Subtle and Blatant Misogyny

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I think that people are capable of seeing things objectively even if they are frustrated and hurt. Feelings don't necessarily stop your brain from working.

My lack of sex is really doing a poor job at killing me.

When posting outside the haven, the best thing anyone can do is grow a thicker hide.

the same could be said for the people making sexist posts, if it is indeed fueled by rejection. perhaps a thicker hide would prevent them from blaming the opposite sex for their issues.

but it isn't so simple as that, which is why we have rules in place to protect members. there will always be people who put their desire to say _X_ ahead of other people's right to be protected on WP.

Still to read to the end of the thread, but I have to third this. I find it really quite frightening how men here objectify women, and don't even seem to realise what they're doing.

Every time I come to this forum, I get depressed about being female. The subtle misogyny is worse because it represents pervasive cultural memes rather than just individual angst.

I have nothing more to say.

It is both disheartening and relieving to see I'm not the only person here who sees it, and is affected by it. I have connected with people on the WP FB group who left due in part to the attitudes toward women, one who was a really active member who was harassed basically for being a female who some dude found attractive and thus hated her. I know some current members are seeking another place to be able to have discussions free of sort of stuff discussed within this thread.

I don't want to leave WP, or feel uncomfortable posting here, but the reason I feel relieved after seeing the responses in this thread is that if it's not just something that bothers me, if other people are also being affected by it then it is reasonable to try to reduce the things negatively affecting members.

The only thing that makes me doubt anything can be done about it is that it's such a difficult thing to approach. I really doubt most people saying things that are sexist or really offensive about any group of people are doing it to be INTENTIONALLY hateful. I think it is especially difficult to have a conversation in the actual thread it's happening in, even specifically describing a statement as sexist and objecting to it is usually perceived as a personal attack, and responded to with lengthy arguments about why it's not sexist or misogynistic, and then others join in to agree, and somehow the conversation turns into a debate about whether or not sexism toward women is a valid thing to complain about, because for everything that is bad for women, men have it just as bad or worse or whatever, and it turns into a conversation about how bad life is for males.

Trying to have a conversation about sexism at all always seems to turn into a conversation about how unfair life is for men, and it seems like the goal is to invalidate any complaints or difficulty women have, and make it all about males. It's frustrating, because no one is saying men don't have problems too, but if we can't even discuss what women go through, that's really not fair either.

rabbittss, I feel like you did something similar to this in this thread. I made a thread about misogyny, and you essentially tried to turn the conversation to how hard it is for aspie guys to get laid. I don't feel like this is the thread where that should be discussed, because it is in no way helpful for you to tell me "This is why it happens, and you can't do anything about it." blaming society, suggesting that complaining about it is useless and potentially harmful because it could lead to guys here becoming hateful toward me,(which is one of the problems, that already IS something I'm worried about) and then just arguing about sex and how it's a need or whatever. I don't wish to censor you or tell you what you should or shouldn't talk about on the board, but specifically in this thread, I feel like it's just kind of a jerky thing to do. I'm not saying that was your intention, I'm just telling you how it comes across to me. It's already hard to talk about this, which is why I did it in the Haven and tried to make it clear in my initial post that I wanted to avoid this sort of thing happening.

The reason I don't report blatant sexist comments to mods is that if I did I would be doing it every time I read the board and the mods do a lot already, I don't blame the mods or think it's a lack of effort on their part. I just feel like I would quickly become an annoyance. I also worry I would end up a target for sure if I repeatedly went to the mods about stuff that is sexist, because it's not something everyone finds offensive, thus it seems like I'm overreacting, in the eyes of many. I don't want to be specifically seen as a problem by some of the guys who specifically have been harsh in the past with members they labeled "feminazi" or whatever. I saw a specific poster just repeatedly have guys pile on in L&D and act like bullies basically. Their language was mild but I imagine if that happened to me every other time I made a post, I would probably not want to post.

I don't want people to hate me here, I don't need people to like me but I don't want people to act toward me as people have acted toward others in the past for frequently speaking out against sexist language. And I want to feel comfortable here and not feel like it's par for the course to see awful statements about an entire gender and see that they usually go unaddressed. This board is a great resource of people on the spectrum and even those who aren't on the spectrum, and I haven't come across another board quite like this one that relates to autism.

I do understand that a lot of guys here have problems, and I want them to feel comfortable talking about their problems, I want them to feel validated and know they're not alone and know they can seek advice or just vent etc. But when they include attacks on women or just blaming their problems on women, or commenting on a thread and taking everything said as an attack on men and getting defensive, saying hateful things about women etc. that can be incredibly uncomfortable for female members. I just don't even know what a solution could be. I wish there were a way to have a conversation about it without it being perceived as an attack on men to even say sexism exists.

Meems, I agree with everything you said in your last post. I love this forum, but there are days I don't want to come on here as I know exactly what I'm going to see.

Repeated threads on how single aspie men have it worse than single aspie women. Why can't we be united in the fact that we all struggle with matters of loneliness, bad flirting skills, shyness, wanting a partner or just casual sex but not getting anywhere... without having to make it into a competition of who has it worse?

Repeated threads on how man has approached woman in a way she hasn't taken well, and instead of him taking on board women telling him why this was a bad way to play it and how they'd like men to treat them instead, wailing that it's the woman who has the problem and has treated him so badly. There is a quite-disturbing thread on this right now.

The insistence on how "all women find all men creepy" no, just the men who behave in a creepy way, and refusing to listen to any advice on what is and what isn't creepy behaviour, which may lead to some success with women in future.

The attitude that by being female, attractive-looking and out in public view, she somehow owes the man attention for turning him on in the first place. Entitlement syndrome.

Yep, there is some seriously weird and skin-crawling attitudes to be seen on here daily.

The point is that basic dating advice for males is construed as being sexist by females.

Thats just the way it is. If i make a post in L & D I will tag it MALES ONLY.

for example, no woman wants to be compared to a grouse - yet grouse theory does ring true.

actually... no. most dating advice for men isn't sexist against women. Dr Nerdlove does an excellent job of advising men, for example, and even most men on the forum manage to advise each other without being sexist.

it is only some people who are sexist. i'd say it's largely those who seem to see the opposite sex as lesser or not fully human, or those who see people as universally guided by an absolute set of predictable principles, or those who seek to blame others for their rejections.

you can try to tag the post "males only", but you cannot keep women out, and if the post is sexist it will be locked or removed.

I knew you would disagree.

Try the red queen, sperm wars and the great female con to name but three.

Dr Nerdlove? lol Who the heck is that?

So why no male only room? Women have one.

Basically you want to suppress honest debate behind "sexism" and then wonder why the males get frustrated with useless PC advice.

Makes no sense.

there is a men's discussion thread in Random Discussion, if you want to discuss men's issues.

there used to be a men's forum, but the sexism was so rampant that it had to be removed (and it was apparently largely sex topics so there was a great deal of overlap with Adult discussion).

if you do not find the advice particularly useful here, you don't have to read it.

"honest debate" behind sexism is not necessary - it simply has no rightful place on the forum and will not be allowed. the rules are quite specific about that. if you want to make sexist threads, i am sure other forums would welcome that with open arms. this particular forum does not.

google is your friend.

So males get a single thread and women get an entire room....................I SEE!!

Please define sexism.

Fact is that the sexism from females goes unchecked but the other way its clamped down on hard.

Just deal with the truth and accept men and women are very different beings for very good and still relevant reasons.

I dont care who he is.......................the name put me off anyway. google "meta whore" and see if you like that guys advice...................or David x.

Accept dating is a different animal based on your sex - it always has been.

Last edited by answeraspergers on 12 Feb 2013, 10:54 am, edited 2 times in total.

To be honest, I once had a separate forum set up for WP men. Didn't work as expected because WP members weren't willing to move over to the new forum and help make it active, and because it doesn't seem like it was considered by them as necessary after all.