Written Expression and autism?

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That Boolean logic. Everything is reduced to either true or false.

Yep, that's me. When stressed, even if just from my own expectations of a talking situation, I forget words, stammer a little, make the wrong point etc etc. I used to be quite chatty, but not anymore. I quickly learned that saying - Better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.

As for writing, I've always written relatively well, especially on a forum - that's honed my writing even more.

I also love to write fiction, but for years my characters were almost all two dimensional. It's only the last few years I've been able to give them depth, expression, personalities, flaws etc. Some of it is archetypical, but I have can now individuate individuals in stories. Oddly, the types I find hardest to write are the villains. I just can't make them nasty enough.

Hmm. depends for me. If I have to come up with a new way of saying something- where my programmed phrases won't fit- then it is pretty poor. My speaking is worse though lol

I can talk in code all day, easy peasy. Typing gets me further- and I'm happy for it!! I'm very thankful that I still have the ability to type and communicate this way.

Now READING ... oy.... It takes me sometimes hours to get through a post that isn't broken up every two sentences. I break mine up to help me proof read.

Yesss!! Me too.. lol.

Also, it's good grammar to break something into a paragraph per thought.

Yay, I'm not alone! I love reading everyone's opinions and experiences, but it does get hard! I need a ruler or something to go line by line maybe.

Idea for a new app?

It'd be easier than highlighting with the mouse- that's for sure!

That sums it up pretty well for me.

I found something the other day that I had written at 15 before I even knew I was autistic and it was just a simple question- Are your feelings and thoughts genuinely yours if you can write them better than you can think them?

I can sound somewhat intelligent when I write, but I do not articulate my thoughts well while speaking so I come off as slightly idiotic most of the time. I wish it were the opposite and I could be charismatic and sound intelligent no matter what came out of my mouth, but it seems this will just never be who I am. Even when I was a child, I was in the school's gifted program and yet my peers perceived me as being below them when it came to intelligence.

When I've been (so many times) on the adult psych ward, there was a ward round once a week. On the ward I've been on most times, the main consultant psychiatrist there was really good. Ward round is scary. A room with nurses, doctors and medical students. So when ward round was on, my rule was to type an A4 page of a letter about what was going on in my head, and then hand it to the consultant. He said he always looked forward to my letters as they were so eloquent and well-written.

I am eloquent on paper.

Speaking is hard. Very hard. Although when I'm with a doctor (neurologist, GP, psychiatrist etc), I can talk about medical topics using complex and verbose medical terminology quite easily.

Talking in science speak is fine.

Talking in regular day-to-day speak...that is very hard.

Yes, those people eat, sleep, and breath deception, as well as practice psychopathic behaviors. Vague communication is their best friend because it can be twisted around for any use they wish. It's a tool for psychological manipulation.



Comp languages use real (prove-able) logic that does not change based on emotion. It is both consistent and competent.

To JBW: Yes I could really use a white-board for most of my communications. When I'm speaking to people they can't hear what I say because they are looking at me and seeing what they think to be a lack of confidence or competence, and end up thinking I'm just confused and/or lying.
I don't have the act or look of a salesman. I could not give away free money.

Correct. Specifically psychopathic communication is not arbitrarily vague. It often is designed to allow for two or more significantly different interpretations that allow the psychopath to select and insist on the most convenient one depending on which events unfold. Non-psychopaths are incapable of this level of conscious and systematic deception.




Computer languages are interpreted by software tool such as a compiler or virtual machine, and the interpretation remains stable as long as the same version of the compiler or virtual machine is used. However, computers and programming languages are also only human designed tools, and offer plenty of opportunities for psychopathic deception. The following Web page from Ted Nelson provides an excellent introduction to the world of commercial software http://xanadu.com.au/ted/TN/WRITINGS/TC ... iners.html.
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The Myth of "Technology". A frying-pan is technology. All human artifacts are technology. But beware anybody who uses this term. Like "maturity" and "reality" and "progress", the word "technology" has an agenda for your behavior: usually what is being referred to as "technology" is something that somebody wants you to submit to. "Technology" often implicitly refers to something you are expected to turn over to "the guys who understand it." This is actually almost always a political move. Somebody wants you to give certain things to them to design and decide. Perhaps you should, but perhaps not.
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Yes, I think the autistic tendency to be too honest for our own good, and our inability and/or reluctance to make use of the "art of persuasion" is our biggest limitation in the hyper "competitive" (= hyper deceptive) culture that surrounds us.

A white board can really help to keep the focus on the problem at hand, and it can be used as an open invitation to everyone present to point out errors or gaps in understanding that need to be addressed. I have found that visualising all the semantic links between the concepts in a problem statement or a solution design often helps people to realise the limits of their own understanding, and it paves the path for a rational and unemotional dialogue. Instead, if people are allowed to leap into long verbal explanations, critical details end up being brushed under the carpet, and it leads to the implicit and incorrect assumption that a shared understanding has been reached ? the ideal setup for surprises and disappointment further down the road.

Last edited by jbw on 28 Sep 2014, 1:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

100%. Like I posted in another thread, I consider it my savant ability. I real life am very withdrawn and basically nonverbal. Being able to express myself and interact with others is forums has set me free. Have been told over and over that I'm insightful and helpful and things like that. I'm very glad for it.

I definitely prefer writing over speaking, especially if I'm trying to explain more abstract concepts. I tend to trip over my words or use the wrong ones, and I also have a hard time getting to the point if I'm speaking, I will over-explain everything and go off on long tangents without realizing.

I still tend to be a bit too wordy in writing sometimes, and I can go on tangents and over-explain details, but I can always re-read and decide what is necessary and what isn't, so that's one thing I like about writing. But if I say something wrong to someone out loud, and try to go back and say, "That's not what I meant," for some reason they don't let me explain and won't let it go. Then I get extremely frustrated, and for some reason people find this amusing and will continue to prod me with questions, and I never realize until well after the argument that they were only arguing for the sake of watching me get flustered and annoyed I don't know why everyone thinks it's so funny, I think it is mean.

So yeah, anyway, I prefer to stick to writing. I was always good at writing assignments and hated giving verbal presentations. Even reading out loud is kind of hard for me, I tend to stutter and miss words while doing it, so I end up looking less intelligent, which is embarrassing.

I must say Ezra that you are one of the most insightful writers on this forum. When you have described the level of support you need - it completely boggles my mind. You have one hell of a brilliant mind and incredible ability to express it.

The iPad speaks your words for you? That is so cool.

Though I'm very quiet, I also speak well when the topic is more "shallow" (for example, discussing a work project; I'm also doing better at making small talk with appropriate non-verbal signals to keep conversations going). If someone wants details on my emotional life or on vaguer, deeper concepts, I don't know what to say anymore and I try to slip away from the subject as soon as possible. Not sure if this is because I don't know HOW to discuss those things, or if I just have never practiced.