Loneliness, unemployment and so on...

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Hi everyone,

I feel blue but a kind of "dark blue". I guess I have to post here my thoughts, my fears, my doubts.
Maybe a lot of aspies have already written things like that before. If it is the case, sorry for the redundancy...

Well, there are several points playing major roles in my "pain". I guess you already know some of them. I will not make an exhaustive list!

First, I would like to talk about loneliness. This is one of the more complicated "psychological" aspects. Indeed, maybe as some of you, I need MY aspie-moments, alone, in "my buble" where I feel comfortable without any judgment, without having to fake my behavior to seem "normal". This is a need and it occurs quite often. You probably know what I mean... But there is a problem... During years, I was looking for this Aspie-loneliness which is so good/essential for me BUT the downside is that, even I am not quite good at social interactions (I try though), I miss "someone" to talk with. I don't know exactly who, but someone with whom I could share a lot of things, a lot of thoughts, open-minded enough and so on... And not an "imaginary friend", I'm now too old for that!
Is there anyone who knows this kind weird feeling?

Then, there is this eternal problem of Aspie unemployment.
I have seen a lot of AS videos on Youtube, I've read a lot of posts: a lot of Aspies are unemployed. Among the difficulties to find a job, there is unfortunately our "skills". But I know that those skills could be a strength in certain job for some of us! I don't know if I'm clear enough...
Anyway, I am definitely NOT a good example. As far as I'm concerned, my special interest is Physics/Maths. In spite of the difficulties in elementary school, high school and college (you might also know), I succeeded to obtain a PhD in Theoretical Physics. Well, I DO NOT say that to be pretentious!! ! Hoo no!...
Well, now, I guess you easily imagine what follows... Yes, that's right, UNEMPLOYMENT. My field of research is dedicated to these so-called "high qualified and excellent physicists", point that I hate! This "scientific world" is absolutely not the world one can conceive: "Okay, Science, that's pure and noble, so the people in those scientific fields are noble and open-minded bla bla bla...". ABSOLUTELY NOT! This "world" is cruel, really. In Theoretical Physics (I don't know how it is in other fields) you have to be a kind of king of "socialization" and "communication". The main goal is to talk to everyone (important person as far as possible!) and to become "friends" (colleagues) with them. Then you can be invited in great institutions, you can obtain as much recommendation letters as you want from those "V.I.Physicists", in consequence have a GREAT RESUME, and you can also have your own position made especially for you (that's really true, I know dozens of examples). I'm not a part of that "game" with all those rules I don't really understand... I'm LOST. And knowing that I live with my special interest since my 5 years old, I am terribly depressed to note that it seems to have an END, now... My parents told me: "Try to look for another kind of job!"... 1. I don't have qualifications for other jobs and 2. I can't, I really can't. That's physically impossible.
Maybe some of you know what I mean, considering your own special interests of course, whatever they are.

So, I'm thinking a lot about my situation. I live in France. No, no, "enchanté, la tour eiffel, le champagne" that's for tourists in summer time. The everyday life in France, and particularly in "universities", is quite difficult maybe like in other European countries. I've seen scams, shenanigans in this "scientific world" and so on... That's true, and as I am not a "king", I suffer the consequences. So, sometime, I want to leave my country. But where to go? What to do? And other related questions!

Is there anyone here having the same kind of problem?
I don't expect any solutions (I'm quite sure they don't exist, life is not so "simple"). Just opinions (that will be nice enough).
Thanks for your patience and sorry to bother you.

Not a bother at all.
You are a good writer. I'm sorry for these problems you have - they are known to me though certainly not at your level! What an accomplishment to have a PhD in Theoretical Physics.
If you do not mind me asking, what about applying at a school and either teaching or being a professor's assistant?
Perhaps on WP you might find like minded people who also would like to talk.
Wish I could be of more help.

Thank you mntn13!

Your answer is already a kind of help.
See, I don't care about the "level" (as you said). I am passionate about physics, as you are probably passionnate about your special interest, for which I have certainly not your abilities. By the way, what are they? If it's not too intrusive. The thing I find interesting is that you know the "problems" I'm talking about. That's a good "first" point for me.

You know, my parents told me about "teaching" at school... But I discovered that unfortunately I am not interested in "education" (honnestly, I am really bad at education). I am interested in (research and) "teaching" (explaining things to people who are here because they are interested by the course). I don't know if you see the subtlety, that I found very lately by the way!

I would like to thank you again for you reply. If you want to develop any part of this subject (beyond the "physics" stuff), please feel free to do so.

I can definitely relate. In both areas.

re: needing someone to talk to, while also needing space.
I tried dating a year ago (I am a 43 year old divorcee) and that helped to get it out of my system. At least I knew that I COULD date. in theory. If I had any money, which I don't. and the most amazing woman I met was a scientist. As you say, it is all about socializing. She said she was alone, but I had to meet her to realize how REALLY alone I am. To most people, "alone" means "a few friends but would like to be closer." A.S. alone is something different. Though I do have parents and a daughter to talk to, so my situation is luckier than many on this board. Still, having looked so hard for the most perfect person I could find (long story) and finding that she was not so different from other people (though I adored her), I am now at peace with being alone. The long tail of the normal distribution has a lot of single males.

re: unemployment and socializing:
Been there. I qualified as a physics teacher, but struggle to keep a minimum wage job. Like many people, I have nothing but awe for theoretical physicists. As you say, jobs are al about socializing, not the job itself. One would hope that pure science would be the one area where that was not true, but our economic system does not reward merit, it rewards those who play the system.

I cope by taking an intense interest in economic incentives: it is interesting to see why things are as they are, and how they could so easily be better. My special interest is in working out how we could each make our own state, then objectively measure their outcomes. But until that happens we are stuck where we are.

I can relate to pretty much all of this thread.
I shortly considered doing a PhD after my master's and also had the realization that science is largely a popularity contest - you need to publish, you need to work with the right people, you need to be highly visible to get any form of recognition (and funding). I believe this is less the case for areas of research that aren't as popular, but of course those might be a lot less interesting and rewarding.

I had a relatively long period of unemployment shortly after getting my degree. I've managed to find a relatively unconventional niche for now (by luck), however I don't know if it'll work out in the long term. I think I'm pretty much lost to the traditional job market, even though I have skills and qualification that are in demand.

I also want to and need to be alone most of the time, but occasionally I feel a craving for connection with someone (like you, I can't quite define the characteristics of that person though, and every real person I can imagine doesn't seem to fit the bill).

This is the hardest part. I keep on hearing about how the economy is split between people with degrees and IT skills, and those who stack shelves. Well I'm in both groups.

I tried dating too. I know I can, well it's not "easy" but I can. But every time, it was a kind of "disaster"... Psychologically speaking. Each time I expect, as you said, the most perfect person. Unfortunately, with time, I guess that it is something I will never understand (relationship)... So, I guess I will probably stay alone. Maybe it's better this way... I don't know.

I am totally agree with you, trappedinhell, when you said "To most people, "alone" means "a few friends but would like to be closer." A.S. alone is something different"
Fortunately, I have my dad and my young sister to help me with social issues. They help me a lot. But concerning my "job", I have to face the truth, I'm "alone"...



I am pleasantly surprised! Indeed, I naively thought that those "science" things was not so well known... Well, thank you for your understanding.



I would like to thank you very much for your reply which is also a kind of help.
Great special interest by the way!
Best

You perfectly know the subject LookTwice! That's exactly like this! You probably know the famous "publish or perish"...
As you said: you need to publish, you need to work with the right people, you need to be highly visible to get any form of recognition and I don't think that an Aspie can do ALL that stuff! As far as I'm concerned, I can't. I did this because of my special interest and my naivety. I must admit I got fooled like a newby.



I hope it will work out in the long term!



As I said to the others on this topic, I am "pleased" to realize that I am not "alone"... But no one (including me) has a final answer to this very difficult feeling.

Anyway, I would like to thank you too very much for your contribution.
Best

Hi Adam,

I can relate to your post in general but I've picked out the bit above to respond to.

I feel I want someone with who I could say anything and not be rejected by them. Someone that is open-minded. To have a relationship where it is two human beings first and foremost, rather than two citizens of a society. It can be a scary thought, though, to go without the protection and guidance that the norms of society provide, which I think have been there even in what have been/are my closest relationships. I would probably feel threatened and turn away from an approach like that from another. Real intimacy.

I liked your post.

Saturn

Thank you very much Saturn for your reply! I really appreciate your contribution.
Well, there is not too much people for this topic but each one of you has brought me some kind of help, and to be honest, I thought I was alone in "that case". Of course, that do not solve the problems (it would be too easy!) but
THANK YOU ALL! HONESTLY.

Thank you for this thread, I recognize alot in it.

The wishes, passion, limitations and realizations.
I used to be on this quest to find my place in this world.
Wanted to study theoretical physics and went to talk to university.
They advised I would go the teacher-route. I did not know what to say.
In my whole life, one thing had been constant: I get things and I try to explain them and people do not understand.
They do not see it. I can not make them see it. I have no idea how that is done.
Makes sense now, knowing there is little understanding even on very basic levels, let alone the workings of the universe.

I tried to figure out what I really wanted with it.
I want to explain things that are quite undescribable using formulae.
And then..
then I want to show the world!
If my solutions turn out to be any good ofcourse...

How is this done? I go read on the world of science and saw what you learnt.
It is a socializing game. I cannot socialize.
It is doomed.

I tried to learn using resources on the internet, but last years I have not been capable of doing anything at all.
I still stand were I was 15 years ago. It does not work.

Makes me sad somewhere, but all my reserves are spent to just live and function and there is no room for theories.

The loneliness mentioned is something I did not want to face for a long time.
I start to understand now it is an internal problem. I seem to have an complicated communication interface.
People do not get it. I do not get them. All is lost in translation.

When I discovered that it is Asperger Syndrome and there is more people like me, the loneliness changed.
It was very strange to notice people that think similar.
I had always thought it was just me and I had to change myself, because obviously I did not operate correctly.

At times I can somewhat do the fake-NT show and people think they communicate with me.
And I am quite aware of how very much that is not the case and they have no idea.

Then again, it does seem to be possible to connect to someone, to co-exist and even communicate.
Not the NT-acting-shows, but the real thing. Meaningful conversations.
Must admit that such a compatibility seems to be rare. But not impossible.
Have the courage!