So hard to express this for fear of backlash.

Post Reply New Topic

Let me start by saying that I DO love my mother, and I also respect her. It's just that she makes it very hard to open up about bigger issues, because she makes such an ordeal out of the smaller stuff. It's been like that since I was a kid. She always said "You can talk to me about anything." but always freaks out so much over unimportant things that it's nearly impossible to bring up bigger issues.

I am 25, and after the end of a 6 year marriage, am living with my mother.

I always have and always will love my mom, and I respect all the hard work she does, but I admit, we butt heads a LOT, and I don't always like her. Sometimes we get along just fine, joke around a lot, and talk about plenty of different things. But other times she can be really hard to talk to, and very controlling.

I respect the rules of her house. No drugs (I don't do them at all anymore anyway, not even alcohol), ask before I invite people over, pick up after myself, etc. I have a hard time sometimes with the cleaning, it's just never been my strong point (although I definitely have never let my house go to filth, I just never saw a problem with a little mess, and cleaned when I was in the mood to clean or when the mess started bothering me).

I make a list every night of stuff to do around the house, and I always ask her what she wants done. I have no problem with doing what she asks. Dishes, laundry, vacuuming, whatever. Anything she asks of me, I put on my list, and I do it.

However, I feel like I just can not do ANYTHING to her standards! I just don't see little stuff the way she does. I'm sorry I missed those three crumbs you found on the kitchen counter, mom, but does it really warrant the reaction of "Kati! Stop what you're doing and wipe these counters down!" followed by a speech about how little she asks of me, and how I should just slow down and do things right? Literally sometimes, three crumbs!

She comes home and inspects everything. It's pretty upsetting to me when she does this, because I DID do what she asked of me, and it's not like I ever miss anything huge and glaringly obvious, but to her, it seems to be. I guess I just don't see "mess" the same way she does. I'd much rather have a few small crumbs on my counter than the piles upon piles of mail, receipts, paperwork, etc that she has on her kitchen island and dinner table. But that's just me. Her priorities are different I guess, and that's fine. But why not just wipe the crumbs into your hand and throw them in the sink? It seems like it would take far less energy than yelling for me to come do it and launching into a diatribe about my work ethics. It seems to be less about keeping the house clean and more about how lazy I'm being for missing a spot.

And then there is the issue of personal autonomy. That is, choosing what to do with my body as well as my free time. I am willing to compromise. For instance, I don't personally feel I need therapy, but my mom does. It costs me $20/visit, and I have no regular income. But she is putting me on her insurance soon (temporarily, as I can only be on it til November at best, when I'll be turning 26. Should have my disability and medicaid by then), and she says that since she is doing that for me, I need to see a therapist. Ok, fine. I'll pull together $20 once or twice a month to do that, since she's doing me a favor, and I'll try my best to take it seriously (why waste the money if I'm not going to take it seriously?).

But she crosses the line I think by telling me things like where I can and cannot go, who I can and cannot hang out with, and especially what to do with my free time. It's FREE time! I don't get why she cares that I like to be on the computer a lot. It's not like there's much else to do once I've taken care of my obligations. I don't have transportation to go anywhere, and the only thing within walking distance is a couple of gas stations. Her suggestions are things like "watch TV or read a book!" What exactly makes those things better than being online a lot, I don't really know. It's not like I sit around playing Duke Nukem all day. I talk to friends, have discussions on message boards, read articles, and research areas of interest. Seems like a better way to spend my time than watching reruns of Man vs. Food.

Also, I have panic attacks, which she refers to as "hissy fits".

Any time I bring any of this up, I am lazy or unappreciative. I don't know how to talk to her, but it's driving me CRAZY and SOMETHING has to change!

Stuff like your mom is doing is, more often than not, hiding a larger issue. And if she's anything like MY mom was, it's that she doesn't think you should still be living at home. Circumstances don't allow you to do this, she knows, but the frustration is still there, and you can't make it go away no matter how well you clean the counters. Basically, she needs to know that you do intend to live on your own and support yourself down the road.

She knows I intend for that. I tell her on a regular basis. I also show it through my actions, by making phone calls every day trying to get my alimony and disability set up so that I can move back to AZ and be near my son. She also accuses me of 'not prioritizing' seeing my son, because I do spend some of the money I get on other things. It's pretty hard to save money when you're living on roughly $25 a week, and she's telling me about some things that "If you want it, you're going to have to buy it yourself." I'm talking about little, every-couple-day things, like snack food and cigarettes (I buy the cheapest brand and only smoke about half a pack a day). The cigarette thing she thinks I should "just stop" if I really care about my son. This seems hypocritical to me, as she smoked her entire pregnancy with me. Shouldn't she have "just stopped" if she cared about me? She knows it's not that easy!

Someone taught me a long time ago that one effective way to deal with people who are overly critical and controlling is simply to not engage the critisism or control. For example, your Mom gets on you about 3 crumbs in the corner after you have done an otherwise stellar cleaning job:
To engage would be to say something like, "Why do you have to always find something to pick at? Wouldn't it be easier to just have picked them up yourself than have this big deal with me about it???! !!"

Non-engaging response would be something like: "I see you are very upset. I hope you feel better soon." or, "I'm sorry it bothers you so much." And then quietly go on about your business.

It may or may not reduce the amount that she critisizes or tries to control you, but if you can learn to do it, it will reduce your stress level in response. It often takes the wind out of the sail of a person like this, because really what is going on is they are trying to pick a fight.

Who says I pick a fight? I have never said anything like that to her. I get up and wipe the crumbs off the counter. Just because I think it doesn't mean I say it.

Okay, so today I cleaned the bathroom, and she comes in there and does her usual "inspection". Gets down on her hands and knees, looking at the floor, exclaiming how filthy it is because there's a little loose dirt specks left. scrapes the rim of the sink drain with her fingernail and holds it in my face with a tiny amount of soap scum or some s**t on it and says "See this gunk?! It's f****n' nasty!" Lifts the toilet seat, and I s**t you not, points to a single strand of hair that got there somehow, and goes on a tirade about that, too. I've re-tried to clean it twice now, but every time she comes in there she finds a few little things, freaks out, and orders me to clean it again. I can't deal with this anymore. I want to get out of here so badly, but I have nowhere else to go.

I was not suggesting you are picking the fight. She sounds like the one. My suggestion is to simply acknowledge and reflect back to her what she is expressing in a sympathetic way without taking it on or feeling responsible. And I'm sorry you are in such a difficult situation. I hope you can find a way out soon.

I'm really sorry, that sounds so awfully uncomfortable!

Have you tried having a conversation with her about ways to communicate what she's saying to you that might be more effective and less condescending/disrespectful/in-your-face?

It's almost always a good idea to approach a situation like this with a genuine sense of humility if you can, both to give yourself the chance to improve and also to not set off a person's defensive mechanisms if you're dealing with someone who is determined to see you as antagonistic and wrong.

I hope you can get your disability and move out soon.

I'm lucky that my mother isn't so picky. If she ever criticized my cleaning I'd say "well if you don't like the way I do it I just won't do it then".

I try to do some cleaning once in a while but my mother doesn't tell me I have to and she isn't much of a cleaner either.

It sounds abusive. How soon can you get out of there?

Was she this critical when you were a minor and living at home? It almost sounds as if she relishes having you dependent on her so she can play drill sergeant. I hope you can find another situation, this one does sound abusive.
Who were you expecting backlash from, WP? I can't imagine how anyone here would approve of your mother's treatment of you. She's broken your spirit.

No, not backlash from WP, I'm saying I can't express these things to HER because she sees any criticism of the way she treats me as me being disrespectful or unappreciative. I'm really trying to figure out a way outta here, but most of my local friends are living with their parents themselves, or are full-up on roommates. Once I get an income of some kind (alimony will probably get straightened out before disability comes through) I plan to find a place I can stay for fairly cheap, maybe someone renting a room out. In the meantime, though, I am having to deal with this madness, this hot-cold-yes-no whatever it is relationship that I have with my mother.

Wow. Hope the house hunting is going well!

I hate living with uber-clean freaks; I stayed in a B&B once and after the first week I just stayed in my room when I wasn't at work so I didn't have to deal with 'invisible mess'... There's no pleasing some people and they seem immune to the idea that they aren't 100% perfect all the time either.

It may be that on one hand, she wants you to earn your keep, but on the other hand she can't relinquish control over her castle and therefore gets even more stressed by micro-managing the jobs she sets you.

Can you suggest to your mum you're doing your best and you honestly can't see a mess? Maybe it's best left for the expert (i.e. her) to finish off the other minute cleaning things and you could, I don't know, make up for it by cooking dinner or doing the shopping instead?

As for running your life or dictating who you see; that's not on. I wonder though are you being a little thin skinned or do you sometimes pick things up the wrong way? I only ask because you kind of lashed back when emtyeye made a suggestion that wasn't actually critical. With parents, it's even easier to take things the wrong way because there's so much complicated emotion going on and everything said during the present is influenced by the past. I'm not saying she's not being narky, just saying that if you let it wash over you and roll your eyes a bit, it might be easier to deal with rather than letting each word wound you (easier said than done, I know!) and that sometimes, she may not even realise she is being a control-freak unless you straight out tell her.

I have tried that. I already do cook a few times a week, and she's as picky about shopping as she is about cleaning, we usually do the shopping together anyway since I don't drive and she needs me with her so she can shop at the commissary because I have a valid military ID. I help out in the yard as well, do the laundry about half the time, 90% of the dishes... I don't know where else to offer help! She was absolutely LIVID when I suggested that maybe she clean the bathroom herself, since I was obviously missing things that were bothering her, so that's not working, either.



I misread what she said. Apologies for that. I thought she was assuming that I was saying those things, but I just reread it, and you're right, she was just giving an example.



That's generally what I try to do, not let it get to me, but it happens SO MUCH that some of it can't help but stick. I can't think of a way to tell her any of this that she would NOT take offense to...

I'm not sure if there is much more you can do then.

If it were me, I'd have probably have exploded by this stage. It's really nice of your mum to let you stay with her, but she's not doing anything that millions of other families aren't doing for their adult children too (some of whome do take drugs, wreck the place etc.). She doesn't have the right to pick at you constantly whilst patting herself on the back for being so kind for letting you stay.


Happens to everyone but the more I read, the less it sounds like just 'miscommunication' with regards to your mum. I don't think you're the one that needs to spend 20 dollars on a counseller...although they might be able to suggest ways to cope with the home situation better than we could.



Let her take offense! She's never going to be happy with your best efforts, so maybe it's time to straight out tell her how impossible she is and how, whilst you appreciate having a place to stay, if you had any other option, you wouldn't be choosing to live with her and that you are doing your best to move out. (caveat: don't say this if you think that she might actually throw you out onto the street!)

Good luck!