I interview Steve Silberman about his bestselling book, Neurotribes

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I agree that because of the social cognition differences combined with that Autistics are a small minority, combined with an often confusing idea of the spectrum it is going to be much harder to change attitudes. So while it is extreamly frustrating that I gains have been much slower then other groups have had recently it is amazing how much the autism rights movement has accomplished.

This seems like exclusion though, like if I can't fit into ND group I should settle for further my goals in my own way instead of the group being more inclusive. It seems totally opposite to the ideals of neurodiversity, considering it is about larger society being more inclusive of autistic and other neurodiversity people and more accepting of differences. If ND advocates can't be more inclusive esp towards the people they advocate for, then how can they eggspect others to change and be more inclusive of them?

The difference with parents I have been around is that they focus on daily practicalities of raising their children instead of highest ideals that are mostly talk and not backed up by behaviors. They lack an ideology to adhere to, so they can be inclusive of someone like me. I would much rather work with these kinds of groups than ones resembling religious cults. I don't think autism groups by autistic people have to be like this, but the idealistic talk and appeals to emotion does tend to attract believers.

I have just finished the chapter entitled "The Boy Who Loves Green Straws". It seemed to debunk the notion that diet alone can "cure" autism, and that corporations proclaiming to have found an antidote should, under no circumstances, be trusted.

I think the important thing is that you experienced it as exclusion, so that's what it is from your perspective. People interested in the way neurodivergent people experience situations and interact with people and processes, things that I understand to be core ideas of the neurodiversity movement, should be very attuned to such experiences and perceptions.

I wish there was a way to resolve this with the original people you had trouble with, but my impression of people who are into neurodiversity suggests that there must be others who would not treat you that way and there must be others who are more focused on the practical issues you want to work on.

Hopefully, you will connect with those people in the future.


I think such "true believer" political processes might be a kind of special interest for some people.

I find that kind of rhetoric repellent, but it seems to me that there is more to the many people who are promoting the neurodiversity perspective than that.

Still, I am not much of a group activity person and know the little I know of this from online and printed material, not from in person meetings. Maybe the people who are motivated to put together such meetings tend also to be believers.

It seems to me that a degree of idealism is a necessary condition for any kind of political activism and many of the issues raised by neurodiversity activists are essentially political. For example, my daughter's therapist is fighting with the school district to have her assessed for ASD and believes that she is either on the spectrum or close to it in the BAP with some related diagnosis or diagnoses. The main thing is that the therapist believes that she needs more help and the school is trying not to give it to her. The people at the school are not bad people, but they have a limited budget and feel that they have to husband it very carefully, perhaps at the cost of not providing the kids with services they need. That is a political problem because it gets into the school district budget and a host of state and county political issues of great complexity. Someone who wants to make the better is going to be involved in politics. Maybe that kind of reality tends to preselect people with a certain affinity for politics of a certain kind for activist positions.

In any case, I feel this movement is a positive thing and neurodiversity itself is just an obvious truth, so helping people to acknowledge this and work with it for the general good is a positive thing. It seems to me that the trouble you have had in the past can't be endlessly replicated into the future because this movement will grow and change and include diverse individuals with many perspectives. Some of them are bound to be more sympathetic with you and you will be able to work with them to contribute your particular talents to the goal of improving life for autistic people and other neurodivergent people.

Maybe that is naive optimism, but it seems somewhat inevitable to me. This idea wont go away. More people will take it up and their interests will result in many permutations and divergent expressions of neurodiverse actvisim.

There is another group of people who want to create autism communities apart from larger society.
They are more practical, but I don't want to isolate from larger society, so I don't fit into their ideals either.

Another thing I have trouble with is that I rarely get what others are saying about autism in terms of their personal eggsperience. There is little match between mine and theirs, it seems. I don't feel what they feel, but many people do, so there are plenty of people all empathizing with each other, and I have no idea what they are talking about most of the time.

I am not an autistic separatist in any way. I do think autistic only support groups, vacation retreats could be useful for me and others on the spectrum. But complete separation defeats the purpose of Neurodiversity. It is giving up, losing all hope that the autistic rights movement can get the neuromajority to meet us part way.

The idea of separatism is a thing that happens with a lot of activist communities based around a group identity. That doesn't make sense to me either. The particular needs of that kind of effort, e.g., setting up an intentional community for lesbian separatists, does call for a lot of practical focus, but the ideals are what drives all of that.

It seems to me this is an intrinsic part of the "spectrum" idea. There are sub groups within the spectrum where people have certain traits and other subgroups that seem quite different, so one would expect different people on the spectrum to get each other or not to differing degrees. It seems to me that part of the neurodiversity idea is respecting these differences and taking them into consideration, maybe something some groups are still learning how to do.

i read the book and the interview. i have not read this thread.

i liked the book and the interview. however for me the book made me feel quite isolated as an autistic person who is not good at maths, science or technology because of all the talk about how we are supposed to be great at that.

i am not great at any of that. im interested in technology and science and my technology skills are above average, but they're nothing amazing. my interests are in social sciences but the books sort of made me feel like they shouldn't be. like i should be really interested in sciences and maths instead. but im just not good at maths at all. i can barely do basic addition and subtraction.

the history parts made me sad. overall the book made me sad.

You don't have to be good at or interested in math, science, or tech.
Many autistic people are interested in social sciences or humanities too.
Or art and music.
Even sports, there are autistic people who are good at sports.
All kinds of interests and talents in autism, just like in neurotypicals.

Can not answer theft the way aI want captchas blowing away my answer multiple times I mostly agree the should not have limit suspected historical figures and some topics are brutal

I think those autistics who develop great talents do so only because they were lucky enough to develop them within a supportive environment. In those cases where you're kept from obsessing over your special interests by parents or teachers, you're going to be held back.

There's also the style of teaching. Even if it is on an interesting topic, it may be entirely tailored towards NT learning styles, making an aspie jump throughthe wrong kind of hoops, and unable to achieve their full potential.

Also depending on the age at which you end up becoming depressed, that too can hold you back, because it can utterly sap any motivation you may have to do anything.

I got this book on Audible and am listening to it for the 3rd time. I highly recommend listening to it, over reading it... At least for me, I didn't catch a lot of what I caught the 2nd time. And with the third time and catching nearly all of it. This book is fantastic! Thank you for interviewing him. And thanks to Steve for writing such an amazing, insightful book.

great

Thank you so much for writing this article and to the author for writing the book. I will be reading it soon because I am trying to mend the wounds on my psyche from growing up with the constant message from family, church, and peers that I am not good enough, that there is something deeply wrong with me, that I am shameful and evil because I've been autistic, fat, queer and trans since as far back as I can remember. To hear my family talk, as soon as I began to assert my personality around age four, I became a lost cause! But now I'm beginning to understand the reasons they said these things and why I am how I am, which is helping me gain self confidence and find some peace. I've gotten them to respect me and stop bullying me. I hope other kids' families can instead have compassion and acceptance for their autistic family members because they've learned better from books like these that are accessible to laypeople.

Thank you for linking this

I just finished the book. As a fan of Asperger's who started learning German in part to read Autische Psychopathen in the original, I love reading about psychiatric and diagnostic history, and as furious (particularly at Kanner and Lovaas) as some parts made me, the ending was wonderful.