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nazaya
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16 Apr 2015, 4:09 pm

I think people believes what they want, regardless if there are evidence that supports it or not.

I don't know why some people can believe in spirits, ghosts and demons, but think it's just impossible that their minds can make a mistake, as if we were perfect and no process of our body could fail.

I'll give a non-related-to-spirits example: last year close to christmas, my parents were having a tough time and they almost ran out of money. We went to buy some things to a supermarket, only my father was going to get off the car but he couldn't find the money in his wallet (earlier he gave it to my mother so she kept it in her bag) and for making things quicker, I just gave to him some money I owed them. Few days later they told me they were completely ran out of money and wanted to buy some presents for their grandson (my son) and when my mother checked her bag, she found money!! Of course they didn't remember about when we went to the supermarket, and they thought the money just popped in there. They were suprised and happy, and thought it was some kind of miracle.

Maybe some people really have the need of belief in something greater that they can't understand, although that doesn't make it real.



will@rd
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16 Apr 2015, 4:48 pm

We live in a universe of at least 10 dimensions, of which we have the recognized physical ability to perceive only 4 - height, width, depth and time. That leaves a minimum of 6 spatial dimensions of which we spend our entire lives utterly ignorant. There could be life forms and states of consciousness we are not even capable of sensing, but that doesn't mean they aren't there.

There may be components of ourselves or our bodies that we are currently incapable of apprehending with our external physical sensory apparatus. We may be constantly sensing phenomena that we have chosen through cultural conditioning to block out - for instance, autistic people often have hearing that can pick up small noises inaudible to the neurotypical ear. Are we insane? Do these sounds not exist just because "normal" people don't hear them? By the logic of the skeptic, the answer would be "yes," they must be hallucinatory, because if they were real, everybody would hear them.

Of course, those same hard-nosed empiricists insist that Spontaneous Biogenesis is a fact and we are all just bags of chemicals whose awareness ceases to exist when the body dies, yet that pesky Primordial Ooze has yet to produce a single living microbe in the laboratory, indicating that perhaps there's a component of their "Building Blocks of Life" recipe missing. If it's not a chemical element, then what is it? Gods forbid we consider consciousness preceding matter. Why, there's no evidence for it - of course, if we don't fully comprehend yet what consciousness is, then we can't begin to develop tools for identifying it, can we?

Bottom line - humans and their sciences are still far too ignorant to begin asserting what can and cannot be. All we can really know is what we can make work, and what we can't. Every time I hear someone arrogantly proclaim a thing impossible, I am reminded that only two hundred years ago, experts insisted that if a train traveled more than 50 miles per hour, all the occupants would suffocate and that heavier-than-air vehicles were the fantasies of crackpots who simply didn't understand scientific principles.

I have personally seen UFOs, and experienced both telepathy and psychometry under circumstances and with results that could not have been explained by any other phenomena. Do I expect you to believe it because I said so? Of course not, you weren't there and you didn't experience what I did. But for you to tell me that it can't happen proves nothing to me but that you have an intentionally closed mind. Suit yourself. Human civilization is (supposedly) only 5000 years old. Time will tell.


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"I don't mean to sound bitter, cynical or cruel - but I am, so that's how it comes out." - Bill Hicks


Kirjava
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16 Apr 2015, 5:25 pm

Yes.
-I have found a footprint in the middle of the floor which was far too small to have been made by anyone living or visiting here. There has also been a too-small hand print on the fridge which was bought after we were too big to have made it.
-When we came home Sunday me and mum thought that my sister was home when she wasn't, because we could hear two people talking in the front room who weren't actually there (assuming they were my sister and her boyfriend). It stopped when we saw that there was nobody there and tried to listen.
-Someone who isn't there walks up the stairs and along the landing, making the steps, banister, and floor boards creak along the way. Sometimes there is also a smell of cigarette smoke, nobody has smoked here since my parents moved in about 30 years ago. They also used to stand behind anyone who was using the computer upstairs, like if someone walked into your office and was watching over your shoulder but you didn't see them walk in (we have laptops down stairs now).



DailyPoutine1
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16 Apr 2015, 5:30 pm

Dillogic
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16 Apr 2015, 6:17 pm

nazaya wrote:
... as if we were perfect and no process of our body could fail.


Yeah, they're called delusions and hallucinations (which are mediated by biochemical processes, which in turn are probably caused by physiological damage/differences and/or stressful events).



Mecatoi
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08 Jul 2016, 1:06 pm

There are no spirits or gods at all.
The "ghosts" we see are processing errors in our brain; a creation of our mind.
The proof? Easy.
Persons who have phobias can see a poodle like a lion roaring or a cockroach sizing like a cat.
Remember Plato and the cave myth.
It's not our eyes that see, not our ears that hear, not our tongue that taste, not our noose that smell, not our skin that feels...
BUT our brain. (Yeah, I also got one!)
Many games, jokes, fun are good because they mislead our brain.
That's where magic came from.
Believe in your brain.
Or you gonna end believing in "gods and demons"... :wink: