No honor

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r00tb33r
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25 Feb 2022, 7:23 am

https://www.yahoo.com/now/live-updates-ukrainian-military-battles-064016216.html

Quote:

The Kremlin says it will analyze the Ukrainian president’s offer to discuss a non-aligned status for his country, as a Russian military invasion pushes closer to Kyiv.

Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelenskyy said he was ready to hold talks on the issue.

Asked about Zelenskyy’s offer, Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov on Friday described it as “a move in a positive direction.”

He said in a conference call with reporters that “we paid attention to that, and now we need to analyze it.”

But Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said Zelenskyy “is simply lying” when he offers to discuss non-aligned status for Ukraine.

Lavrov said at a briefing that Zelenskyy “missed the opportunity” to discuss a neutral status for Ukraine when Russian President Vladimir Putin proposed it.

Putin says the West left him no option but to invade when it rejected Moscow’s demand to keep Ukraine out of NATO.

That's funny. A week earlier Zelenksky was demanding a timeframe from NATO for the membership. At this point, he'll say anything to just stay in power. No honor.

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magz
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25 Feb 2022, 7:57 am

I guess what Russians are doing in Ukraine right now is very honorable :roll:

What's unhonorable in holding talks, anyway?

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r00tb33r
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25 Feb 2022, 8:09 am

magz wrote:

What's unhonorable in holding talks, anyway?

In America we've got the expression "that ship has sailed."

I know Zelensky is a comedian but it doesn't seem Putin is planning on keeping him around as the court jester.

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magz
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25 Feb 2022, 8:38 am

Are you supporting the invasion?

Will it be unhonorable of Russians if they talk with Zelenski anyway?

They claim they want to meet in Belarus - I wouldn't agree to this in place of Ukrainians. Not after the plane to Vilnus kidnapping.

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r00tb33r
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25 Feb 2022, 8:54 am

Zelensky should put some spine into his decision.

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kraftiekortie
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25 Feb 2022, 8:55 am

Zelensky wants to put bullets into the spines of those Russian invaders.

r00tb33r
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25 Feb 2022, 9:03 am

kraftiekortie wrote:

Zelensky wants to put bullets into the spines of those Russian invaders.

Would be fair for him to take some responsibility for it. It was his failure after all to negotiate a peaceful solution to the security situation in the region.

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kraftiekortie
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25 Feb 2022, 9:04 am

Putin was going to do what he did, regardless....

r00tb33r
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25 Feb 2022, 9:14 am

kraftiekortie wrote:

Putin was going to do what he did, regardless....

That's likely half true. It's much more convenient as an independent puppet state. According to an interview I've read with Putin's former spokesperson the decision to invade was likely made 2 months ago.

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magz
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25 Feb 2022, 11:23 am

r00tb33r wrote:

an independent puppet state.

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The_Face_of_Boo
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25 Feb 2022, 12:15 pm

What's all about this Putin fandom in America?

Isn't your gf Romanian btw? I doubt she likes Putin.

magz
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25 Feb 2022, 12:26 pm

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:

What's all about this Putin fandom in America?

I'm curious myself.

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Misslizard
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25 Feb 2022, 2:23 pm

I don’t know any Putin fans here.

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Matrix Glitch
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25 Feb 2022, 2:55 pm

Sometimes simply not seeing someone as Satan himself gets viewed as fandom.

VegetableMan
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25 Feb 2022, 3:20 pm

Matrix Glitch wrote:

Sometimes simply not seeing someone as Satan himself gets viewed as fandom.

Black and white thinking. Looking at the bigger picture will get you demonized, especially in this hyperpartisan political environment.

Nobody's hands are clean in this crisis.

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roronoa79
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25 Feb 2022, 3:20 pm

Honestly non-aligned status could be the best Ukraine could hope for at this point. Being Finlandized is better than being a de jure puppet state.

There is no dishonor in seeking terms with an enemy you have no chance of beating. What exactly would Zelenskyy do if he "put his spine" into this decision? Order all civilians and military to fight until there is nothing left to defend? Ukraine will lose. Anyone with half a brain can see that. Defiance will only prolong the suffering of the people of Ukraine.

I don't know the specifics of rootb33r's politics, but many here in the US who are fans of Putin wish there was a conservative leader here more like Putin. That is: a competent, feared, unapologetic "strong man" nationalist who triggers the libs. They may hate Putin for opposing US interests, but they love his flouting of western liberals and progressives. They wish the US had a leader who was as feared by his enemies domestic and abroad in the same way Putin is.

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Δυνατὰ δὲ οἱ προύχοντες πράσσουσι καὶ οἱ ἀσθενεῖς ξυγχωροῦσιν.
Those with power do what their power permits, and the weak can only acquiesce.
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