AS Women and Relationships

Post Reply New Topic

Mainly, the men I was with were jealous of my special interests! I think they felt it took time away from them. They really hassled me sometimes. One of them broke up with me because of it.

I did go out with 2 dancers, back when my special interest was dancing (I was a ballet dancer). One would think this was okay, after all, we shared the same special interest. However, it wasn´t! Both men became competitive; in other words, they wanted to be better than me, and there was a lot of stress involved with this. Another man was the singer I already mentioned; again, we were both in the performing arts, and though it wasn´t the same thing, he was still competitive about jobs. It was awful...

So, this brings me to my next question for everybody: how did lovers deal with your special interests? Were they jealous, competitive, or just not understanding? My theory is that this is particularly hard for autistic women: it´s sort of accepted in our society that men can have other interests- (or be interested in things), but women are expected to be more people and relationship oriented. When we´re not, I expect this can cause big problems.

always the above.
People will always and have always taken second place to my special interests. That is just how it is. Special interests are like a part of my soul and brain - like a major artery. sever the connection to my special interests -painting and art - and you effectively kill me.
that is simply how it is.

anyone who comes into my world must understand those are the terms. People come and go, for me. THey are like a backdrop to the real interior world i love, which is painting, the studio, music, time on my own, nature, more painting, more studio, more time on my own...........

These days however, i am lucky. My ex does understand this. He is a good person. He has had a terrible time trying to understand my autism, and now he knows why i am the way i am - it is better for him and he is being less resentful towards me. More accepting.....this is good as we co-parent our son and live under the same roof. He knows i CANNOT give him what he wants which is a "nice, cosy, affectionate and normal kind of relationship with companionship." I do not do that. I function. I paint, I function some more. I paint. Then i put time aside for my son, and after that is done, i have nothing more to give socially or emotionally.

I agree with this, because I find that a lot of people in general, not just in a relationship, seem to find the fact that I have my interests somewhat peculiar. I.e., it's not just that they find the interests I do have strange, but seem to think it somewhat strange that I have 'hobbies' and 'interests' at all. They seem surprised that I have actual activities I engage in as opposed to simply spending my spare time shopping/reading magazines/meeting up with friends to chat. A remarkable amount of NT women don't really seem to have what I would term 'interests'; NT men, as you say, do tend to.

For example, when I have mentioned that I enjoy language study (I'm beginning in Japanese), people instantly ask whether it's something to do with work; if I'm doing it for my career, because I want to work as an interpreter or work abroad. They can't imagine any other reason why I would do it other than because I need it as a qualification. When they find out that I'm doing it simply out of interest and enjoyment, for the satisfaction of learning and to aid me in other purely personal interests - understanding foreign-language TV shows - they're utterly bemused. They can't seem to understand why I would put in this time and effort unless I had to.

Lovers? Most couldn't be described as such.

It varied between the people I was with. Most were completely uninterested in my interests.

One I rarely saw did at least seem interested in my astronomy monologue (he hung around listening.)

One I wrote an essay/letter to about my passion for learning completely ignored its content and only wanted me to write about my feelings for him.

One would tease me about my interests. However, at one stage when I was into classical literature, he bought me a complete set of works unexpectedly (which I could not have afforded.) He would then try to withhold them from me and grant access to them one at a time. I don't read in this way, but like to immerse myself in several books at once, so that was frustrating. There may have been some jealousy present.

The one above did not have intelligent discussions with me, even when our interests overlapped. He and his friends, however, would sometimes have extended discussions on some topic I was familiar with, never including me. His father was the same, but he would engage women my age in such conversation, though I think he did it primarily to flirt with them. He was an Oxford academic, so had many articulate students to converse with. He was unable to interact with me in any way apart from behaving in a slightly obnoxious and patronizing way.

One would let me monologue without interruption on all my interests, drive him mad with repetitive questions, the works. It was bliss. He fully encouraged my interests to the extent of demanding almost none of my time and encouraging me to treat him as an object. His father would also let me monologue at him for extended periods, and we even exchanged interests at one point.

I agree with Temple Grandin who maintains it is essential for us to find people who understand our special interests and support us in making them into careers...if we can.

THe bottom line is that people without an ASD find us difficult, and from their perspective we are! We are a bit out of synch or kilter with the ways of the world and there are two choices for me -- to go down feeling absolutely bereft about this or to start embracing the difference or the ASD special interest obsession and making the most of it.

I know a lot of artists in my field who are not AS and a lot of what is said here is similar to how they feel too about their work and about their passion for it. But they are SO MUCH LIGHTER about it all. Their work is like a thing for them - not like it is for many of us. They are definitely not as intense as ASD people and they are more social, but they have the same dilemmas - re being told they are "selfish or self'centred" for their pursuits etc. The difference for them however is they work at their special interests which are creative, in a less intense and obsessive way, and then they come and cook dinner and have friends over to socialise and have dinner parties with and them and they go off to an opening together and they have all these "normal" facets to their lives that seem utterly odious and superfluous and idiotic to me. That is like a nightmare life for me. All that dispersed energy - ALL THAT FACE TO FACE PEOPLE ENERGY!! !! ! that is like an allergy for me. i'd get migraines and psoriasis (which i get.)

The problem is the amount of time i spend thinking about my work or doing it - which is most of my waking (and sleeping) hours and also that i do not want to do all the social things that others want to do around me or with me.

I was invited to join an art forum - a kind of thing like WP - but for artists. I joined and tried it and i found the issues people raised to be similar to here in terms of their special interest stuff. BUt there were a few things that irked me ---- and this was an invite only art forum of professionals who regularly show and exhibit and who sell their work so they are all pretty serious and driven - BUT they were unlike a lot of the ASD people here. THey lacked intensity and the kind of analytical charge we have - they also enjoyed a kind of frou-frou social whirl and the networking side of the scene and put great emphasis on this as an important part of their careers. (i belly laugh at that as i cannot relate at all. Seems weird and shallow to me. TIme doing that is time away from painting. and time away from my major lifegiver which is art. ) They also did not have the depth of relating with their art that those with ASD's have with special interests whatever they may be. So, i dip my toes into the real world here and there and always come away feeling disappointed> And of course, on that forum, i created a few furores because i was too opinionated and frank and simply stated what i thought about something. THAT did not go down too well at all!! !! ! HEre on WP that is ok by and large, except when i get exceedingly objectionable which has been known to happen - unbenknownst to me until a later date by way of a notifying pm that alerts me to my cold, hard way of saying some things.

I think it is exceedingly difficult for non ASD People to understand our relationship with our speical interests. My time alone with my special interest is the ony time - and I mean ONLY TIME - I ever feel at peace and fused together like a well-oiled human machine that loves life and everything in it. My special interest is my most important relationship...without a doubt.

Yes, for years other people- (roommates, family members, colleagues)- told me I was weird for not going out and doing social things, meeting men and the like; and telling me it was totally strange that I stayed home to read books and study, or whatever. I would get so obsessed about things, and people would tell me I needed to "lighten up" and "go out and have fun". For years I wondered why their version of "having fun" was not fun for me....(So many people said this to me, that I really did wonder what was wrong with me for a time. Needless to say, this was before I knew anything about AS, so I didn´t have the vocabulary or knowledge to explain myself, not even to myself).

I do notice some people around me (some family members, actually) who don´t seem to have a passion about any particular thing. I can´t imagine what this must be like! Talk about a boring life....I´m really thankful that I have my special interests.

I can relate to what millie says.

I tried to make my special interest (physics) my career, but encountered barriers at every step. Having the qualifications means nothing if the networking, moving, and travelling aspects are inaccessible. I was told explicitly, recently, that conferences are not about the science, but all about the coffee break and getting your face known. I was told it doesn't matter how brilliant you are, if you don't do this, you don't get jobs. This revelation made me feel sick; I ended up in the nursing offices immediately after.

My experiences in the field have been so wretched that I get flashbacks whenever I read about the subject and feel ill. I want to work obsessively on research and love it the way I used to, but it's tainted with awful associations. I'm in my thirties and haven't found a place; this is because other people are always involved in some way. The only time I'm healthy is when engaged in my other special interests, alone. I'm alone almost all day every day, working on them or thinking about them. This was not through choice; I'd always wanted to have some place in society, and worked hard for over a decade trying to attain this, but it resulted in burnout, illness, and complaints procedures. My treatment as a student and young researcher was contemptible and discriminatory. There's no place outside my room and special interests as far as I can tell. And no other activities make sense.

I agree millie, my special interest is also my most important relationship. For years though, I wondered if I would ever meet a man who would be like a special interest to me; this is what people always implied, that a love relationship would someday supplant everything else, and become the most important thing. Since I have this intensity and I can get quite obsessed about things, I thought that that pattern would naturally evolve into a relationship with another person. But, no go. Sometimes I wonder if that´s partly why I´ve been disappointed in love; compared to my special interest (whatever it is at the time), "love" just seems so paltry and superficial. I have never had the intense spiritual/transcendental experiences with men that I´ve had at times with my dancing, for instance.

Ok, I did have that special interest in that drummer, that I mentioned earlier on this thread. But that was no relationship, that was all in my head.

I agree with Temple Grandin also, about combining it into a career, if you can. I did this, and I´m glad I did. I also know what you mean about other people (colleagues) being less intense. I was surprised at how many of the dancers around me seemed to be able to do all this other stuff too, while I was just totally focused on the dancing. I don´t think I could have had more of a life on the side even if I wanted to...(come to think of it, that may have also had something to do with multitasking). I was definitely more intense than my colleagues. I have the problem that I can get so obsessive about my special interests that it can be a bit too much; I´ve done things that were unhealthy at times. It can get to the point that it´s like a compulsion that I can´t stop. I recognize this now, so I try not to let it get to that point anymore. It´s, well...a bit better...(I say this as I´m totally sleep deprived, as I can never get to bed at a decent hour. Can´t tear myself away from my interest to go to bed, even...)

I´m sorry to hear about that, outlier. Yes, the politics of the work scene can really suck at times.

There have been times when I´ve been limited by my lack of "networking" skills. (I didn´t need to do this as a dancer, but it seems to be important for a choreographer). When I get jobs, it seems to be due to luck- (like someone who likes my work got the job for me)- rather than my (ugh) "social" skills.

Is there any aspect of the job you can do that´s more private- (i.e. writing, or internet based?)

oh yes. it is true what outlier says - the politicking and networking. Yuck yuck yuck. I can feign superficial and preliminary connection and then when it is meant to go to the chummy networking stage i freeze. I do just about everything from my home and it is accepted now that i am reclusive. I had some really lucky breaks - and i mean luck. So now i just stay on my own and paint and minimise contact with others.

great reading the posts on this. I always relate to you women.

Not that I'm aware of, but maybe such a position will exist in the future where I can work purely from home and attend conferences online. At the moment, a research career involves moving around the country every few years, networking and collaborating, frequent overseas conferences, and teaching duties. It's inaccessible to me without support. Even so, the thought of all the politics makes me nauseous.

I've been through so much in the field it would fill pages (which indeed was the length of the formal complaint I made. The advisor helping me had a file on what the university put me through that was about 10 cm thick! The stress has left me housebound.) It's sick how you can work hard for qualifications, have numerous skills in different areas, and yet have indefinite unemployment and no prospects.

It is interesting you mention all of this outlier. It just shows how pivotal "relating" and "relationships" can be to getting ahead in a world that is socially oriented. My parents tried to push me into academia. I tried uni but as has been said elsewhere, my sensory stuff is pretty full on - and i did not even know it was called that, at the time - and i dropped out because of that and because my own systems of learning and acquiring knowledge could not be penned in by the constraints of institutionalized thinking and education.

I noticed at university how others "hob-nobbed." I also noticed that pretty girls in the higher years got tute jobs and were chummy with lecturers. These were rudimentary observations and by that stage and from my experiences at school, i realised relating was often the KEY to success, rather than intelligence or quality of the work produced.
I am shunned in my region by a lot of arts people. completely shunned.
I have found ways around them. But they are odious little people with small little minds who see schmoozing and slick and meaningless stuff as the CORE of existence.

Somehow, i just battled on and persisted with my career in spite of them. They still ignore me. I am like a thorn in their side. Someone who has done a lot without one ounce of help from them. They look at me and i mirror back their shallowness - not because i want to - but because i am always an "outsider" and outsiders mirror to non-outsiders, the absurdity of the mainstream That is our "soul" job on earth. And the fact is, it is an incredibly wonderful AND tortuous place to live and reside.

But with art that trajectory is possible because one works on one's own for the most part. I think academia would be more difficult.

Take Heart. Is this not why you love Catweasel? the great outsider....

there is a way. there is ALWAYS an alternate route. The problem is, we autistics are often so bruised and battered that we just run out of steam as the wounds are too raw and the hurt is too much. By mid-life, many of us are burned and battered and very hurt. I was. I have spent nearly 12 years battling on. i find some peace now - and the only way i find it is through solitude.
We try our hearts and guts out to make things work. We have more perseverance than most. IT is very hard...this career stuff and its interweaving with relationships and people and networking and "getting out there." (what a hideous expresion for us.)

Hail Catweasel.
ps. You can ALWAYS become an artist!! you have what it takes there.

I remember that when I left school and began working, I thought that at least most of the social problems would be over, because I imagined that people went to work to work, and that if you were hardworking, nobody would care whether you socialized or not. I soon realized I was very wrong.

gee..that was also my experience to a tee. It hit me hard and i am still reeling from it. I still get shocked by the fact that it is hob-nobbing that makes the world go around! I try to accept and now avoid it, but it never ceases to amaze me.

Yes, I agree.

For a good part of my adult life, I thought that the most important thing was to be precise, hardworking and do good work. It never occurred to me that one had to be social at work; I thought they were 2 separate things. It never occurred to me that people could be so personal with their employers, I thought that was unprofessional! (Boy, was I way off there). It does seem totally stupid that these things are so important. I can´t tell you how many years I´ve been disappointed to see people in high positions- which they were not actually qualified to do- only because they knew how to use the system of social manipulation to get themselves into that position. It´s maddening that people make stupid decisions...It would be nice if the world were fair and logical.

Hang in there. I wish you luck!

Oh, funny...2 of you posted at the same time I did, and we all wrote basically the same thing!

Gee, we seem to be on the same wavelength here