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TwilightPrincess
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28 May 2022, 8:49 pm

auntblabby wrote:
many people lack the proper mentality to handle weapons without hurting themselves or the wrong people. even cops screw up more than most people are aware. so it is IMHO not a sound public policy to encourage people to arm themselves and have at it. if only our nation recognized our children as the precious resource they are and stop squandering their future by being skinflints now.


Yep.

Studies have demonstrated that, in general, having a gun in the home greatly increases the risk for deadly accidents.

While there are examples of people protecting themselves, the pros do not outweigh the cons - in terms of actual numbers.

https://www.thetrace.org/2020/04/gun-sa ... gun-sales/


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Pepe
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28 May 2022, 8:57 pm

Twilightprincess wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
many people lack the proper mentality to handle weapons without hurting themselves or the wrong people. even cops screw up more than most people are aware. so it is IMHO not a sound public policy to encourage people to arm themselves and have at it. if only our nation recognized our children as the precious resource they are and stop squandering their future by being skinflints now.


Yep.

Studies have demonstrated that, in general, having a gun in the home greatly increases the risk for deadly accidents.

While there are examples of people protecting themselves, the pros do not outweigh the cons - in terms of actual numbers.

https://www.thetrace.org/2020/04/gun-sa ... gun-sales/


I have made it clear, that Amurrian's "should" surrender and give up their military-style weapons.
The "Manchurian Candidates" creation will never end if they don't.

Yes, I am a genuine looney toon conspiracy theory nutter. :mrgreen:
Shoot me. errr... 8O



Jakki
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29 May 2022, 11:15 am

Within reason people that are willing to take a interest in public protection .. And are not associated with law enforcement. Need to be willing to do what’s necessary to preserve life, I feel .It is why our forefathers in this country framed the constitution the way they did …


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QFT
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29 May 2022, 11:25 am

Jakki wrote:
Just got the one detail about this situation that is not being addressed ... calling this 18 yr old alumni a gunman. a hispanic older woman that knew the boy , possibly a housekeeper in his home:
.Interview approx 7 am KTLA news . this morning.
Said this boy was seriously bullied at this school on a ongoing basis . Now they are only addressing the gun he used .... looking for excuses to enact new gun laws . These people who are doing this
Are the real criminals , i feel . They are covering up the real issue . Once again it is not the tool
( eg. the gun). that is the cause. This is very frustrating .To see this on TV and having seen the one interview with the housekeeper is now being squashed . In favour of blaming the firearm .
Seems absolute madness , Interview with Biden states he is supporting more extreme gun control measures as a result of this shooting . Is this really a gun issue ?


Cho was bullied too and he said in manifesto the shooting was a retribution for social rejection.

I don’t know about the other shooters but it’s likely it applies to them too. Particularly since Lanza had Asperger.



lostonearth35
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29 May 2022, 3:30 pm

You've really got to love a country where underage kids are not allowed to purchase a lottery ticket without an ID, but are perfectly able to purchase a gun.



kitesandtrainsandcats
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29 May 2022, 4:28 pm

I will now go back to the beginning of this thread and say something I have been putting off saying directly.

Jakki wrote:
Just got the one detail about this situation that is not being addressed ... calling this 18 yr old alumni a gunman. a hispanic older woman that knew the boy , possibly a housekeeper in his home:
.Interview approx 7 am KTLA news . this morning.
Said this boy was seriously bullied at this school on a ongoing basis . Now they are only addressing the gun he used .... looking for excuses to enact new gun laws . These people who are doing this
Are the real criminals , i feel . They are covering up the real issue . Once again it is not the tool
( eg. the gun). that is the cause. This is very frustrating .To see this on TV and having seen the one interview with the housekeeper is now being squashed . In favour of blaming the firearm .
Seems absolute madness , Interview with Biden states he is supporting more extreme gun control measures as a result of this shooting . Is this really a gun issue ?


For the members who like peer-reviewed science as documentation of, proof of, things, I have nothing to offer to satisfy them.

But I will assert, almost as though it is written in stone from on high, that the authorities do nearly nothing about the bullying and abuse and related issues because the source of those is known to be basic human nature, people are not basically good as pop psychology et. al. assert, and the authorities are aware that they have little to no practical power over that part of life and being.

Improve and/or increase gun laws, the authorities can do that, it is within their power.
Improve innate human nature, the authorities can not do that, it is far away from their power.


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kitesandtrainsandcats
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29 May 2022, 4:43 pm

Even with what I just said, the availability of guns is an issue;

‘This is not a video game.’ Alabama police chief responds to graduation party shooting
By Madeleine List
May 27, 2022 5:52 PM
https://www.sunherald.com/news/nation-w ... 73835.html

"
An Alabama police chief responded to a shooting at a graduation party that injured six people by imploring youth not to pick up guns.

“The impulse to use firearms by the young people in our society is a tragedy and a shame,” Anniston police Chief Nick Bowles said in a news release on Facebook in response to the May 27 shooting.
"
...

"
Six people were struck by bullets, and at least one person was injured fleeing the scene, the news release says. None of the injuries were considered life-threatening.

Multiple vehicles were hit by stray bullets, and dozens of shell casings and several firearms were recovered from the scene. The investigation is still ongoing, according to police.

“Lives are fragile and precious,” Bowles said in the statement. “This is not a video game or movie. You don’t get to respawn. The other person doesn’t get another chance to play again.”
"

And the "Read Next" selection below story text might be illustrating a point or two,
"

Read Next
National
Delivery driver shot and killed while dropping off food late at night, GA cops say
May 27, 2022 1:20 PM

Read Next
National
Walmart shopper shot and killed trying to stop shoplifting suspect, Ohio police say
May 27, 2022 10:39 AM

Read Next
National
Mom says she begged cops to ‘stop shooting’ son outside store in New Jersey
May 27, 2022 1:35 PM
"


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kitesandtrainsandcats
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29 May 2022, 6:43 pm

Back to the matters of bullying and psychology,

USA TODAY
Uvalde gunman, isolated and bullied, was teased about being 'school shooter.' Then he bought guns.
Chris Kenning, Rafael Carranza and Will Carless, USA TODAY
Sun, May 29, 2022, 11:20 AM·10 min read
https://news.yahoo.com/uvalde-gunman-is ... 05138.html

"
It’s not known whether Ramos or his family ever sought mental health support, but Uvalde Justice of the Peace Eulalio Diaz, who helped identify some of the bodies of the children after the shooting, lamented the lack of mental health resources in the city.

"This child was probably suffering from something that was never diagnosed," he said. "The way you get diagnosed here is you end up in jail. This kid never made it to jail."
"

:arrow: That brings to mind,


Incarceration nation

The United States leads the world in incarceration. A new report explores why — and offers recommendations for fixing the system.
October 2014, Vol 45, No. 9
Print version: page 56
13 min read
https://www.apa.org/monitor/2014/10/incarceration

"
Who's in prison?

The committee found that the deinstitutionalization movement of the 1960s — which shut down large treatment facilities for the mentally ill — coupled with the lack of community resources to treat them, resulted in some people going to prisons and jails instead. One study found this trend accounts for about 7 percent of prison population growth from 1980 to 2000 — representing 40,000 to 72,000 people in prisons who would likely have been in mental hospitals in the past.

Mental illness among today's inmates is also pervasive, with 64 percent of jail inmates, 54 percent of state prisoners and 45 percent of federal prisoners reporting mental health concerns, the report found. Substance abuse is also rampant and often co-occurring.

"Part of what's really swelled our jail and prison population, especially our jail population, is our inability to deal with the mental health crisis that we're facing in this country," says Tangney. "We have an enormous number of people who are suffering from very treatable illnesses who are not getting treatment and who end up getting caught in the criminal justice system as opposed to the mental health system."

The rise in incarceration rates has also disproportionately affected minority populations, the report found. In 2011, for example, about 40 percent of those behind bars were black, although African Americans and others of African descent make up only 13.2 percent of the U.S. population, one study found. Hispanics also were over-represented in prison, at 20 percent of the prison population compared with 17.1 percent of the U.S. population.
"
:arrow: So, during the time from the 2014 article to the 2022 article, what was improved in our society was ... :?: :?: :?:


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29 May 2022, 7:45 pm

QFT wrote:
Jakki wrote:
Just got the one detail about this situation that is not being addressed ... calling this 18 yr old alumni a gunman. a hispanic older woman that knew the boy , possibly a housekeeper in his home:
.Interview approx 7 am KTLA news . this morning.
Said this boy was seriously bullied at this school on a ongoing basis . Now they are only addressing the gun he used .... looking for excuses to enact new gun laws . These people who are doing this
Are the real criminals , i feel . They are covering up the real issue . Once again it is not the tool
( eg. the gun). that is the cause. This is very frustrating .To see this on TV and having seen the one interview with the housekeeper is now being squashed . In favour of blaming the firearm .
Seems absolute madness , Interview with Biden states he is supporting more extreme gun control measures as a result of this shooting . Is this really a gun issue ?


Cho was bullied too and he said in manifesto the shooting was a retribution for social rejection.

I don’t know about the other shooters but it’s likely it applies to them too. Particularly since Lanza had Asperger.


Isn't bullying a factor in all these mass shootings?
Shouldn't these thugs take responsibility for these tragedies?



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29 May 2022, 7:52 pm

kitesandtrainsandcats wrote:
But I will assert, almost as though it is written in stone from on high, that the authorities do nearly nothing about the bullying and abuse and related issues because the source of those is known to be basic human nature, people are not basically good as pop psychology et. al. assert, and the authorities are aware that they have little to no practical power over that part of life and being.


Anyone who is more interested in the Truth, rather than wishful thinking, is well aware of this. 8)



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29 May 2022, 7:53 pm

lostonearth35 wrote:
You've really got to love a country where underage kids are not allowed to purchase a lottery ticket without an ID, but are perfectly able to purchase a gun.


I disagree, sunshine. :mrgreen:



auntblabby
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30 May 2022, 5:32 am

this country is fkkked beyond repair. to fix things now you'd have to replace a majority of the population.



Pepe
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30 May 2022, 5:44 am

auntblabby wrote:
this country is fkkked beyond repair. to fix things now you'd have to replace a majority of the population.


You need to reboot and create "The Democratic State of Amuurria". 8)



Jakki
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30 May 2022, 11:50 am

But even with all written above this is still a Mental health issue . And I think the State is starting to recognize it .
But do not want responsibility for not addressing it properly , or disabling the previous processes that used to address it . The country has allowed the “media” freedom of speech rights as a corporate entity . When NO such rights should exist for non human entities . There was heavy censorship of broadcasting extreme violence of all sorts
And it was frowned upon by the public , when media behavior was not civic minded . There should be no rights for corporations that demonstrating bad behavior as part of their ability to attract portions of the populace .
Surely it is human nature that , often individuals , want as part of expressing themselves , to portray a bad boy image or behavior possibly , Being “rebellious “ :ninja: did not used to be generally accepted and children were raised to try to be
Nice appearing members of society . Grow up , as a responsible adult . But now the media wants to cater to the base
Urges of human nature and reward in various ways for that behavior in video games or gangs . :skull:
The original idea of freedom speech,was speech that was meant to improve things critiques of poor government . Not incessant outward displays of violence . All the way down to the level of children in school . Violence breeds Violence.
People used to let off frustration in competitive sports or hobbies . But this is all my own observations of degradations of Government . That seems to be occurring . :nerdy:


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30 May 2022, 7:37 pm

Jakki wrote:
Nice appearing members of society . Grow up , as a responsible adult . But now the media wants to cater to the base
Urges of human nature and reward in various ways for that behavior in video games or gangs . :skull:
The original idea of freedom speech,was speech that was meant to improve things critiques of poor government . Not incessant outward displays of violence . All the way down to the level of children in school . Violence breeds Violence.
People used to let off frustration in competitive sports or hobbies . But this is all my own observations of degradations of Government . That seems to be occurring . :nerdy:


There is only so much that can be done, since the very nature of the human animal is to be violent.



kitesandtrainsandcats
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30 May 2022, 7:55 pm

Jakki wrote:
But even with all written above this is still a Mental health issue . And I think the State is starting to recognize it .


That brings to mind articles such as,

Letters to the Editor: Don’t fall for the Republicans’ mental health dodge. The problem is guns
May 28, 2022 3 AM PT
To the editor: The only thing more predictable than these horrific mass shootings is the now standard response by the GOP that the problem isn’t guns, it’s “mental health issues.” (“Mass shooters aren’t mentally ill people who suddenly snap. They decide to kill,” Opinion, May 21)...
https://www.latimes.com/opinion/letters ... em-is-guns


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