I'm not saying it was Aliens ...

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So panspermia is a parallel hypothesis which posits that earth was (and is still) seeded with microbes from deep space that have been sourced from other planets millions of light years away.

Among the gamut of theories associated with panspermia is that cephalopods (octupi and squid) can't be explained through genetic evolution so are a likely candidate who hitched a ride on a space rock.

To be one ask one
I am disappointed the Free and Accepted Masons do not admit women these days. Sure, there are clandestine groups, namely the Co-Masons and the Honourable Fraternity of Ancient Freemasons (UK only) and another women's only group that originated in Belgium, aptly named Freemasonry for Women, that obviously accept women - but they are not considered within the fold. Order of the Eastern Star etc does not go through the degrees as I am told, it's like a side group for women who are wives or descendants for Master Masons. Pity.

I've attended a few absolutely fascinating lectures from a Co-Masonry group on this topic. So. Incredibly. Interesting. I was unaware masons believe in life on other planets. There are elements of the Master mason ceremony that put me off. But oh the secrets oh the mystery.

As with many institutions with an old history they tend to be male dominated.

Your point is interesting in the context of higher beings and the need for gender.

The grey aliens for example appear to be gender neutral but confoundingly human-alien hybrids are clearly make/female

I visited the Grand Lodge in London to learn more about a great-great grandfather of mine in Northern England who was Master Mason, also to interpret a magical amulet we have from him. Interestingly enough, there had been women masons in England here and there in the 18th and 19th centuries. It is absolutely verboten now.
I was only referencing gender in terms of Freemasonry.
I'm not entirely sure I believe in the grey's and all the other alien races that people allegedly know about - for me that crosses into the realm of imagination which is a fun place to be provided a person understands that's where they are.

The masons have a fascinating history, their power lies in their secrecy of their rites/rituals and their influence in leadership and power brokers.

My sister is an architect and she told me the close association the masons have with the renaissance construction and technology in Europe. I think the metaphor for the "dark ages" and coming into the light is literally how the masons took ancient knowledge in the arts and sciences and applied it to the modern world. They were also instrumental in borrowing math, astronomy, medicine and science from eastern cultures to rebuild Europe after the fall of Rome.

Well, even additional billions of years of evolution does not enable a species to violate the fundamental laws of physics. After all, that species is a product of those very laws.

The problem with "fast" interstellar travel (above the speed of light) is not simply one of lacking the scientific discoveries (like finding a cure for cancer or getting a stable fusion reactor to work), but one of fundamental physical laws.

So I see two possible scenarios:

1. A method of fast interstellar travel which does not violate the laws of physics exists, and could be invented.
2. A method of fast interstellar travel which does not violate the laws of physics does not exist, and will never be invented.

If (2) is the case, then it doesn't matter if a civilization is 10 thousand or 10 billion years old.

Good grief,
Charlie Brown.
You have a lot of esoteric knowledge.

There is a scenario 3. where a civilisation finds a way to bend space/time through worm holes. An interesting observation many people claim to see objects that fly at high velocity coming and going from apparent holes in the sky (portals?)

Scientists base the laws of physics on Homo Sapien 2020 knowledge. We have no idea what we will uncover in the next 50-100 years let alone in the next thousands or millions of years.

Your assumption is that humanity has discovered the definitive "Physical Laws".
Quantum physics opened an entirely new "Universe" than Newtonian Physics couldn't.
Who knows what discoveries are out there?

I agree we must think out the box. We don't have to be limited to the power of rocket fuel and existing technology. Cyberdad and GGPV have both brought an interesting new facet to this discussion. There's so much about the fabric of space and the nature of dark matter etc that infinite possibilities emerge that are outside our current experience. It makes many people feel uncomfortable when ideas are mooted which challenge the cosy and currently accepted theories.

If what some of these witnesses are saying is true, then the reason they're not commonly taken seriously is because mainstream science can be limited, just as it alleged that a heavier than air flying machine couldn't be developed, before the Wright Brothers (and others) proved them wrong. In the same way there was a guy who wondered wht anyone would ever need a personal computer. They had no idea that data storage would become smaller and smaller, and that a single flash drive contains far more info than a huge data processor from the 50s. They would have scoffed, or thought we were either crazy or entering the realm of magic.

Problematic claims about being the carriers of the secret knowledge of Hiram Abiff and the mysteries of Solomon's Temple. Could be true. Might also not be true. Even one of the historians I spoke to at the Grand Lodge played down the validity of the claim. This is possibly done to cast doubt on the uninitiated perhaps and preserve the integrity of the alleged secrets they hold for being knowable only to the initiated. Freemasonry in England as an institution emerged roughly in the 18th century making claims of it being an unbroken lineage of the secrets of Hiram Abiff. Okay possibly. Also maybe not.

Yes allegedly the cathedrals of Europe were constructed by Freemasons. Which would make some sense that a cathedral would be built with the same basic motif as the Temple of Solomon. The checkerboard floor and pillars, for example. Also an interesting point of contention against their original claim. The description of the floor for the temple of Solomon from the Hebrew scriptures describes two different types of wood. It would not have been black and white. The black and white symbolism of the Freemason's lodge represents the two opposing forces of light and darkness, which is fine and intriguing in its own right - but not oh so connected to the temple of Solomon. I am starting a subthread about Freemasonry in my own thread about aliens. Oopsies.

And yes I am much interested in esoterica.

So I generally read this not that you are being serious but you're having a bit of fun
But I just heard this song off The Kink's 1971 Album Percy and it made me think of this post

I can't edit this
Not interspecies predation
Intraspecies predation - humans are adept at forming dominance hierarchies in which the top of the chain feels no connection to and very much every right to subjugate what they perceive as being beneath them. I am potentially just a bit jaded having worked for people like this in the most extreme of ways. There is also an increasing body of research on how psychopathy is an indicator for scaling said dominance hierarchies. In short, leads me to a generalized picture that the most awful amongst us are in positions of power and dominance over us. I am fine with this being the explanation and that there is no rung higher in which aliens are involved.

I would like to imagine there are creatures of a higher consciousness that have had a hand in our advancement away from the animals and are still involved in that advancement to propel humanity closer to a more evolved ideal. I feel I need to believe this given what just pure flaming space trash most of humanity is.

As a science fiction fan if you watch the 1960s and 70s episodes of Star trek they use of hand held devices that looked like i-pads that controlled living spaces and provided data to the user.and digital communication devices were considered fantasy, Again people at that time had no idea within 20-30 years from the 1970s both these hand held devices would both be common place.

5G allows for using phones to completely control living environments in your home remotely which even as late as the 2000-2010 would have been considered science fiction fantasy. The rate of scientific breakthroughs is coming thick and fast.
Exponentially increasing computational capacity over time (computations per second) – Koomey, Berard, Sanchez, and Wong (2011)

Much exponential. Very wow.

Last edited by adromedanblackhole on 08 Oct 2020, 10:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

No the purpose of the graph was to demonstrate the rate of technological progress - at the current rate the possibility of having microcomputers the size of a pin head and inserted in nanobots that also have AI is quite plausible.

The whole inventing ideas that will enable us to transcend the barriers of the laws of physics will be redundant when true AI is achieved which supersedes our capacity to innovate

Last edited by cyberdad on 08 Oct 2020, 9:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.