my daughter my son do you trust in the force
Karamazov wrote:
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verkar knappast värt det att använda översättningsverktyget för den frågan 
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Frågan verkar knappast värt att publicera i första hand.
_________________
The mere fact that science may not yet adequately explain an object, event, or experience does not mean the immediate explanation should automatically default to a conspiratorial, extraterrestrial, paranormal, or supernatural cause.
Wolfram87 wrote:
All this machine translated swedish is going to give me a slaganfall.
I love Google Translate! It's how I found out about wonderful things like "ass-burning tea" and "nuclear ham"
_________________
"Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored." Aldous Huxley
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Karamazov wrote:
I take it that the machine translated outcome is, erm, amusingly garbled then?
Hmm ... a simple test may be in order. Here is the original text:President Lincoln wrote:
Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent, a new nation, conceived in Liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal.
Now we are engaged in a great civil war, testing whether that nation, or any nation so conceived and so dedicated, can long endure. We are met on a great battle-field of that war. We have come to dedicate a portion of that field, as a final resting place for those who here gave their lives that that nation might live. It is altogether fitting and proper that we should do this.
But, in a larger sense, we can not dedicate -- we can not consecrate -- we can not hallow -- this ground. The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract. The world will little note, nor long remember what we say here, but it can never forget what they did here. It is for us the living, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work which they who fought here have thus far so nobly advanced. It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us -- that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion -- that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain -- that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom -- and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.
Here is the same text after translation into Swedish, and then back again into English:Now we are engaged in a great civil war, testing whether that nation, or any nation so conceived and so dedicated, can long endure. We are met on a great battle-field of that war. We have come to dedicate a portion of that field, as a final resting place for those who here gave their lives that that nation might live. It is altogether fitting and proper that we should do this.
But, in a larger sense, we can not dedicate -- we can not consecrate -- we can not hallow -- this ground. The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract. The world will little note, nor long remember what we say here, but it can never forget what they did here. It is for us the living, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work which they who fought here have thus far so nobly advanced. It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us -- that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion -- that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain -- that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom -- and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.
Google Translate wrote:
Four points and seven years ago, our fathers gave birth to this continent, a new nation, envisioned in Liberty, and devoted themselves to the suggestion that all men are created equal.
Now we are engaged in a great civil war, and test whether that nation or any nation that is so conceived and so devoted can long endure. We meet on a large battlefield in that war. We have come to devote part of that field as a last resting place for those who gave their lives here for the nation to live. It is perfectly appropriate and accurate for us to do this.
But in a larger sense we cannot devote ourselves - we cannot dedicate - we cannot sanctify - this land. The brave men, living and dead, who fought here, have inaugurated it, far beyond our bad power to add or detract. The world will notice a little, and will not long remember what we say here, but it can never forget what they did here. It is for us to live, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work that those who fought here so far have so nobly advanced. Rather, it is for us to be here dedicated to the great task that remains to us - that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to the thing that gave them the last full measure of devotion - that we here very much resolve that these dead should not have in vain - that this land, under God, shall have a new birth of liberty - and that the government of the people, of the people, of the people, shall not perish from the earth.
I do not see the problem; but I am not Swedish, either. Perhaps Wolfram87 could enlighten us ... ?Now we are engaged in a great civil war, and test whether that nation or any nation that is so conceived and so devoted can long endure. We meet on a large battlefield in that war. We have come to devote part of that field as a last resting place for those who gave their lives here for the nation to live. It is perfectly appropriate and accurate for us to do this.
But in a larger sense we cannot devote ourselves - we cannot dedicate - we cannot sanctify - this land. The brave men, living and dead, who fought here, have inaugurated it, far beyond our bad power to add or detract. The world will notice a little, and will not long remember what we say here, but it can never forget what they did here. It is for us to live, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work that those who fought here so far have so nobly advanced. Rather, it is for us to be here dedicated to the great task that remains to us - that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to the thing that gave them the last full measure of devotion - that we here very much resolve that these dead should not have in vain - that this land, under God, shall have a new birth of liberty - and that the government of the people, of the people, of the people, shall not perish from the earth.
_________________
The mere fact that science may not yet adequately explain an object, event, or experience does not mean the immediate explanation should automatically default to a conspiratorial, extraterrestrial, paranormal, or supernatural cause.
Karamazov wrote:
I take it that the machine translated outcome is, erm, amusingly garbled then? 
Not all of it is bad, but some of it goes along very well with my suspicion that somebody is pulling our collective leg
_________________
"Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored." Aldous Huxley
BenderRodriguez wrote:
Karamazov wrote:
I take it that the machine translated outcome is, erm, amusingly garbled then? 
Not all of it is bad, but some of it goes along very well with my suspicion that somebody is pulling our collective leg
This is putting me in mind of a couple of machine-scanned and reset books I bought years ago: they were readable, but about three times a page there was a symbol such as @ or $ in the middle of a word...
I suppose it must be hard to navigate grammar effectively when you’re a machine with no sentience.
Or: the mech-lords rule the earth from their solar powered caverns of steel and are messing with us for jollies
Karamazov wrote:
I take it that the machine translated outcome is, erm, amusingly garbled then? 
It often is, yeah. Funny if you're looking to be entertained, annoying if you actually need the translation.
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Karamazov wrote:
I take it that the machine translated outcome is, erm, amusingly garbled then? 
It's well within being understandable, but it comes of as simultaneously being too stilted and formal to have been said by an actual person (save for perhaps a very pretentious priest I met once who used the royal "we" unironically), and word-choices that are just slightly wrong for the context. It kind of reads like a technical manual anno circa 1860, filtered though someone using synonyms.com to sporadically replace random words with kind-of sort-of synonyms.
Quote:
Frågan verkar knappast värt att publicera i första hand.
I'm guessing the original sentence was "the question hardly seems worth publishing in the first place."? This back-translates into "The question hardly seems worth to publish primarily".
ALso, from the retranslated speech:
Quote:
- and that the government of the people, of the people, of the people, shall not perish from the earth.
_________________
I'm bored out of my skull, let's play a different game. Let's pay a visit down below and cast the world in flame.
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Thanks. I saw a few mistakes in the back-translation and didn't think about how they changed the message, but maybe I was expecting the translation/back-translation cycle to produce something like a recipe for blåbärssoppa.
_________________
The mere fact that science may not yet adequately explain an object, event, or experience does not mean the immediate explanation should automatically default to a conspiratorial, extraterrestrial, paranormal, or supernatural cause.
Karamazov wrote:
BenderRodriguez wrote:
Karamazov wrote:
I take it that the machine translated outcome is, erm, amusingly garbled then? 
Not all of it is bad, but some of it goes along very well with my suspicion that somebody is pulling our collective leg
This is putting me in mind of a couple of machine-scanned and reset books I bought years ago: they were readable, but about three times a page there was a symbol such as @ or $ in the middle of a word...
I suppose it must be hard to navigate grammar effectively when you’re a machine with no sentience.
Or: the mech-lords rule the earth from their solar powered caverns of steel and are messing with us for jollies
They're decent for very basic communication (with the type of issues Wolfram already pointed out) but in my opinion, for a proper body of text, this job will never be replaced by machines.
There's a good reason for the old "traduttore, traditore" (translator, traitor) saying: to translate a meaningful text, with all its intricacies, nuances and idiosyncrasies, you need not only to be a good writer yourself, have a great vocabulary and a very nuanced understanding of both languages, but also a deep and comprehensive understanding of both cultures. Really good translators are true artists.
_________________
"Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored." Aldous Huxley
Wolfram87 wrote:
Karamazov wrote:
I take it that the machine translated outcome is, erm, amusingly garbled then? 
It's well within being understandable, but it comes of as simultaneously being too stilted and formal to have been said by an actual person (save for perhaps a very pretentious priest I met once who used the royal "we" unironically), and word-choices that are just slightly wrong for the context. It kind of reads like a technical manual anno circa 1860, filtered though someone using synonyms.com to sporadically replace random words with kind-of sort-of synonyms.
Quote:
Frågan verkar knappast värt att publicera i första hand.
I'm guessing the original sentence was "the question hardly seems worth publishing in the first place."? This back-translates into "The question hardly seems worth to publish primarily”.
Original was “The question seems hardly worth the bother of using the translate tool”.
(Because what I got back was the same words, but with Swedish rather than English spelling)
It appears that trying to use google translate to make holy999 feel more welcomed might be backfiring then. Oops
(Well, unless he really likes pretentious characters in old books who fail to say what they really mean...
BenderRodriguez wrote:
Karamazov wrote:
BenderRodriguez wrote:
Karamazov wrote:
I take it that the machine translated outcome is, erm, amusingly garbled then? 
Not all of it is bad, but some of it goes along very well with my suspicion that somebody is pulling our collective leg
This is putting me in mind of a couple of machine-scanned and reset books I bought years ago: they were readable, but about three times a page there was a symbol such as @ or $ in the middle of a word...
I suppose it must be hard to navigate grammar effectively when you’re a machine with no sentience.
Or: the mech-lords rule the earth from their solar powered caverns of steel and are messing with us for jollies
They're decent for very basic communication (with the type of issues Wolfram already pointed out) but in my opinion, for a proper body of text, this job will never be replaced by machines.
There's a good reason for the old "traduttore, traditore" (translator, traitor) saying: to translate a meaningful text, with all its intricacies, nuances and idiosyncrasies, you need not only to be a good writer yourself, have a great vocabulary and a very nuanced understanding of both languages, but also a deep and comprehensive understanding of both cultures. Really good translators are true artists.
Yes, I seem to remember years ago hearing something on the radio discussing the problems of rendering text in one language into another and they talked about the distinction between translation by which they mean rendering the words, and transliteration by which they meant rendering the meaning.
Which was interesting, it hadn’t occurred to me before then that there was not, and could never be, any such thing as literal translation.

