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Death_of_Pathos
Deinonychus
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05 Dec 2008, 1:21 am

Hence why I mentioned it being a highly factorable number. Its the same reason we denote there being 360 degree in a circle.

Highly factorable numbers, like 360 and 12, have more integer factors then any number before them. ie, 12 has 4 non-1 factors (2 3 4 6), while the most before it is 6 with only 2 factors (2 3). This gives them good properties for usage by humans in an arbitrary setting.

Infact, I believe we should use base 12 instead of base 10 for this very reason.



Xelebes
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05 Dec 2008, 2:41 am

Base 2, 8, 12 and 16 are only useful for fractions. They are no good for counting as there is only 1 method to count in base 2. With base 10, there is two counting bases (simple and herding counting methods, one counts to 10 on the hand and the other count to 99.)

Babylonians had a nice compromise though - using base 60.



Death_of_Pathos
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05 Dec 2008, 3:27 pm

Xelebes wrote:
Base 2, 8, 12 and 16 are only useful for fractions. They are no good for counting as there is only 1 method to count in base 2. With base 10, there is two counting bases (simple and herding counting methods, one counts to 10 on the hand and the other count to 99.)

Babylonians had a nice compromise though - using base 60.


What do you mean about there being a simple and herding counting method for base 10? Google turned up nothing.

And its easy enough to count to 12 on your hands... simply turn over the hand with all extended phalanges to mean 6 and 12 before continuing on.

You know how every number ending in 0 2 4 6 8 is divisible by 2 and every number ending in 0 5 is divisible by 5? In base 12 you automagically know at least one factor for any number ending in 0 2 3 4 6 8 9 10, which is 3/4 of all numbers (a 1/3 increase over base 10's 6/10 of all numbers).

This is a big aid to mental arithmetic. Using base 60 is problematic because most every day applications would only have one digit. This keeps you from rapidly distinguishing from <10 dollars and >10 dollars, amongst other things. The preservation of orders of magnitude being distinct is a useful tool all itself.

Also I imagine those that struggle with base 10 would have no real significantly increased difficulties with base 12, but with base 60 they would... you have to memorize 6 times as many digits before the pattern of addition becomes apparent.



pakled
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05 Dec 2008, 10:51 pm

they're 13 feet long in case you run into something you wouldn't touch with a 10 foot pole...;)



Xelebes
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06 Dec 2008, 12:45 am

Death_of_Pathos wrote:
Xelebes wrote:
Base 2, 8, 12 and 16 are only useful for fractions. They are no good for counting as there is only 1 method to count in base 2. With base 10, there is two counting bases (simple and herding counting methods, one counts to 10 on the hand and the other count to 99.)

Babylonians had a nice compromise though - using base 60.


What do you mean about there being a simple and herding counting method for base 10? Google turned up nothing.

And its easy enough to count to 12 on your hands... simply turn over the hand with all extended phalanges to mean 6 and 12 before continuing on.

You know how every number ending in 0 2 4 6 8 is divisible by 2 and every number ending in 0 5 is divisible by 5? In base 12 you automagically know at least one factor for any number ending in 0 2 3 4 6 8 9 10, which is 3/4 of all numbers (a 1/3 increase over base 10's 6/10 of all numbers).

This is a big aid to mental arithmetic. Using base 60 is problematic because most every day applications would only have one digit. This keeps you from rapidly distinguishing from <10 dollars and >10 dollars, amongst other things. The preservation of orders of magnitude being distinct is a useful tool all itself.

Also I imagine those that struggle with base 10 would have no real significantly increased difficulties with base 12, but with base 60 they would... you have to memorize 6 times as many digits before the pattern of addition becomes apparent.


Simple is the counting of the digits.

Herding is where you start with your left index and count to four towards you left pinky and then count five with your left thumb. You start over again until you reach 9. Ten is recorded by the right index finger. Fifty is recorded by your right thumb. If you become good, you can easily count to 100 which is optimal for when you are counting heads of cattle or sheep. Try it when you are on the highway and count this way without actually saying the numbers in your head the cars that pass by on the opposite direction. You'll be surprised how hard it is for you to get lost in your count. I also suspect that this counting method is the basis for the Roman numerals system.

Base 60 is good for geometry but not for commerce. And probably that was all the Babylonians cared for as they were farmers and not herders.