Now apparently my little brother wants to kill himself

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5 years? That is very significant actually. Maybe not if I was 45 and you were 50. But assuming you graduated high school at 18 and got a job soon after, you've been in the job market for almost 6 years. Me? Not even two years. And that's including the time I was a full time student for two semesters. I left college and got my fist full time job soon after on May 1st of last year. So looking at it that way I haven't even been in the job market for one single year.

Anyway, if you're just here to make useless and rude comments about my income and nothing about the topic you are posting in, please go away.

But happy birthday.

Rude? That was not rude. Being rude would be ridiculing you, by saying that you were poor based on your wage. All I did was state that your income seems a bit low to me, coming from a country that has a lower average income than the US.

Maybe you didn't do that directly. But basically what you told me is that you think my income is low (a fact I already acknowledged, it's not like I was bragging about it) for my age, because you make more and you're only a little older than me.

You are thinking that at my age, and apparently because I live in the US, I should be making more. But I'm not. So what you seem to be implying is that my brother is right about my "crappy job". You didn't say that so maybe I was wrong to come to that conclusion. But then why did you say anything? Even if it was not your intention, it's generally considered rude to tell someone you think their income is low, especially if you're saying it's because you make more than them. It seems like you are just bragging about how you are better than me.

My point is, if you weren't trying to brag or be rude, why did you say anything?

Quite a few people on these forums, it seems.

On a more serious note: if he will take neither your offer nor your advice - after repeated proposals - the best thing you can probably do is to remind him that it's there if he needs it, and leave it at that. Either he gets sick of his petulant fatalism, or he doesn't - the only thing anyone can do is to point him one way or the other. Truthfully I'm not surprised that he hasn't "grown out of it", even after twelve years; it's a deep and easy rut to walk into (and I speak from personal experience).

Preferably, he won't be offing himself in the meantime.


It may not have been rude, but it certainly was blunt. We're all a little touched here, so it's to be expected - but the fact that you focused only on L_Holmes' earnings (a sensitive topic in American culture), and how "low" they are at that, it's no surprise that he took offense.

Well age isn't actually a factor for higher income. It is a matter of experience or years with the company. I first started working when I was 21 and only was at the company for two years.

Yes. That's exactly what I said. Did you even read what I wrote? I'm only 19, which means I've only been graduated for 2 years (I graduated a bit early at 17), and I've only been working a full time job since May of last year because I was at college. You've been working since you were 21, that still gives you a full 2 years ahead of me. I'm already making over a dollar more hourly than I was last year because I switched to a better-paying job, and since got another raise, as well as getting more hours, and in the next few months I will have even more hours. Probably at least 8 overtime hours every week, since we are over-scheduled.

Plus, just because the average income of whatever country you're in is lower than the US doesn't mean that every person in the US will have a higher income than a person of equal income class in your country. Not only that, but individual circumstances are different for everyone, even within the same country.

Anyway, I'd be willing to bet that by the time I've been working 3 years like you, I'll either be ready to go back to school and get an education to get a much better job than the one I have now, or at the very least I will have moved up a lot in pay as a result of having 3+ years of experience with woodworking. I know guys with that amount of experience working here making twice as much as me or more.

By the way, if you are legitimately not being rude like you say, then I'm sorry for getting annoyed. It's just that what you said sounded a lot like what my brother said about my job. This is what he said to me, after calling me a loser and after I told him I didn't think I have a crappy job: "That's not even that much, I will have a better job than you when I'm that old I bet." And he totally meant offense by it. So it just sounded to me like you were confirming that. "Yes, it is a crappy job, and you are a loser."

I could understand you telling me it's not that much if I was trying to brag or something, like, "Yeah, I'm awesome because I make $1300 a month, AFTER taxes ". But I'd already specifically said I know that's not a lot, but it is a big improvement since my first part time job, and even since last year. Since I already acknowledged it isn't a lot, why else would you feel like telling me it's not very much, other than to rub it in my face and basically do what my brother is doing? I'm legitimately confused.

You could contact him regularly, weekly, by email, whatever works, just to see how he is... you could play video games with him online as another method of keeping in touch.

Well he was a jerk to me so I don't feel like talking to him now. I did text him a couple days ago and told him to not take out his pointless anger on me. He didn't apologize and basically told me he'd rather me stop talking to him, because he feels like I should just live my life and not care about him. That is, paraphrased, what he said to me.

I'm mad at him not only for that, but the fact that he doesn't even try. He insulted me for failing at college (which was because I was severely depressed along with having general difficulties functioning, as at the time I was not aware of Asperger's). I left by choice because I knew I was having too much trouble emotionally and it was only getting worse, and I couldn't even get any accommodations because I didn't have a diagnosis. So really it's inaccurate to say I failed out, because I didn't. I was only on academic probation, and I can still go back to the same school if I want.

But him, he just complains that he's not smart enough for anything and so he doesn't even try. He says it's impossible for him to do anything or have any friends, and it really pisses me off because he DOES have friends, or at least he did before they stopped liking him for being whiny and saying nobody likes him. And he's done perfectly fine in school. I'd say average grades probably, but that's not stupid. Besides, intelligence isn't everything, and I have told him that. I am a prime example. I got an almost perfect score on my ACT, yet I did poorly my senior year and terribly at college. I was trying but I was not prepared for it at all, and on top of that literally had no friends and was severely depressed.

It makes me angry that I still kept trying (I made it to the end of the second semester because I didn't want to just drop out in the middle) and basically complained to nobody except on Yahoo answers or my journal. STILL nobody in my family knows I've been suicidal at all, even recently. And here's my dumb little brother, acting like his life is just the worst thing ever, and he makes sure everybody knows it. He's mean to my mom, our other little brother, and now me, even though I'm his only friend according to him. I told him it's no wonder he doesn't have friends anymore.

And I'm not just being a jerk. I made suggestions to him when I texted him, telling him to maybe try going to a therapist, or hang out with our sister more since she lives nearby, or at least stop being a dick to everyone (though I said it nicely), and he literally just told me, "No." No reason why, he just didn't want to try any of it. Because nothing can improve his horrible life, boo hoo. It pisses me off.

Younger siblings eh... Sometimes they just need to learn for themselves.
If he is genuinely suicidal though, he might need a friend at some point. If you keep in touch with him, then at least he can talk with you if he needs to. Having said that, I dont think you should have to put up with him being nasty to you either.

How did you react when he said "Life sucks, I would seriously want to die."?



What holds you back from showing them what you wrote on wrongplanet?

My translation of what he said to you would be: in his opinion you are far more sociable than he is, and he thinks that being like you would solve most of his problems. (Hope you see the parallel.)
My interpretation: he is right with that he is less able to socialize than you and less able to communicate his feelings. Some percent of his suicide wish, and your mother telling you about it, might be out of sympathy (which makes it not less serious).
My advise: Try to keep some meaningful contact and show him the your wrongplanet threads. Consider him as a person in his own right with similar, but also quite different problems than yours. Stand the rest. (Just forget about the "looser" stuff a bit, it is not important).

Ahem, I am unemployed at the moment, I did not go to college and I only worked for two years. What kind of job do you work because maybe that could explain the income.

Are you still trying to say I don't make that much? Dude, my income is not even that low. I don't know where you live where you can get your first job paying almost twice what mine was but that is just not how it works for me. All the decent jobs require experience in that job, and I can't get experience if they don't hire me for the job so it's impossible. You either have to know the right people, or just get lucky, or look really hard to get the good jobs. Plus, if you need to get a job right away you don't really have the option to turn down an offer because it's apparently low paying. I don't have the luxury of checking around everywhere. And what person is going to hire an inexperienced 19 year old making 12 dollars an hour as starting pay? The only jobs I've seen pay like that for someone like me are temporary jobs. I need a regular job, I'm not quitting for a job I will have for a few months at the most.

If you've only worked two years, then how were you supporting yourself, or did somebody else support you?

I already said what I do for a job, but I'll be more specific if it really matters. I work at a custom cabinet shop staining and finishing wood.

Where do you live? And what job did you have? And more importantly how did you find this job?

Seriously though, you are starting to really irritate me. I don't appreciate you implying that I have a crappy job and that it's just that easy to get a better one. It's f*****g not. If it was, I would be going for that job. Do you get it now? 99% of the places I apply to don't respond, not even to tell me that they declined my application. They just never say anything. They make the application process so impersonal that I have no chance to explain that I think I can still learn this job despite my lack of experience. All I get is, "Do you have 6 months or more of experience in this job? No? Well have fun working at McDonald's." I don't know where you live so I don't know how it is there, but here, at least in my own experience in job searching, unless you know people or get really lucky, you're screwed. All they teach in classes is how to do well in interviews. Well what if nobody gave you interviews because you don't have all this experience, and they don't let you speak personally to the hiring manager, and they only ask yes or no questions on your applications?

It's not f*****g easy, ok? So either explain why you keep acting like you know something I don't, or back off.

I would never call him a loser. The fact that he was so quick to insult me like that and act like he's so much better than me, even though he himself thinks he's a loser, is extremely insulting. I'm sick of people acting like they can say or do whatever they want and disrespect me. I am generally too nice but if somebody is pushing me I will not tolerate it at all.

Like my stupid step dad, when I was 18 and moved out, I was visiting them and at one point he raised his fist at me, just because I was singing. I got pissed and told him he can't do a thing to me or he'll be in trouble with the police. He flipped out but he didn't hit me, he left.

Or when my friend's stupid cousin threatened to break something valuable of mine over a stupid Xbox controller which he claimed was his, even though I bought it. He ended up knocked flat on his back in the street.

In the past I put up with it. And people pushed me around. Well I'm done with that. I'm not going to let my bratty kid brother insult me after all I've done for his ungrateful sorry ass. If he really wanted me as a friend he wouldn't call me a loser, end of story. He can either apologize or continue to have no friends.

You have your own views, and as far as your financial situation/ job and flat is concerned it seems to be a pretty firm view (also a very reasonable view IMO, but my opinion is not so important). You take your brother too much as someone who is able to judge your situation. Although he clearly is not. He does not see the difficulties you have, and he does not understand the benefits of a rather minimalist lifestyle.

In your case, he is really the little brother and your are the big brother. You have more life experience and your are in a better position to judge, not only because it is your life and not his, but also because you are for once the one that is more mature (which is not only an age thing here).

His main reproach is probably not that you lead a "crappy life", but that you could do much better, and that you dont try. Your job is to make him understand that you cant do better for the moment, and that you do try something.
You should definitely tell him that you have a bigger depression and suicide thoughts, too, that you might have less trouble with socializing than him, but that this does by no way mean that your social contacts are anything close to satisfying for you. Tell him that in fact your social contacts are what they are. He is probably more on the spectrum than you are, and has serious problems with getting contacts, and would also be quite glad with rather superficial contacts for a start, so he will see your problem more as a luxury problem. Telling him that he should just have some social contacts is like telling you that you should just have better relationships to people. This does not mean anything, and is in fact rather annoying. Share your own puzzlement with him a bit.

As for his denigrating you, take it as an exercise in setting barriers. Call him like twice a week, and if he starts getting insulting, you tell him the first time that you dont want him to criticize your lifestyle (or not in this way, think about what you might be still willing to discuss, and what is unacceptable for you). And if he does not stop or restart you finish the conversation in a friendly way, telling him why you finish it, but also that you are going to call him in some days. Dont insist on an excuse, but if he manages it, even if only half way, show that you appreciate it.

There are ways of setting barriers that can be as effective as threatening your stepfather with the police, and far less extreme than knocking your cousin flat on the back in the street for an Xbox Controller he had taken for his. At the phone it is really easy, because you can stop at any time. The biggest barrier you can set is to stay cool and not take his judgement as valid, and the second biggest barrier (and often also a necessary one) is to get some distance between you and him. More in the sense of taking the cat down over and over again. Not in the sense of chasing it away or letting it starve.

P.S.: I would still be interested in an answer to my questions.