled". He was saying "masks...distancing...washing your hands" works and are vital to slow the spread of the pandemic (ie "dont let anyone tell you the guidelines arent good guidelines"). And I think that is basically right that that stuff IS indeed settled. But it's that aspect (social distancing and masks etc) that are what have become politicized. So thats why he, a politician, is talking about it.

In typical autistic fashion you took him too literally, and took him to mean "we now know everything about it- not just about how its spread- but about every damn thing about it". Further you -went on to imply that this virus could screw up people even worse than most now suspect- by permanently damaging your lungs- if you engage in athletic occupations like the military. If that guy heard you say that he would reply "so you think that this virus is even worse than I thought it was?...all the more reason that its settled that we need to practice social distancing and wear masks like I just said- thanks for agreeing with me!". :D



kitesandtrainsandcats
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25 Jan 2021, 7:53 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
Further you -went on to imply that this virus could screw up people even worse than most now suspect- by permanently damaging your lungs- if you engage in athletic occupations like the military.


... and even if you do not,

https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/ ... -the-lungs

Quote:
What Coronavirus Does to the Lungs
Panagis Galiatsatos, M.D., M.H.S.

Like other respiratory illnesses, COVID-19, the disease caused by the new coronavirus, can cause lasting lung damage. As we continue to learn about COVID-19, we’re understanding more regarding how it affects the lungs while people are sick and after recovery.

Panagis Galiatsatos, M.D., M.H.S., is an expert on lung disease at Johns Hopkins Bayview Medical Center and sees patients with COVID-19. He explains some of the short- and long-term lung problems brought on by the new coronavirus.

What type of damage can coronavirus cause in the lungs?


and,

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-02598-6
Quote:
The lung scans were the first sign of trouble. In the early weeks of the coronavirus pandemic, clinical radiologist Ali Gholamrezanezhad began to notice that some people who had cleared their COVID-19 infection still had distinct signs of damage. “Unfortunately, sometimes the scar never goes away,” he says.

Gholamrezanezhad, at the University of Southern California in Los Angeles, and his team started tracking patients in January using computed tomography (CT) scanning to study their lungs. They followed up on 33 of them more than a month later, and their as-yet-unpublished data suggest that more than one-third had tissue death that has led to visible scars. The team plans to follow the group for several years.
...
Evidence from people infected with other coronaviruses suggests that the damage will linger for some. A study3 published in February recorded long-term lung harm from SARS, which is caused by SARS-CoV-1. Between 2003 and 2018, Peixun Zhang at Peking University People’s Hospital in Beijing and his colleagues tracked the health of 71 people who had been hospitalized with SARS. Even after 15 years, 4.6% still had visible lesions on their lungs, and 38% had reduced diffusion capacity, meaning that their lungs were poor at transferring oxygen into the blood and removing carbon dioxide from it.


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naturalplastic
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25 Jan 2021, 8:39 pm

Like I said ...all of the more reason to agree with the guy.

But I get what you're saying. That covid may not be something to sneeze at, no pun intended.



kraftiekortie
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25 Jan 2021, 9:08 pm

I don’t mean to be technical—but Michigan’s governor is a woman.



kitesandtrainsandcats
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25 Jan 2021, 9:17 pm

For those who would prefer something from this month of this year,

Quote:
One of the craved answers scientists seek is the fate of COVID-19 patients’ lungs, but studies and doctors’ experiences so far don’t paint too bright a picture.

“I don’t know who needs to hear this, but ‘post-COVID’ lungs look worse than ANY type of terrible smoker’s lungs we’ve ever seen,” Texas trauma surgeon Dr. Brittany Bankhead-Kendall wrote in a Jan. 4 tweet that has garnered over 7,000 “likes.”

“And they collapse. And they clot off. And the shortness of breath lingers on... & on... & on,” she added.

Quote:
I don’t know who needs to hear this, but “post-Covid” lungs look worse than ANY type of terrible smoker’s lungs we’ve ever seen.

And they collapse. And they clot off.

And the shortness of breath lingers on... & on... & on.
— Brittany Bankhead-Kendall MD (@BKendallMD) January 4, 2021


https://www.miamiherald.com/news/corona ... 51985.html

Quote:
What about COVID-19 hurts the lungs?

Not all is known about how the coronavirus attacks multiple organs in the body, including the heart, brain and lungs, but scientists do know the disease can cause pneumonia, acute respiratory distress syndrome (ARDS) or sepsis — all of which have been shown to cause severe lung damage.


naturalplastic wrote:
you -went on to imply that this virus could screw up people even worse than most now suspect- by permanently damaging your lungs- if you engage in athletic occupations like the military.


Again, I am not "implying"; and, it does not matter whether or not the person is in the military.


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kraftiekortie
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25 Jan 2021, 9:34 pm

I had COVID. No lung damage for me.

There’s been LOTS of tragic deaths and debility from COVID....but many people have also recovered successfully from it.

Can’t wait for the Johnson and Johnson vaccine to come out. It can be stored in a fridge, and is only one dose.



kitesandtrainsandcats
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25 Jan 2021, 10:12 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
There’s been LOTS of tragic deaths and debility from COVID....but many people have also recovered successfully from it.

Am glad you recovered and are still here!
One of my uncles died of complications from covid.
My sister-in-law recovered from covid.
There is uncertainty whether my 80 year old diabetic Mom had covid, last summer she tested positive then a week later tested negative. Which test was the false result?
Anyway, she is still here and remains a stubborn midwestern farm girl, though not a farmer. (she was a dietitian) :D


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