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Actually, I think that you have a decent understanding of yourself. I tend to think that I have a decent understanding of myself too, but who knows? Everybody probably could stand to understand himself or herself even better.


You're totally right about this. I had the hardest time understanding my problems with my AS friend, and it was not until I had a very detailed discussion with Remnant about it in a different thread, that I got a much better understanding of the situation. It was because Remnant's experiences were very similar to my friend's, and his ability to put my friend's perspective in different words (as well as being able to use the 3rd person instead of 1st) helped me to appreciate what my friend probably was doing, and how exactly I was unknowingly making the situation worse.

It's near impossible to learn anything from other people if they are exactly like us. It's much easier to learn from people who have a different point of view, as long as we keep an open mind.


One big caveat to this is that it's possible to overanalyze a problem, to the point that one might stay awake at night, thinking bad thoughts, thinking one way and then another way and not really sure what's right... becoming mentally lost. Trapped with no knowledge of how to proceed in your train of thought, or how to convert your thoughts into reality.

No man is an island, even an AS island. Those people you can learn from and respect, those people who truly understand you and you understand them, those people can help you face your problems. And if you are willing to help them face their problems, then you're an unbeatable team. My friend and I were once an unbeatable team, but we eventually crumbled because we failed to continue to support each other.


The more viewpoints you understand, the more your viewpoints become an amalgamation of all the (what you consider to be) positive aspects of those viewpoints. I think this is a totally acceptable and reasonable way to incorporate one's experiences into his or her own life. If something "better" comes along, there's no reason to stick to something "worse."

i think that a lot of people around here take something i say in jest personally.. i dunno about the rest of you but whatever's said to me i would first consider the situation of the person saying it.

it's pretty obvious that myself and some others including snake either have aspergers for REAL or we have a particularly severe case of it... however no one over here seems to give a s**t about that and read everything we say in the worst possible light...

and some of you guys really need to stop gloating about all your stupid relationships... it's f*****g PAINFUL to read, just like snake said. anyways it's pretty late over here and i need some sleep so i'm going to read this thread properly tomorrow

I have no opinion about whether you or snake321 have AS or not, and frankly, my opinion of that does not matter. But what I can say is that it's important to distinguish between what is due directly to AS, and what is a reaction to other people's responses to your AS. Telling the difference between these primary and secondary effects is critical to being able to resolve AS-related issues.


I don't think that they are gloating. They talk about their past and present relationships to discuss problems they have had, or to explain how they are able to keep their relationships (sometimes barely) afloat. If it is painful to read, that might suggest that you are reeling from your own problems with relationships, and don't like the thought that other people might have better (though perhaps only marginally) success with it than you have had so far. If that is the case, then it will probably be more helpful to you if you focus on what is causing the problems in your own relationships, and afterwards you can determine for yourself the best course of action towards remedying the problems. It's not necessary to compare yourself to others, but rather to gain insight in other people's experiences, so that you might be able to improve your own. That's what WP is for, after all. I hope you have a pleasant night!

Not being able to get a relationship might not be a definer of AS, but I think we can all agree that feeling absurdly and deeply lonely is.

So what? I don't think it matters.

Not being able to get a relationship with a fraction of the ease that most NTs do is a definer for males. Many of us who really have it are indefinately alone for life, a few might defeat the odds here and there but even then it's after years of studying and self-programming NT mating rituals into our behaviors. And even then we still can't do it as good as NTs, because we're not NT. However, I doubt very seriously that if one of the lucky aspie men's woman left him, that he'd find very many (if any) more opportunities.

You still don't see the possibility?

Almost everyone loves music, I live for music. Therefore its quite easy to see that someones passion can draw others in, despite misunderstanding.

You know how difficult it is for me to do what I've done? No you don't! It took so much of my energy that I had nothing left, I had to destroy any chance of making friends in order to pursue a partner.

The first girl I was with came to me, I was terrified, but I learnt from her WHY she was attracted to me, and used that in future endevours, simple no?

Frequency of relationships, whether many, or none, is irrelavent.

Every girl I've been with had serious issues, and maybe I actually pursued them and they me because I could logically help them with their problems?

No I didn't find many opportunities, I MADE opportunities.

I'm truly sorry if it hurts you.

But no, it is not a definer for males, its a definer for certain males.

No one IRL understands me, the communication gap was what actually drew women to me in the past, believe it or not they actually went after the silent, anti-rules personality, I didn't know why until recently either.

However, just because I can't socialise, you really think it means I can't impress them? I'm obsessed with science so I'll share knowledge, my obsession with music inspires them (I offered to teach guitar to every girl I've been with)

You don't know the specifics, you don't know that every time we were together it was silent most the time as they struggled to speak to me, you don't know that each one dumped me after a few months as they got bored of fighting to understand.

Why don't you stop assuming?

Your situation does not define AS.

That is right.

I'm lonely even with partners because they will never understand how hard it is for me to communicate..

I learnt a long time ago how to create an image, and though it greatly drains me it managed to help me attract people in the beginning, I didn't know how though, I just read somewhere bout confidence and applied that knowledge.

I stated 3-4 times that it was VERY difficult for me to get relationships.

I also mentioned that the first girl approached me at 14, she told me later that it was because I was totally oblivious to the rest of the kids around.

Each relationship I've had I learnt exactly why they were attracted, and added that to my image by practicing.

I know I had to learn logically how to relate, it was never natural for me.

THAT is the definer, not whether I fail to create relationships or succeed.

You don't think it might be the hateful anti-success anti-happyness feelings that cause you to fail?

Addtional:

The psych gains nothing extra money-wise by diagnosing me as AS.

Neither does the pharmaceutical company.

Neither does the government.

I know what I am, at least in terms of this definition, this is the last I'll say on this topic.

(though if you reply with a rehash of the same definition I'll no doubt be compelled to attempt rebuttal)

http://home.att.net/~ascaris1/Sad_aspies.html

I loved this article, I feel it holds particular relavence here.

I'm sorry if I've offended those that can't seem to find others or interest others in a way that creates the chance for a relationship.

I won't be posting about my issues with my partner anymore in forums, I'll keep it for private messaging.

I know for a fact that I can help many with what I've learnt, I used to force an image for myself which drained me incredibly. However through that I've learnt a lot about being myself, yet finding the ability to attract the opposite sex.

Thanks, I appreciate all your opinions, even the negative ones.

Ouch, that is harsh, but honestly I do agree with the general statement. I do think that once somebody is a victim for a long period of time, as somebody else on the forum put it, that person develops a persecution complex and may even begin to sabotage himself unknowingly. I'm not saying that any person in particular here does this, but I believe that it does happen to at least a small extent. And it's not limited to AS, it applies to any group (e.g. ethnic) that has been relatively powerless for a long period of time, and there's even a sociological term for it... but I am forgetting now what it is.

Scintillate is right, though, when he says that a definer of AS is the difficulty in relating to other people. Difficulties in empathy and considering other people's point of view (sometimes not even understanding that they have a mind of their own at all) are primary attributes of AS. They're part of what defines AS. These things result in problems in establishing or maintaining friendships and romantic relationships; these are secondary effects. Even the feeling of extreme loneliness, which en_una_isla broached, is a secondary effect. Please note that if an AS individual is able to learn empathy or perspective skills (learn being the operative word, since these skills are not intuitive to an AS individual), then the secondary effects might no longer persist, or they might change. So anybody who gets upset that one AS person experiences different secondary effects from another AS person needs to realize that each AS person's manifestation of primary effects is different. That, in turn, causes friendships and long-term relationships to be different.

It was too harsh, and I'm truly sorry about that, I let my emotions dictate my response.

I reluctantly give you the benefit of a doubt, for two reasons.... One being, if by chance what you are saying does in fact hold water, I could learn alot from you. Besides that, even if my presumption is correct, I still think you appear to be a very sensitive person, which means that you actually have empathy for people other than yourself (which is rare).
I also do think though, that aspies don't generally let emotion dictate thoughts. One of the main characteristics of AS is being over analytical and logical, this is why it's refferred to as the "male brain".... I don't mean that to sound in any way sexist, all NTs generally think with emotion, but females even moreso because of gender psychology.... The male and female brains actually do work differently (this also can be used to explain why males generally have a higher sex drive than females). But, there wasn't really a drop of emotional thoughts in any of my posts..
I also realise that you spoke of looking for problem girls (girls who have problems).... I also thought about this once, particularly rehabs and what not... My ex (my only gf to date), came from a psychotically over-religious pentacostal home, so I sort of appeared to her as a savior.... And, rather she ever knew it or not, she was equally a savior to me.... But I screwed up, I should have never left her..... I think I gave in to the fear of living in a bible belt town where I felt like a walking target to redneck lynch mobs because I was a "devil rocker" or a "long hair"..... I haven't heard from her ever since, this was about 3 yrs ago, but not a day goes by when I don't think about her and wonder if she's ok, what she's doing...... She sort of dropped contact with me when I left, at first I thought she was mad.... But the more I thought about it, I think she was more hurt..... Now I'm stuck with the guilt.

I....... I had gotten in contact with her again...... but I am somewhat afraid of talking about it because something terrible happened, and I still feel like it was my fault...... We almost got back together................... Some crazy _____ kidnapped her, raped her, and murdered her....... I.... I can't even type straight right now because whenever I think about this I feel like crying........ I wasn't there to protect her.... If I would not have left I would have been.......... I feel like such an @$$.......
You know something, I never thought I would be saying this, but my neighbor smokes crack.... I've always been against it, but on one hand I don't care rather I die or not anymore, and on the other hand, I can use it to block out my pain and dodge the heirarchy, because theyr just as low on the ladder as I am....... And I'm thinking about possibly going on a drug binge.

As a matter of fact this has led me to wanna study magick so I can hopefully find a way to contact her again....... I can't help but wonder if she's doing ok...... I miss her terribly..... that sob who did it is rotting in prison now, but nothing is going to bring her back..... and nobody will ever replace her..... she's always gonna live in my heart......... At this point I want to be able to move on, find someone else, she can never replace kayla but she can be the 1st (insert name).

I don't really talk about these things, I'm not really that comfortable discussing it....... I kinda wish I hadn't spoke of this mess...... Damn I'm confused...... Well if anyone wants a legit reason to pass judgement on me then I guess I've given you that much. Not sure why I wrote this but I did and I can't take it back now.