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paolo
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22 Nov 2006, 12:56 am

It shoul be taken in account that the formal diagnosis for autistics sifts only a little part of the
population who is inept to social life, whatever the reasons. It’s in the nineties that talk about autism has began serously, and the elaboration of DXs. And before? Rejection of the world has existed since what we call antiquity and which in fact is already very modern. We don’t know nearly anything about the destiny of misfits in tribal society (probably in anthropological research we might find something of interest). But remaining in what we call antiquity, we find many expressions of the rejection of mundane or worldy life as considered sick, corrupt, sinful, unlivable described with various terms. The abandonment of normal social life may take various forms. Most histortical religions, Christianity, Tao, Buddhism are the adoption of some form of rejection of the world. The Essenes, who much influenced early christianity, rejected the world of their time, and were firmly convinced, like the early christians, of the imminent end of the world. There were the solitary monks (st Antoine who lived most of his life in the desert), there were the cynics, the stylites, and all those who embraced some form of monastic life. And often it was not easy to distinguish outright hobos from begging monks. Were they autistic? Probably the ancient world left much more space for them, was more tolerant. In contemporary society the world’s rejection of the misfit is politically stronger than the rejection of the world by the misfit. The misfit’s contractual position is much more vulnerable in a society founded on production and integration. Most people is forced to be a part of the great enterprise of production (production of thrash) and tolerance for people astray is practical nil and offered only under the umbrella of mental sicckness. So the DXs etc.



k96822
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22 Nov 2006, 11:04 am

lol wrote:
That's not how I read it at all.
What sort of life would you be living if your every meal was a salt lick? Could you truly call that a life at all?


I wouldn't call it life. I'd call it delicious.

lol wrote:
Additionally, I think CanyonWind is probably speaking of truth in a transcendent sense; in other words, the opposite of this sort of truth would not be lies (as this sort of truth is outside the realm of social order) but would be non-truth i.e. existential background noise. Humanity makes an additional form of "truth" that essentially allows the majority to get along with this noise in the form of art, language and an engrained social order. Depending on the person these two can be seen as a dichotomy or differing methods of inquiry, or as mutually elaborating on the human condition. My personal view is that the former can be in some cases quicker than the latter, but that it's not impossible to end up on the same page. However if one is limited to one manner of inquiry...


I guess I subscribe to the world view that I know nothing because I am so small and insignificant. It's fun to theorize but, in the end, it all comes down to trust. Humans are far from trustworthy, but I know I can trust God.



lol
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22 Nov 2006, 10:20 pm

paolo wrote:
It shoul be taken in account that the formal diagnosis for autistics sifts only a little part of the
population who is inept to social life, whatever the reasons. It’s in the nineties that talk about autism has began serously, and the elaboration of DXs. And before? Rejection of the world has existed since what we call antiquity and which in fact is already very modern...Most people is forced to be a part of the great enterprise of production (production of thrash) and tolerance for people astray is practical nil and offered only under the umbrella of mental sicckness. So the DXs etc.


Sometimes I think of it as some sort of conspiracy. I would say that somehow the principle of Progress has been ecclipsed by "One hand washes the other." Please excuse me, but society has become a "circlejerk." I was reading an article on the nature of poetry in America, and there is essentially nothing there. There is a cut-throat and prolific group of people producing rubbish, who are conspiring with a closed publishing-reviewer system to dupe the rest of the population, and feel superior because of it.

Tangential, I know, but:
Some would call Japan a tribal society; for comparison, the southern US, India and Italy would be rationalist. It's difficult to understand what this means, now and historically, but I would suggest it would mean gradual decline of civilization and mismanagement of real human capital; Gregory Clark, who formulated this theory, said one advantage of "more advanced rationalist civilizations" is their complex history of thought and philosophy (which is something the japanese, according to Mr. Clark, lack---they don't live according to principles but habit), but what good are said systems of thought as systems of order when they fundamentally fail to acknowledge that what is apparently a good proportion of the intelligent people within any population are also of a specific physiological make-up?

Pervasive developmental disorders are the highest as a percentage of the population in Japan when compared to the rest of the world; nevertheless, the average IQ is the highest of any country in the world (114). I would suggest that the two are related, if only to spite the NTs---as I said, such an observation would be fundamentally against their "understanding" of society (which has only more "soft-minded" as the years have gone by; in the USA, at least. Why else would everyone under 35 be so obsessed with fads and entertainment to the exclusion of all else?) Anyways, I theorize that in the past the genes for autistic spectrum disorders experienced positive selection in Japan; however, now that the general population is absorbing more and more Westernized ways of thinking and doing things mutual intolerance for such mental diversity will grow. We may already see this in the dropping fertility rate and hikkikomori phenomenon (jobless people who never leave their rooms.)

Another aspect of japanese culture that I found interesting: the class distinctions in japan haven't been of the sort you'd find in Europe. That is, they haven't been of overwhelming squalor and poverty versus obscenely decadent wealth. There has always been an emperor, but local communities, local religion, local customs, and skilled craftsmanship (if not education) have all been vital through the country's history. Heck, during the reign of the samurai the merchant class was on the bottom for the fact they made money. Contrast this with India, where there have always been extremely rigid classes. An untouchable will never be wealthy and is unlikely to have had an education (2 additional factors in realizing potential IQ by the way), and if s/he's an aspie s/he might as well just forage in the jungle rather than work. The social order exists as a sort of viral meme, living for itself and bringing squalor.



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22 Nov 2006, 10:31 pm

k96822 wrote:
I guess I subscribe to the world view that I know nothing because I am so small and insignificant. It's fun to theorize but, in the end, it all comes down to trust. Humans are far from trustworthy, but I know I can trust God.

I won't argue with that, but I guess you could say I hope for God and trust in reality. Usually I don't think of a Him, but an outside (what is distinct from myself.)



paolo
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24 Nov 2006, 2:25 am

An appeal for tenderness.

Since I read “The third chimpaze”, by Jared Diamond, and generally starting from the assumption that the history of man is a history of at least 150.000 years, I began having less interest for the present condition of humanity, which I am afraid is doomed in its accelerated sliding towards self destruction. And even if this were not true our individual control on great processes is nil and the future is not on our shoulders. I’ts not on my voting, my signing petititions, partecipating in marchs that the course will be sustantially modified. The great turning points of our collective life, wars among them, are decided by cabbals, secret services, lobbies working under cover, think (?) tanks surrounding formally power figures, Kissingers, Roves, Richerd Perles, Wolfowitzs and the like or tycoons of the media like Murdoch.

Only when the disasters are before the eyes of everyone does some sort of feedback works. But even then, and even given that the damage can be remedied, the countermeasures are taken at the initiative that is originated within the embedded circles of power. And again it’s always the short span of time that is considered. Global warming, overpopulation, collateral effects of production for the market, that is production of gadgets, weaponry and plain trash go on unchecked. We live longer, but sad impoverished lives, old people are abandoned to themselves or to shabby institutions, lagers in fact. It is very difficult to prospect a meaningful future for the young.

Hikikomori in Japan: perhaps one million of Japanese young people shut themselves in their roooms for years. It's the modern form of hermitage. Urban hermitage, because the city is now the wilderness. No need to take refuge in the deserts. The desert is in the city.

So better to take care of some little life-rafts for ourselves, search for tenderness and intimacy, than march under the authority of drilling sergeants. I think that tenderness is still possible to reach and the only emotion worthwhile living,



k96822
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25 Nov 2006, 5:29 pm

lol wrote:
k96822 wrote:
I guess I subscribe to the world view that I know nothing because I am so small and insignificant. It's fun to theorize but, in the end, it all comes down to trust. Humans are far from trustworthy, but I know I can trust God.

I won't argue with that, but I guess you could say I hope for God and trust in reality. Usually I don't think of a Him, but an outside (what is distinct from myself.)


That is interesting because He made reality! :-) As far as the pronoun, it is true: God is neither a he or a she, so it was just a default. Since we are all His children, and everything is from Him, perhaps it would have been more sense to use "Her" after all?