Board index › Off Topic Discussion › Random Discussion

A joke

Page 2 of 3 [ 45 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

Previous topic | Next topic

Venger
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 15 Apr 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,519

31 Oct 2012, 1:34 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
To Venger:
you're not gonna attack someone when you know you're on national television.



A lot of them didn't know they were on television or who Chris Hansen was until the interview was over. The cameras were hidden I think since the guys would almost never mention them or ask about them. It seems like some of them would've had some sort of weapon on them going into an unknown situation like that.

A lot of them kept asking if Chris Hansen was the girls dad for example.



naturalplastic
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Aug 2010
Age: 71
Gender: Male
Posts: 35,189
Location: temperate zone

31 Oct 2012, 1:55 pm

Venger wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
To Venger:
you're not gonna attack someone when you know you're on national television.



A lot of them didn't know they were on television or who Chris Hansen was until the interview was over. The cameras were hidden I think since the guys would almost never mention them or ask about them. It seems like some of them would've had some sort of weapon on them going into an unknown situation like that.

A lot of them kept asking if Chris Hansen was the girls dad for example.


Thats just it.
( I went it to that but it edited it out)

Thats true that in the first moments of confrontation they often didnt know they were on TV- and several even asked Hansen "are you her dad?'"

But even if you dont know that you're on TV - you're still being caught with your pants down (figuritively speaking) so your emotions are going into hiding mode rather than to fighting mode because you're embarrassed. And an assaulting a girl's Dad -on the Dad's own property- would do little to improve your already bad situation anyway.

These predators were out to comit statuatory rape-not forcible rape. so they werent usually your hardened violent ex-cons. They were all kinda nonviolent dumb dorks, or brainy smart (but still dumb) dorks ( like that guy who studying to be a rabbi or a priest or something).



Venger
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 15 Apr 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,519

31 Oct 2012, 2:13 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
These predators were out to comit statuatory rape-not forcible rape. so they werent usually your hardened violent ex-cons. They were all kinda nonviolent dumb dorks, or brainy smart (but still dumb) dorks ( like that guy who studying to be a rabbi or a priest or something).


That scene with the jewish-rabbi was one of the funnier ones. He walked in wearing these dorky looking clothes(above-knee shorts). Then he took off running as fast as he could when he saw the camera crew in the side-room right after walking in. He tried to follow the decoy into the bedroom, and a camera-crew was in there. lol

On a later episode they said he was sentenced to years behind bars.



naturalplastic
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Aug 2010
Age: 71
Gender: Male
Posts: 35,189
Location: temperate zone

31 Oct 2012, 3:14 pm

Venger wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
These predators were out to comit statuatory rape-not forcible rape. so they werent usually your hardened violent ex-cons. They were all kinda nonviolent dumb dorks, or brainy smart (but still dumb) dorks ( like that guy who studying to be a rabbi or a priest or something).


That scene with the jewish-rabbi was one of the funnier ones. He walked in wearing these dorky looking clothes(above-knee shorts). Then he took off running as fast as he could when he saw the camera crew in the side-room right after walking in. He tried to follow the decoy into the bedroom, and a camera-crew was in there. lol

On a later episode they said he was sentenced to years behind bars.


That was funny.
Then there was that other guy whom they caught TWICE -on two different episodes! Some folks just dont learn.



Roman
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Mar 2005
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,298

31 Oct 2012, 3:31 pm

Janissy wrote:
Roman wrote:
Decoy has different purpose from Chris Hansen and police (they were just "lucky" in a sense that their conflicting purposes require the same actions, hence they collaborate). As far as Chris Hansen and police are concerned, they want to get the predator in trouble. As far as decoy is concerned, she wants a predator to enjoy himself.

Why would she want that?


I don't know why but apparently thats how NT-s operate. Here is an example. So during the first few years of my graduate studies I didn't realize that I was supposed to focus on research (i.e. publishing papers) as opposed to coursework. So this lead to my developing bad reputation to the point that no one wanted to work with me. I was going to be expelled unless I would find a thesis advisor by a certain date. So I would go to professors who haven't heard enough about me to say no right away. But then when they ask me what my interests are, I would go on and on about them for 10 minutes, instead of listening to the work said professors were doing. So as a result they would conclude that I am bent to only do whatever I was monologuing for 10 minutes on, and would not do anything else; thus they refused working with me.

But then I would insist that yes I will do whatever they want to do -- after all, staying in school is more important than doing "exactly" what I am interested in. But they would disagree. They would say that doing what I am interested in is more important than staying in school. And yes they will say it in caring way: they won't tell me to drop out and go home to do what I want to do. Instead, they will tell me to find other professors who do what I want to do. But at the same time each time I point out that I don't have time to find such professors because of the deadline, they would completely ignore it.

So they care about my interests so much that they completely overlook such "mundane" things as the deadline or the fact that I would be expelled if I miss one. To sum it up, despite the fact that I was such a bad student, they still really cared about me a lot, as evidenced by the fact that they wanted me to work on an area of my exact interest. In the same way, despite the fact that predator is a criminal, decoy cares about him a lot as evidenced by her trying to please him (just like professors were trying to please me by telling me to work in the area of my exact interests).

As a followup, I was never expelled since finally a retired professor took me to help me out, and yes I successfully got my Ph.D. But this doesn't change the fact that professors in question didn't mind me being expelled and had whatever intentions the above scenario implies.

Janissy wrote:
Quote:
As a matter of fact, she is probably upset that predator is about to go to jail. This, however, does not stop her from engaging the predator because of either or both of the following:


So she knows the predator is going to jail but she doesn't want him to. Your reasons why she doesn't want him to make no sense.


Well the above described professors really cared about me (they wanted me to work on the exact area of my interests). This implies that they didn't want me to be expelled (why would they if they care about me so much)? Yet they knew I was getting expelled. And they decided to let me be expelled because they wrongly thought that something else (my working on exact area of my interests) is more important. In the same way the decoy who cares about the predator wants to let him go to jail because she thinks that something else (namely, the good time he will have with her) is more important.

Janissy wrote:
Quote:
1. She realizes that rapists KNOW that they will go to jail after the rape yet they find the experience of rape worthwhile. Thus, she concludes that the temporary pleasure the predator experiences will be worthwhile as well


So she has some marginal understanding of the word "rape" yet doesn't think it's a bad thing??


Well the above professors had marginal understanding that the student is supposed to do what they are told to do, yet they didn't think it was a bad thing for me to do what I "want" to do (since they kept encouraging me to find a professor who would accommodate that).

Besides, we are talking about statutory rape rather than actual rape (statutory rape is when there is a consent but the consent is not legal because the consenting party is underage). So perhaps she disagrees with the entire "age of consent" business. After all, if you look at the following chatlog ( http://www.perverted-justice.com/?archi ... dreamy_doc ) you will find how predator told the decoy time and time again how it is not legal for him to have sex with her, while decoy kept ridiculing it and telling him that love is more important than age of consent and if he really loves her he won't care about her age.

To be fair parts of the chat log were dirty, but after that he backed off and she wasn't letting him back off. So here is the passage in question:

Quote:
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:16:33 PM): im sooo sorry (And here comes older perverted guy vs. pouting teenager spree)
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:16:41 PM): what happen?
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:17:16 PM): babe..i couldnt do it....you're too young..i wish i could see you
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:17:20 PM): what?
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:17:23 PM): but all the suff we talk about?
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:17:27 PM): u promised :(
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:17:49 PM): willow..you have to be careful here..im cool..but you could meet some bad people.. (Like really old guys that hit up multiple underage profiles for sexual purposes!)
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:17:58 PM): just be careful
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:18:00 PM): well im not tryin to meet bad peeps i tried to meet u :)
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:18:05 PM): but u dont like me enuff :(
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:18:12 PM): i waited and waited too
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:18:15 PM): i know..but you dont know me..and i do like you alot
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:18:25 PM): i know u tons we talk a lot and u gotta sweet car u a doc u cool
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:18:39 PM): well if u like me why u ditch?
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:18:50 PM): i know..and everything i said was true....but some guys might lie to you
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:18:59 PM): i know but im not talkin to some guy im talkin to u
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:19:03 PM): u the guy i talk to
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:19:12 PM): u a doc u cute u it all
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:19:20 PM): i know baby...and you're really hot
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:19:38 PM): thanks so whats the prob? we talk so much i mean i though u were the best
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:19:57 PM): i just dont want either of us to get into trouble. (Back to a fear of being arrested rather than knowing what he wants to do is wrong)
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:20:05 PM): lol if we smart we get in no troubs
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:20:18 PM): lets talk more here...
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:20:26 PM): okay but dont be aplayer k?
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:20:34 PM): cause i like u lots and i dont wanna be lied to :(
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:20:40 PM): baby..if i were i a player..i would have come and f*cked you
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:20:53 PM): nah players are like yah baby yah and then they ditch u
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:21:01 PM): i dont want to do that
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:21:28 PM): well thendont do that :)
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:21:35 PM): i promise i wont
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:21:41 PM): lol u already did kinda
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:21:42 PM): :p
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:22:11 PM): im sorry...i really wanted to see you
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:22:16 PM): well u coulda
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:22:19 PM): and u shoulda
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:22:22 PM): but u didnt :p
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:23:16 PM): sorry..
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:23:20 PM): i chickened out
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:23:27 PM): i know u a big chicken :p
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:23:38 PM): you home alone
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:23:41 PM): yeah
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:23:52 PM): u could still come u in sf that not far
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:24:05 PM): cant tonight...
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:24:10 PM): why not? :(
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:24:29 PM): wanna see my cam?
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:24:39 PM): u just gonna sit on cam all night?
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:24:44 PM): lol no
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:24:54 PM): so why u no come if u just gonna cam?
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:26:21 PM): u leave?
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:26:27 PM): im here baby
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:26:31 PM): i just cant not right now
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:26:32 PM): u didnt answer :(
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:26:35 PM): why not?
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:27:06 PM): i mean im bored i just eat noodles tonight and play with cats its lame
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:27:14 PM): it just doesnt seem right..im 29 you're 13 (He goes from 31 to 29 pretty quickly, impressive for a 49 year old)
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:27:20 PM): so what? age is just age
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:27:26 PM): we talked about that
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:27:39 PM): yeah you and i know that but other people wouldnt understand
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:27:45 PM): so u sayin my mom and dad aint right?
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:27:50 PM): he 54 she 31
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:28:03 PM): yeah but they wouldnt understand you
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:28:20 PM): i dated b4 so what?
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:28:29 PM): sides i dont need to tell em what i do im not a baby
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:28:50 PM): i know but they could find out
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:28:55 PM): only if u tell them
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:29:00 PM): i wouldnt lol
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:29:07 PM): then whats the prob?
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:29:53 PM): its against the law...
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:30:02 PM): omg w/e
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:30:10 PM): u think im some baby?
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:30:15 PM): im not dumb im smart i thought u knew that
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:30:30 PM): no i know you're really smart..
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:30:38 PM): lets met somewhere like the mall
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:30:42 PM): meet
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:30:44 PM): i cant go walkin to a mall
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:30:55 PM): its 730
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:31:02 PM): not tonight...
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:31:06 PM): i go walkin round alone peeple notic
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:31:12 PM): im bored tonight
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:31:15 PM): and all u doin is gettin on cam
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:31:20 PM): u dont even like me i knew it
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:31:25 PM): i knew a guy like a doc wouldnt like me for real
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:31:43 PM): i like you alot..its just really risky for me
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:31:53 PM): only if u act dumb
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:32:00 PM): lik ethe mall right?
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:32:07 PM): u meet me there peeps see
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:32:11 PM): maybe one of them knows my mom
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:32:14 PM): then we both in troubs
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:32:22 PM): yeah you're right..
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:32:43 PM): yeah here u act natural i leave garage open u come in it look legit u kno?
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:32:48 PM): you are smart..i know that
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:32:51 PM): yeah im not dumb
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:33:02 PM): i just know u dont like me like that u not for real u a doc a girl like me aint good enuff
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:33:35 PM): you are good enough..you must understand what i am saying..
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:33:41 PM): you're smart..
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:33:44 PM): i dont cause i though of all that already
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:33:47 PM): and it all cool
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:34:09 PM): if a guy really like u he just do it u dont like me enuff thats al
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 9:34:18 PM): well im going to make dinner....i do like you ALOT
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:34:25 PM): yeah u got make dinner while i eat noodles
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:34:30 PM): thats a guy that like sme a lot
willowfilipino (08/25/06 9:34:34 PM): stop playin i hate players
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:03:08 PM): wb was it good?
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:03:20 PM): yeah lol...made pasta..
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:03:26 PM): yeah laugh
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:03:42 PM): did your mom make it to LA ok?
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:04:02 PM): yeah she made it to socal fine she emailed hours ago when it land
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:04:17 PM): oh thats good
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:04:28 PM): yeah im glad
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:04:38 PM): when does she get back
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:04:46 PM): mon
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:05:05 PM): cool
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:05:13 PM): yeah i guess
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:05:35 PM): well you can have fun this w/e
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:05:49 PM): yeah w/e
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:05:55 PM): i was gonna have fun but fun ditch me
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:06:17 PM): let it go, ok?
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:06:23 PM): no
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:06:24 PM): i wont
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:06:40 PM): i want to see you..i cant
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:06:46 PM): u could
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:06:47 PM): stop lyin
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:06:52 PM): nothin i hate worse than lyin
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:07:06 PM): bye
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:07:36 PM): yeah i figure u do that
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:07:39 PM): im so sad
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:07:50 PM): cant you understand?
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:07:57 PM): no i dont cause u said u would
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:07:59 PM): then u didnt
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:08:01 PM): then i say it cool
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:08:06 PM): then u say oh well i dont like u enuff
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:08:25 PM): i said i like you alot..
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:08:49 PM): i know what u say u a big talker
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:09:07 PM): if you want to keep insulting me..then im going to leave (Good)
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:09:15 PM): im not insultin u
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:09:19 PM): how is that not true?
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:09:42 PM): i told you i want to see you...i just cant..please understand
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:09:52 PM): sure u can
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:09:59 PM): u can if u want u only in sf
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:10:23 PM): if we get together..and do stuff..i can go to jail
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:10:35 PM): its probably best if we dont talk anymore
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:10:49 PM): w/e i dont know what happen to u but u used to be cool
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:10:59 PM): now u just a chicken and a liar and a ditcher and a player
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:11:03 PM): just be careful..ok?
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:11:03 PM): u ruined my day
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:11:12 PM): dont pretend u nice
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:12:04 PM): promise you will be careful..and not invite guys to your house you dont know
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:12:12 PM): i do w/e i want
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:12:19 PM): u go hide in ur place
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:12:49 PM): i care about you
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:13:17 PM): yeah right
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:13:51 PM): willow..im here for you online..and i think we will meet sometime..but we cant do anything
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:14:05 PM): u aint the same guy u were b4
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:14:12 PM): am i even talkin to u or someone else?
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:15:04 PM): willow..we had fun chatting last night..but what if I made all that stuff up and I was actually some perv who could hurt you..there are lots of these types here
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:15:23 PM): i know u not
talldreamy_doc (08/25/06 10:16:43 PM): yeah but there are alot of bad guys here...you're all by yourself..i worry about you
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:16:57 PM): yeah if u actually care u woulda came
willowfilipino (08/25/06 10:26:23 PM): bye :-<



Janissy wrote:
Quote:
2. She is simply naive so she does not realize that she is the ultimate reason the predator will get busted


Except that she already stated that she is the decoy. Is she somehow not aware of what the word "decoy" means? And if so, how did Chris Hansen and the police convince her to open the door to this stranger. And how does she know what will happen to the stranger without also understanding what the word "decoy" means?


And it has also been already "stated" to me I would be expelled unless I find a thesis advisor by a certain date. So perhaps the above professors were unaware of what the word "expelled" means, or its ramifications.

Janissy wrote:
Quote:
In light of the fact that she thinks her interests are "in favor" of a predator, she has nothing to hide. That is why she admits to being a decoy. On the other hand, since she knows that interests of Chris Hansen and police are against the predator, she feels that she is bringing good news by saying "don't worry I am neither Chris Hansen nor police, I am a decoy", hence the friendly smile.



You have given no plausible explanation for why she would think her interests are in favor of the predator. If she understands what rape is, why is she not happy to catch this guy? And if she doesn't understand, how did the police and Hansen convince her to go along with waiting for him to come to the door?


Once again, we are talking about statutory rape rather than actual rape. As you can see from the above quoted chat log, the decoy is of the opinion that age of consent laws don't matter.

Janissy wrote:
Your scenario hinges incomprehensibly on somebody either going along with a setup they don't understand at all, or on somebody sympathizing with a rapist enough to save him from entrapment yet also be the sort of person the police would choose to set up an entrapment.


Well the above described professors were sympathizing with ME since they wanted me to do what I am interested in, yet they happened to be very useful for the chair of graduate studies since their refusal to work with me (out of sympathy towards me) increased the chances of my being expelled, which is what the graduate chair (not them) wanted.

Janissy wrote:
Quote:
I mean think of it this way. Suppose you were thinking you are about to die of cancer, and then someone tells you you don't have cancer. That would be good news, wouldn't it. Now why would it be? After all, even if you don't have cancer, you will still die once you reach old age. Well the reason those are good news, is that you don't care what happens several decades later, you care that you won't die within coming few years. Now, predators have "even stronger" tendency to "live in the moment" (after all, when they rape someone, they don't care they will be going to jail tomorrow, they only care about the good experience at the moment).

Implausible claim. It's far more plausible that they think they won't be caught.

Quote:
Thus, if you tell a predator "dont worry you are not going to jail today, you are going to jail tomorrow" it would be good news for them, even though it wont be good news for ordinary people.


It wouldn't be good news for the rapist either. They aren't as uncaring about jail as you think. They actually try not to get caught because they don't want to go to jail. Yes, many criminals are more impulsive than the population at large, but that doesn't mean they somehow don't mind jail.


It is human nature that when someone is different you exaggerate said differences. Now, in the above case the "difference" is that the person in question is a criminal. That difference, however, is not sufficient for him to willingly choose to go to jail in order to commit a crime. However, surrounding humans "exaggerate" the difference that they see, so they "wrongly decide" that he would, in fact, willingly go to jail.

Let me give you few examples to illustrate how differences can be exaggerated:

1. Most students when they asked what they are interested in, they describe it within half a minute. In my case I make 15 minute monologue. So thats where I am different from most. Then the professors exaggerate the above difference and decide that I am different enough to be willing to be expelled rather than work on anything else. That is no longer true, but they still think that.

2. String theory is NOT considered fringe (plenty of schools work on it), but in the particular school I am a postdoc right now, no one does string theory. Now, my own research is 10% string theory, 90% something else. In any other school, that would be the exact understanding they would have. But where I am right now they keep thinking it is 100% string theory. In other words, they say a "difference" (namely, I do 10% string theory while everyone else does 0%) and then they exaggerated it (namely they decided I do 100% string theory).

3. People in third world countries like to scam Americans because they assume that Americans are so rich that they can afford to lose several thousand of dollars. That is because they saw a difference (Americans are richer than them) and exaggerated it (false assumption that Americans are millionares).

4. I tend to do everything last minute. I won't find out the hotel I have to go to and won't pack until literally the day I am leaving. As a result, people worry that I can't make it on my own. But in reality I can: yes I can look disorganized, but I am still organized enough to survive. Yet people exaggerate the difference that they see.

Bottom line When people can't relate to something, they exaggerate whatever it is. So since decoy can't relate to the pedophile tendencies of a predator, she exaggerates it to the point of concluding that predator would willingly go to jail for the purpose of temporary pleasure and it would all be worth it.

Janissy wrote:
Quote:
And guess what, the equivalent to saying the above is saying "dont worry I am neither Chris Hansen nor a police, I am decoy". That implies they got a little while to enjoy with decoy before being confronted by Chris Hansen, and that is all they care about, hence its a good news for them.


Why on earth would they get time to enjoy with the decoy. Is the decoy just going to let the rape progress? Reaklly??! !!??


We are talking about statutory rape not actual rape. And also decoy herself is its subject rather than someone else. So decoy gave consent, it is simply that her consent is not legal because she is under age. It is true they never actually get to have sex with decoy. But still pleasure of anticipation is also a pleasure.

Janissy wrote:
People have far more of a self protective instinct than you give them credit for. If a rapist knows that his intended victim is aware of his intentions, he will also know that this person intends to fight back. Because nobody who knows they are about to be raped just smiles about it. Rapists know this. That's why they often bring weapons.


Like I said we are discussiong statutory rape. So they have no reason to fight since the underage kid agreed to have sex.

Janissy wrote:
Quote:
The fact that decoy thinks those are good news (for reasons just explained) is reflected both in her openness about said good news as well as her smile.

You know nothing about human nature. And a joke won't work without at least some knowledge of human nature.


I know quite a bit about this aspect of human nature since I was facing it for the duration of 5 months that I kept desperately trying to find a professor to work with and they were all turning me down in order to get me to find someone else that "really" does the research that I want so I can enjoy myself as much as possible, and it doesn't matter that I was in danger of expulsion, that was just too mundane for them to care about.

Janissy wrote:
Quote:
Now, according to the joke-story, decoy has different motives from either Chris Hansen or police. As far as Chris Hansen or police are concerned, they care about "future" (namely, putting a predator to jail tomorrow). On the other hand, as far as decoy is concerned, she cares about the present (namely, the temporary enjoyment the predator will experience today). Of course, in her own life her mindset might be different (she might well be a good student working to better her own future). But since she realizes that a predator is living in the moment, she decides to bring him pleasure in his terms, which is why she does what she does. But, whatever she does, happens to be useful for Chris Hansen and police, even though her goals are entirely different.


Your entire scenario is built upon the decoy wanting the rapist to be happy. I'm not religious but....Jesus wept.


And the entire 5 months were based on the professors wanting me to be happy while trying to get me expelled at the same time.

P.S. I fully realize that the above discussed professors were simply "being polite". But their "polite excuses" are way too transparent. So if one were to actually believe said polite excuses (what is the point of being polite if others don't believe you regardless), then one would have to come up to the ridiculous conclusions whose logic is illustrated in the joke I presented.



Venger
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 15 Apr 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,519

31 Oct 2012, 3:51 pm

Holy-shit I think that's the longest post I've ever seen on here.



Janissy
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 5 May 2009
Age: 59
Gender: Female
Posts: 6,450
Location: x

31 Oct 2012, 4:14 pm

I don't want to set a new record by having an even longer post so I won't quote. I'll just say this:

Roman, a bad student doesn't hurt anybody but himself. That's why people sincerely want the best for him. Each professional educator's idea of "the best" may differ but there is no ill will. Some will think he should stay in the program and try not to get expelled. Some will think he should leave the program and find something else that is better suited to his talents and interests. But in any case the goal is for him to find the life path that is best suited for him.

That is not in any way comparable to how people feel about a rapist, even a non-violent statutory rapist. The benevolent advice sincerely offered to a bad student in the hopes that he gets his life on track (in or out of school, depending on what is best for him) is because being a "bad" student just means that a person isn't meshing well with an academic program. It isn't "bad" in a moral sense and it isn't illegal. But being a rapist- even a non-violent statutory one- is bad in a moral sense because it hurts other people. Plus it is a crime.That is a gigantic difference and therefore also a difference in the response that people will have.

There really is no comparison between the bad student (who is neither immoral nor criminal) and the (statutory)rapist.



naturalplastic
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Aug 2010
Age: 71
Gender: Male
Posts: 35,189
Location: temperate zone

31 Oct 2012, 7:24 pm

About the subject of you dealing with professors: what Janissey said above. Reread it!

About the other part:the transcript of the decoy girl.

Your transcript demonstrates the exact opposite of what you say it demonstrates.

It does NOT show that she "believes that the age of consent laws are wrong". Nor does it show that she is breaking with her police collaborators.

It shows that she is purposely decieving the guy into THINKING that she is a loose wild child in order to SERVE the police by luring him so the police can nail him. (in fact I think what she is doing verges on entrapment - and is of questionable morality/legality-but thats a whole nother can of worms).

The point is that you are SEVERELY naive about that conversation!

Buddy-you cant always take things at face value.

There is such a thing as "lying". Have you ever heard of that?



Roman
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Mar 2005
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,298

31 Oct 2012, 11:15 pm

Janissy wrote:
Roman, a bad student doesn't hurt anybody but himself. That's why people sincerely want the best for him. Each professional educator's idea of "the best" may differ but there is no ill will. Some will think he should stay in the program and try not to get expelled. Some will think he should leave the program and find something else that is better suited to his talents and interests. But in any case the goal is for him to find the life path that is best suited for him.


If that is the case, they should have discussed it with me to hear my side of things; after all I know myself better than they do. So their logic is that they know what is best for me better than I do. Thats why no matter how many times I tell them I want to stay in school they were trying to kick me out "for my own good". So by similar logic, other people know what is best for the criminal better than criminal knows themselves. So even if criminal says "my desire to commit a crime is not as important as freedom" others tell him "yes it is very important for you, you just don't realize it" so they force the criminal in question to commit a crime "for his own good".

In case of professors, what I kept telling them is that

1. I didn't know that research is more important than courses. Now I know, so from now on I wont take any more courses and save all the time on research

2. I was stuck at a particular assumption made in string theory that I find counter intuitive. From now on I will do something other than string theory so I won't be stuck any more.

I kept telling them that because of the above two changes I will successfully get Ph.D. without any problem. And I was right: once a particular professor agreed to give me a chance, I got Ph.D. within three years of that argument. Yet they didn't listen to me.

Another thing: if it is all about making things best for the student, are you saying that giving student an F is also to serve their interests (namely, an F grade will get them kicked out of school so they can do something else which they are better at)? By the way the "F" example doesn't apply to me (my GPA was B+ which is precisely why I am so pissed that htey were trying to kick me out: there were no "formal" reasons to, just their subjective opinion). But still, if we take "other students" who get an F, that would probably show that your point of "serving best interests of the student" is not exactly correct.

But here is a direct analogy between what profs did to me and entrapment There were only 3 or 4 profs that told me it is in my interest to leave school (including the graduate chair, who gave me a deadline to find someone by certain date or be expelled). Everyone else, on the other hand, were simply telling me to find some prof other than themselves (hence, staying in school). But, their actual goal was to get me expelled (thats what I know from what the few "honest" profs told me that they think). Yet they would never say it and instead would try to persuade me to do "exactly" what I want thus ultimately "inducing" an expulsion they pretend to play no role in. Now doesn't it look like entrapment to you?

Janissy wrote:
That is not in any way comparable to how people feel about a rapist, even a non-violent statutory rapist. The benevolent advice sincerely offered to a bad student in the hopes that he gets his life on track (in or out of school, depending on what is best for him) is because being a "bad" student just means that a person isn't meshing well with an academic program. It isn't "bad" in a moral sense and it isn't illegal. But being a rapist- even a non-violent statutory one- is bad in a moral sense because it hurts other people. Plus it is a crime.That is a gigantic difference and therefore also a difference in the response that people will have.

There really is no comparison between the bad student (who is neither immoral nor criminal) and the (statutory)rapist.


Here is alternative reason for the above. If X is not a crime while Y is, then the person who is doing Y must have "far stronger" need to do Y than the person who does X (after all the person doing Y wants to do it "badly enough" so that they do it "despite" it being a crime). So since they have such a strong urge to do Y, why not "help them out", lol. Thats what it seems like decoy is doing.

naturalplastic wrote:

About the subject of you dealing with professors: what Janissey said above. Reread it!

About the other part:the transcript of the decoy girl.

Your transcript demonstrates the exact opposite of what you say it demonstrates.

It does NOT show that she "believes that the age of consent laws are wrong". Nor does it show that she is breaking with her police collaborators.

It shows that she is purposely decieving the guy into THINKING that she is a loose wild child in order to SERVE the police by luring him so the police can nail him. (in fact I think what she is doing verges on entrapment - and is of questionable morality/legality-but thats a whole nother can of worms).

The point is that you are SEVERELY naive about that conversation!

Buddy-you cant always take things at face value.

There is such a thing as "lying". Have you ever heard of that?


I am well aware that they were lying, thats why I called it a "joke". A joke is meant to illustrate just how stupid one can feel when they are being lied to. There IS a way to construe this lie as naivette on the part of decoy; thus, a person who takes everything at a face value would feel very frustrated when it "appears" as if decoy is simply naive and yet they can't get their point across to her no matter how hard they try. I faced situations when it "seems" like NT-s simply don't see something over and over throughout my entire life, and I am pretty sure that in some of these cases they were simply playing stupid. Yet I had that propensity to take them at face value which made me really frustrated.

By the way, I don't think what decoy did exactly serves the interests of Chris Hansen. Consider the following scenario. Suppose the predator didn't show up, despite decoys' entrapment. But at the same time, they thought "hmmm, willow had a good point, her mom is 31, her dad 54, perhaps all these age of consent laws are pointless" and such assumption will never be corrected by Chris Hansen since they won't show up. Case in point: NT-s don't try to "teach" others, instead they try to put "natural selection" pressures to "weed out" the ones that don't fit in. Thus, if someone doesn't fit in, no one asks them to change; on the contrary, they ask them to go even further in the "pathological" direction (claiming it is "for their own good" or "for their own enjoyment which is more important") so they can be weed out faster.



Venger
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 15 Apr 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,519

01 Nov 2012, 5:55 am

Janissy wrote:

That is not in any way comparable to how people feel about a rapist, even a non-violent statutory rapist. The benevolent advice sincerely offered to a bad student in the hopes that he gets his life on track (in or out of school, depending on what is best for him) is because being a "bad" student just means that a person isn't meshing well with an academic program. It isn't "bad" in a moral sense and it isn't illegal. But being a rapist- even a non-violent statutory one- is bad in a moral sense because it hurts other people. Plus it is a crime.That is a gigantic difference and therefore also a difference in the response that people will have.

There really is no comparison between the bad student (who is neither immoral nor criminal) and the (statutory)rapist.


One thing both of you are wrong about is the "statutory rape" part. The young girl that the men were supposedly coming to meet was usually under age 14 (12-13) which made it a much more serious crime of "child molestation" or "attempted child molestation".

Statutory Rape often isn't viewed as a very serious crime especially for the police to go through the trouble of an undercover sting-operation, and the MSNBC show part of it wouldn't be nearly as dramatic either. So they had the girls be just slightly under 14.



b9
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 14 Aug 2008
Age: 54
Gender: Male
Posts: 12,003
Location: australia

01 Nov 2012, 7:09 am

Roman wrote:
b9 wrote:
there is little to salvage from the wreckage of my attempt to conceptualize how what you said could be construed as a joke, however i have salvaged some useful ideas from it.

i guess it could be viewed as amusing if the girl was a very convincing android that was being used (in order to minimize danger to an actual human) to conduct the "sting".

Roman wrote:
Predator: So ... are you a decoy, or Chris Hansen, or police?

it would be amusing if the programmers of the android's "verbal response" facility did not anticipate or allow for a question of that type, and so the android's response is, by default, factual.

Roman wrote:
Girl: Decoy *friendly smile*


it would be amusing if, whilst the android's linguistic response may have been very factual, it is in no way interlinked with the androids facial expression generator that is designed to lure predators to even greater temptation, and so the 2 aspects of the concept are at odds with each other, but never the less, i think you would not be able to deliver a joke such as that to an appreciative audience.


Okay you are on the right track in terms of trying to think up the story behind the above exchange. That is where the humor is supposed to be. But in my mind I am thinking of another kind of story, the one with the naive human being a decoy as opposed to mashine.
well then i can not see any humor in it. i cannot see how the police could employ such a vacuous thinker to act as a decoy. they surely would perceive her ineptitude concerning the task assigned to her. the producers of that program would also not gamble upon a risky result if it were the case that the police actually did commission someone of her spontaneous ability to perform the task of being a decoy.

however, it seems that a person who simply shows up at the address and decides against knocking on the door will also go to jail because they are in the radars of many stationed units prepared for the "take down". i suppose it is surprising that the police actually let the perpetrator to go through the process of going inside and interacting with the decoy. maybe it strengthens their case.
if that is true, then surely they would employ a well witted decoy.


.

Roman wrote:
What I rahh da dahh da dahh


the only way i can think about your scenario that is funny, is where the decoy is a programmed android that was employed to reduce the insurance premiums on living diminutive people endangering themselves and coming to grief by involving themselves in the process.

the funny aspect would be that the programmers of the decoy's mind do not think like policemen do.

but whatever. tomorrow will be another day.



Last edited by b9 on 01 Nov 2012, 8:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

Roman
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Mar 2005
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,298

01 Nov 2012, 7:38 am

Venger wrote:
Janissy wrote:

That is not in any way comparable to how people feel about a rapist, even a non-violent statutory rapist. The benevolent advice sincerely offered to a bad student in the hopes that he gets his life on track (in or out of school, depending on what is best for him) is because being a "bad" student just means that a person isn't meshing well with an academic program. It isn't "bad" in a moral sense and it isn't illegal. But being a rapist- even a non-violent statutory one- is bad in a moral sense because it hurts other people. Plus it is a crime.That is a gigantic difference and therefore also a difference in the response that people will have.

There really is no comparison between the bad student (who is neither immoral nor criminal) and the (statutory)rapist.


One thing both of you are wrong about is the "statutory rape" part. The young girl that the men were supposedly coming to meet was usually under age 14 (12-13) which made it a much more serious crime of "child molestation" or "attempted child molestation".

Statutory Rape often isn't viewed as a very serious crime especially for the police to go through the trouble of an undercover sting-operation, and the MSNBC show part of it wouldn't be nearly as dramatic either. So they had the girls be just slightly under 14.


There were times when girl was 14 or 15. Remember the guy who said "just because it says in the internet doesn't mean thats what I really think". In his case decoy was 15. But it is true that they never had anyone 16 or higher.



Roman
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Mar 2005
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,298

01 Nov 2012, 7:41 am

naturalplastic wrote:
The decoy girl- was incompetent. Just say that. Thats enough.
She was dumb- and thats the joke.

Not much of a joke but thats it.


The point is NOT that "decoy was incompetent". The point is "NT-s make ridiculous assumptions when they see someone different". So in this case decoy made an assumption that the predator would continue to willingly talk to her and enjoy it even if he knows that she is a decoy. The fact that decoy has admitted that she is a decoy is meant to illustrate that what NT-s say is self-contradictory right on the surface whenever they are dealing with aspies; yet they stick to it because of the set of wrong assumptions that they are making.

In my life I have had plenty of NT-s making ridiculous assumptions about me and I couldn't ever convince them they were wrong no matter how hard I tried.



Venger
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 15 Apr 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,519

01 Nov 2012, 8:18 am

Roman wrote:
Venger wrote:
Janissy wrote:

That is not in any way comparable to how people feel about a rapist, even a non-violent statutory rapist. The benevolent advice sincerely offered to a bad student in the hopes that he gets his life on track (in or out of school, depending on what is best for him) is because being a "bad" student just means that a person isn't meshing well with an academic program. It isn't "bad" in a moral sense and it isn't illegal. But being a rapist- even a non-violent statutory one- is bad in a moral sense because it hurts other people. Plus it is a crime.That is a gigantic difference and therefore also a difference in the response that people will have.

There really is no comparison between the bad student (who is neither immoral nor criminal) and the (statutory)rapist.


One thing both of you are wrong about is the "statutory rape" part. The young girl that the men were supposedly coming to meet was usually under age 14 (12-13) which made it a much more serious crime of "child molestation" or "attempted child molestation".

Statutory Rape often isn't viewed as a very serious crime especially for the police to go through the trouble of an undercover sting-operation, and the MSNBC show part of it wouldn't be nearly as dramatic either. So they had the girls be just slightly under 14.


There were times when girl was 14 or 15. Remember the guy who said "just because it says in the internet doesn't mean thats what I really think". In his case decoy was 15. But it is true that they never had anyone 16 or higher.


Yeah I remember them showing the chat log a few times where the girl was supposedly 15 years old. I think their ages ranged from 12-15.

Usually she was 13 though like in that episode I was talking about a few posts up with the Jewish Rabbi as one of the guys that showed up at the house. Wasn't that the first episode? I remember seeing a very quick courtroom scene in another one of the episodes. The judge was telling the guy at his arraignment the next day that he's being brought up on charges of "attempted child molestation" because the girl in the chat said she was 13 then he came to meet her afterwards.



naturalplastic
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Aug 2010
Age: 71
Gender: Male
Posts: 35,189
Location: temperate zone

01 Nov 2012, 11:31 am

Roman wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
The decoy girl- was incompetent. Just say that. Thats enough.
She was dumb- and thats the joke.

Not much of a joke but thats it.


The point is NOT that "decoy was incompetent". The point is "NT-s make ridiculous assumptions when they see someone different". So in this case decoy made an assumption that the predator would continue to willingly talk to her and enjoy it even if he knows that she is a decoy. The fact that decoy has admitted that she is a decoy is meant to illustrate that what NT-s say is self-contradictory right on the surface whenever they are dealing with aspies; yet they stick to it because of the set of wrong assumptions that they are making.

In my life I have had plenty of NT-s making ridiculous assumptions about me and I couldn't ever convince them they were wrong no matter how hard I tried.


Before I continue I need to ask this: is your so called "joke" about two people speaking face to face in the real world - at the door of the girl's house perhaps?

Or is it an online internet text conservation?

It would fail at humor either way, but Im just curious because it isnt clear.
___________


Ok. So this whole joke is that the girl will assume that the guy will continue to talk to her even if he knows that she is a decoy- just because she thinks that she is so charming to talk to -or something-.

So.. even though she has a job to do- catching bad guys she is still willing to waste time talking to a bad guy whom she knows that she cant catch (because she knows that has just blown her cover with him) just because - she just enjoys talking to him.

Is that the ghist of your 'joke'?


And what does any of this have to do with "nt's talking to people who are different"?

Granted sexual pervs are deviants, but most of them neurotypicals (because most people -perverted or not-are neurotypicals).



Last edited by naturalplastic on 01 Nov 2012, 11:55 am, edited 2 times in total.

Venger
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 15 Apr 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,519

01 Nov 2012, 11:51 am

naturalplastic wrote:
Granted sexual pervs are deviants, but most of them neurotypicals (because most people -perverted or not-are neurotypicals).


Most rapists are actually sociopaths(ASPD). They don't have conscience to speak of, so it would obviously make committing that type of crime much easier for them. Not sure if that's what you meant by "pervs" though.