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Anyone Keeping Up With the January 6th Riot?

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Dox47
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12 Aug 2021, 4:38 pm

kokopelli wrote:
There is nothing about the guy that makes me think that he has any interest at all in making even the slightest effort to comply with the court's orders. All he wants to do is have his own way no matter what. But then, if he's been excused from complying with everyone all his life because he is special. That makes him a spoiled brat, not a freedom fighter.


Do you know him personally? You're speaking about him as if you know more about him than could be gleaned from the news reports.


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kokopelli
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12 Aug 2021, 6:45 pm

Dox47 wrote:
kokopelli wrote:
There is nothing about the guy that makes me think that he has any interest at all in making even the slightest effort to comply with the court's orders. All he wants to do is have his own way no matter what. But then, if he's been excused from complying with everyone all his life because he is special. That makes him a spoiled brat, not a freedom fighter.


Do you know him personally? You're speaking about him as if you know more about him than could be gleaned from the news reports.


From the news reports:
Quote:
In court filings, prosecutors said Goodwyn had multiple violations of the conditions of his release and that he challenged instruction from the PSA by "using word games, and becoming easily frustrated, angry and negative."

"The defendant's multiple violations appear to be centered primarily around one issue: the defendant's petulant and insolent behavior," prosecutors told the judge. "In lieu of complying with the Court's conditions, the defendant has flouted the conditions, making clear that he does not appreciate the privilege of pretrial release provided to him by the Court."

That tends to make it very clear that Goodwyn has been brought up to feel that he is special and does not need to comply with the court.



Dox47
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12 Aug 2021, 6:54 pm

kokopelli wrote:
From the news reports:
Quote:
In court filings, prosecutors said Goodwyn had multiple violations of the conditions of his release and that he challenged instruction from the PSA by "using word games, and becoming easily frustrated, angry and negative."

"The defendant's multiple violations appear to be centered primarily around one issue: the defendant's petulant and insolent behavior," prosecutors told the judge. "In lieu of complying with the Court's conditions, the defendant has flouted the conditions, making clear that he does not appreciate the privilege of pretrial release provided to him by the Court."

That tends to make it very clear that Goodwyn has been brought up to feel that he is special and does not need to comply with the court.


Yes, I already explained to you that the prosecutor is not a credible source and why, anything else?


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kokopelli
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12 Aug 2021, 9:24 pm

Dox47 wrote:
kokopelli wrote:
From the news reports:
Quote:
In court filings, prosecutors said Goodwyn had multiple violations of the conditions of his release and that he challenged instruction from the PSA by "using word games, and becoming easily frustrated, angry and negative."

"The defendant's multiple violations appear to be centered primarily around one issue: the defendant's petulant and insolent behavior," prosecutors told the judge. "In lieu of complying with the Court's conditions, the defendant has flouted the conditions, making clear that he does not appreciate the privilege of pretrial release provided to him by the Court."

That tends to make it very clear that Goodwyn has been brought up to feel that he is special and does not need to comply with the court.


Yes, I already explained to you that the prosecutor is not a credible source and why, anything else?


Did you see the phrase "in court filings"? A prosecutor may or may not be credible in some cases, but lying to a judge in court filings is a highly career limiting move for any lawyer including a prosecutor.



Dox47
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12 Aug 2021, 10:16 pm

kokopelli wrote:
Did you see the phrase "in court filings"? A prosecutor may or may not be credible in some cases, but lying to a judge in court filings is a highly career limiting move for any lawyer including a prosecutor.


Have you ever read court filings before? The prosecutor always describes the defendant as the worst person in the world who is going to go on a mass puppy kicking spree if the judge grants them bail, while the defense claims their client was about to cure cancer and invent a perpetual motion machine before the false arrest, it's all BS, not actually factual. Criminal justice reform is one of my pet issues, so I read a lot of these, and I hate to see people buying into the overly punitive mindset because of the politics involved, or otherwise pre-judging, it offends my sense of fairness, especially when the defense is already massively handicapped next to the powers of the government on prosecution.


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12 Aug 2021, 11:17 pm

Dox47 wrote:
kokopelli wrote:
Did you see the phrase "in court filings"? A prosecutor may or may not be credible in some cases, but lying to a judge in court filings is a highly career limiting move for any lawyer including a prosecutor.


Have you ever read court filings before? The prosecutor always describes the defendant as the worst person in the world who is going to go on a mass puppy kicking spree if the judge grants them bail, while the defense claims their client was about to cure cancer and invent a perpetual motion machine before the false arrest, it's all BS, not actually factual. Criminal justice reform is one of my pet issues, so I read a lot of these, and I hate to see people buying into the overly punitive mindset because of the politics involved, or otherwise pre-judging, it offends my sense of fairness, especially when the defense is already massively handicapped next to the powers of the government on prosecution.

The other detail people seem to miss is that the prosecutors (and defence) have no requirement to supply all facts in their filings, and so only include facts (or portions of information) which support their side, while ignoring anything that may weaken it.

As a result you end up with a large amount of the media reporting solely on one side of the case, leading the majority of the public to believe that is the entire case, and coming to conclusions based upon a subset of the relevent information. This both causes confusion should the verdict not align with their beliefs based on the restricted information they had, as well as a reluctance (bordering on inability at times) to believe\accept facts that were not included\aligned with their inital encounter with the case (a belief that "if it was true, it would have been reported in <insert media>", as it wasn't, it's "made up").

There are 2 sides to every story, yet many refuse to look beyond the first they see.



Dox47
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13 Aug 2021, 1:15 am

Brictoria wrote:
As a result you end up with a large amount of the media reporting solely on one side of the case, leading the majority of the public to believe that is the entire case, and coming to conclusions based upon a subset of the relevent information. This both causes confusion should the verdict not align with their beliefs based on the restricted information they had, as well as a reluctance (bordering on inability at times) to believe\accept facts that were not included\aligned with their inital encounter with the case (a belief that "if it was true, it would have been reported in <insert media>", as it wasn't, it's "made up").

There are 2 sides to every story, yet many refuse to look beyond the first they see.


Were you here the the Trayvon Martin incident? I think that was the worst I've ever seen with people who weren't familiar with the relevant case-law just spouting nonsense, while the handful of us that follow this stuff and can read legal documents were all "George is going to walk", and then it was surprised Pikachu all around when he did. I expect a similar trajectory whenever Kyle Rittenhouse goes to trial, that should be fun. :lol:


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13 Aug 2021, 1:20 am

https://www.yahoo.com/huffpost/tucker-c ... 50472.html

Here's another reason to hate that smarmy rich boy, (F)ucker Carlson. Shows a total lack of empathy for the legitimate fears of another human being.


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13 Aug 2021, 2:09 am

sometimes
imagine, it's not in my history(yt)



cyberdad
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13 Aug 2021, 3:41 am

Brictoria wrote:
There are 2 sides to every story, yet many refuse to look beyond the first they see.


Unless I am mistaken and you are veering way off the topic thread (like some other posters) what defence do the capitol rioters (many of whom were carrying rope for lynching congressmen whom they blame for enabling fabricated electoral fraud) have that warrants the public to examine another another side to their story??

Please feel free to share OR if I was mistaken then carry on derailing this thread.



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13 Aug 2021, 3:43 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
https://www.yahoo.com/huffpost/tucker-carlson-mocks-alexandria-ocasio-042350472.html

Here's another reason to hate that smarmy rich boy, (F)ucker Carlson. Shows a total lack of empathy for the legitimate fears of another human being.


I'm sure if it was his daughter he'd be singing another tune.



Last edited by Cornflake on 13 Aug 2021, 9:40 am, edited 1 time in total.: Removed generalised attack on political identity

envirozentinel
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13 Aug 2021, 3:45 am

@Kraichgauer: Interesting, as we have a few members of WP who have been through sexual assault and thus it is highly offensive to them when that gets trivialized, which has occasionally happened in the past. So this Carlson guy has no business with a heartless response like that. The sort of response you'd expect from a certain straight males who don't care to educate themselves about empathizing with women.


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Kraichgauer
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13 Aug 2021, 3:54 am

envirozentinel wrote:
@Kraichgauer: Interesting, as we have a few members of WP who have been through sexual assault and thus it is highly offensive to them when that gets trivialized, which has occasionally happened in the past. So this Carlson guy has no business with a heartless response like that. The sort of response you'd expect from a certain straight males who don't care to educate themselves about empathizing with women.


I absolutely agree. I posted the article in question because I saw red while reading it.


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13 Aug 2021, 3:55 am

cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
https://www.yahoo.com/huffpost/tucker-carlson-mocks-alexandria-ocasio-042350472.html

Here's another reason to hate that smarmy rich boy, (F)ucker Carlson. Shows a total lack of empathy for the legitimate fears of another human being.


I'm sure if it was his daughter he'd be singing another tune.


I hope there are right wingers who are much more decent than Carlson.


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cyberdad
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13 Aug 2021, 3:57 am

envirozentinel wrote:
@Kraichgauer: Interesting, as we have a few members of WP who have been through sexual assault and thus it is highly offensive to them when that gets trivialized, which has occasionally happened in the past. So this Carlson guy has no business with a heartless response like that. The sort of response you'd expect from a certain straight males who don't care to educate themselves about empathizing with women.


And yet he's allowed to, encouraged and celebrated by his many supporters....every night his audience is some 4.33 million Americans. His twitter following is even bigger.



cyberdad
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13 Aug 2021, 3:57 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
https://www.yahoo.com/huffpost/tucker-carlson-mocks-alexandria-ocasio-042350472.html

Here's another reason to hate that smarmy rich boy, (F)ucker Carlson. Shows a total lack of empathy for the legitimate fears of another human being.


I'm sure if it was his daughter he'd be singing another tune.


I hope there are right wingers who are much more decent than Carlson.


They seem to be awfully quiet these days...