Are you or have you been obsessed with intelligence?

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LostInSpace
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27 Oct 2007, 6:26 pm

Brian003 wrote:

I'll just ignore the first part of your post then. Or I can just pretend that it wasn't included.

I'm not quite sure what you mean, but do what you want. *Shrug*

Do you disagree that the logical argument presented by Mw99 does not actually follow from the initial assumption? That's what I was commenting on, because some people actually do think that way. If you don't understand why it is not a valid argument, then you need to go back to eighth grade math. Since I don't like making those kinds of assumptions about people I don't know, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, and assume you read more into my statement than what was meant.

Brian003
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27 Oct 2007, 6:40 pm

I already passed College Calculus(And got an A) so I wouldn't imagine 8th grade Math to be that hard.

But if you are the type that thinks your opinion is always right then I don't see any point in continuing this any further. At least we agree on something.

LostInSpace
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27 Oct 2007, 6:42 pm

Brian003 wrote:

All right then, you only skimmed my post, didn't you? Possibly didn't even get to the end? Whatever, clearly you're not interested in listening to other people's opinions. That's been pretty obvious throughout this thread. I can't believe quirky has had the patience to keep posting this long.

Mw99
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27 Oct 2007, 6:52 pm

Brian003 wrote:

Standardized Test scores are based on a result of how much you care about what you are learning. A person gets a higher score on a test like the SAT because that person cared about school and payed attention in class for the 10 years or so he/she was in class before the SAT; so when he/she took the SAT they did better than someone who did not care as much.

I know your reply is not to me, but...
Some people do well on the SATs because they are intelligent and because they possess a reasonable amount of knowledge related to the subject matter. Some other people do well on the SATs not by virtue of their intelligence but by virtue of working their butts off ("because that person cared about school and payed attention in class for the 10 years or so he/she was in class before the SAT"). Similarly, some people don't do well on the SATs, and that could be due to a variety of reasons: maybe they are slackers who never cared to learn basic math ("because if you don't care about something you are not going to bother learning about it. Ignoring all other factors"), maybe they got drunk the night before the exam, maybe they were ill or maybe they are not overly intelligent or have a learning disability.

Your argument is that there is no correlation between SAT scores and intelligence, but scientific evidence indicates the contrary. THERE IS a strong positive correlation between SAT scores and intelligence. Do you even understand what the term "strong positive correlation" means?

Quote:

And of course, if you care more; you are going to study more. The real reason people don't do good on tests is because they really don't care about what they are learning:

That's a reason, but another reason is that they are not overly intelligent, have a learning disability or suffer from some type of psychological or emotional problem. A member of this forum sent me a PM the other day telling me that he worked his butt off studying for exams and still ended up with B's; he also mentioned that his roommate was a slacker, played Halo all day, and still managed to do well in school.

Quote:

According to you, yes. People who do not care about school=Stupid.

Nobody said that (all) people who do not care about school are stupid....

Brian003
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27 Oct 2007, 6:52 pm

Honestly, I think that is kind of funny coming from a person who thinks like you.

Brian003
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27 Oct 2007, 7:05 pm

Mw99 wrote:

I know your reply is not to me, but...
Some people do well on the SATs because they are intelligent and because they possess a reasonable amount of knowledge related to the subject matter.

Which they obtain through paying attention in school.

Mw99 wrote:

Some other people do well on the SATs not by virtue of their intelligence but by virtue of working their butts off ("because that person cared about school and payed attention in class for the 10 years or so he/she was in class before the SAT").

I agree.

Mw99 wrote:

Similarly, some people don't do well on the SATs, and that could be due to a variety of reasons: maybe they are slackers who never cared to learn basic math.

Because they didn't pay attention.

Mw99 wrote:

maybe they got drunk the night before the exam

.

Not a good idea.

Mw99 wrote:

maybe they were ill or maybe they are not overly intelligent or have a learning disability.

I'll ignore the fact that this is coming from someone who thinks they are smart because they did well in school and had a high GPA.

Mw99 wrote:

Your argument is that there is no correlation between SAT scores and intelligence

Really, when was this the basis of my argument? I stated that there is more to intelligence than standardized tests scores. In fact, honestly I don't think it is possible to measure intelligence scientifically.

Mw99 wrote:

but scientific evidence indicates the contrary.

Yes, of course it does. Scientific evidence also shows that people who do better on their ACT scores will do better in College. Unfortuntaely, I do not base everything on statistics.

Mw99 wrote:

THERE IS a strong positive correlation between SAT scores and intelligence.

According to Science.

Mw99 wrote:

Do you even understand what the term "strong positive correlation" means?

Oh, I really should ignore this comment. I see now why you have such a hard time making friends. Just because I do not think like a robot makes me this unintelligent, ret*d, human being that doesn't understand anything besides "I LIKE CAKE!"

Mw99 wrote:

That's a reason, but another reason is that they are not overly intelligent, have a learning disability or suffer from some type of psychological or emotional problem.

Of course people who do not do well on tests are dumb.

Mw99 wrote:

A member of this forum sent me a PM the other day telling me that he worked his butt off studying for exams and still ended up with B's; he also mentioned that his roommate was a slacker, played Halo all day, and still managed to do well in school.

Could this be because the kid who played Halo knew how to study more effieciently or payed attention in class. And the kid who studied all the time wasted time memorizing concepts instead of doing actual problem solving.

Mw99 wrote:

Nobody said that (all) people who do not care about school are stupid....

True, but Quirky did imply it.

Mw99
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27 Oct 2007, 7:48 pm

Brian003 wrote:

Mw99 wrote:

I know your reply is not to me, but...
Some people do well on the SATs because they are intelligent and because they possess a reasonable amount of knowledge related to the subject matter.

Which they obtain through paying attention in school.

It's possible that they didn't pay attention in school but did well on the SATs because they spent a reasonable amount of time studying exclusively for the SATs...

Quote:

Mw99 wrote:

maybe they were ill or maybe they are not overly intelligent or have a learning disability.

I'll ignore the fact that this is coming from someone who thinks they are smart because they did well in school and had a high GPA.

I don't think I am smart because I did well in school and had a high GPA, but I do think the fact that I did reasonably well in school and ended up with a relatively high GPA without the need to work my butt off and despite having what a lot of neurotypical people refer to as a "bad attitude" suggests that I am reasonably intelligent. Either that, or the school I went to has a serious problem of grade inflation.

Quote:

Mw99 wrote:

Your argument is that there is no correlation between SAT scores and intelligence

And who is denying that there is more to intelligence than standardized test scores?

Quote:

Mw99 wrote:

but scientific evidence indicates the contrary.

Yes, of course it does. Scientific evidence also shows that people who do better on their ACT scores will do better in College. Unfortuntaely, I do not base everything on statistics.

Just because scientific evidence shows that most people who do better on their ACT will do better in college doesn't mean this will be true for everyone. Do you understand this? If the arguments you write on this forum are in any way related to whatever thoughts happen to be in your head, I think it's very possible that you just don't get it.

Quote:

Mw99 wrote:

That's a reason, but another reason is that they are not overly intelligent, have a learning disability or suffer from some type of psychological or emotional problem.

Of course people who do not do well on tests are dumb.

Dumb people generally don't do well on tests, but that doesn't mean that a person is dumb if he doesn't do well on tests.

Quote:

Mw99 wrote:

Nobody said that (all) people who do not care about school are stupid....

True, but Quirky did imply it.

I think it could also be argued that you implied that SAT scores are unrelated to intelligence...

Last edited by Mw99 on 27 Oct 2007, 8:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

quirky
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27 Oct 2007, 8:35 pm

I'm giving up lol. Apparently I have less intelligence than a brick - I doubt one person who has ever met me would agree with that but whatever. One last point: There are plenty of kids who pay no attention in school and still do well on SATs or other assignments due to intelligence. Some kids are so brilliant at math that they never have to take a review class in their life and it makes perfect sense to them. Some can read a literary passage and comprehend every meaning and nuance without having taken AP English. They may have failed out of school - but they are still bright. You don't have to pay attention to do well on the SAT. Doing things the way society does them doesn't make you a robot - some people think for themselves and agree with certain things in society, and wish to live their lives this way. It doesn't mean they can't think for themselves - but many ways of society are the practical thing to do ( which is why they're common in the first place ) - sometimes the typical thing is the intelligent thing to do. I'm losing my train of thought, but for now, I'm ceasing to argue. And one more thing - you say I imply people who don't care about school are idiots. I didn't - I implied that people who don't care about knowledge are idiots. People should want to learn about new things and be aware of what's going on around them - a girl who got admitted to Harvard but doesn't know who our VP is is to me a lot less intelligent than someone with lesser grades who understands the world.

Mw99
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27 Oct 2007, 8:45 pm

quirky wrote:

People should want to learn about new things and be aware of what's going on around them - a girl who got admitted to Harvard but doesn't know who our VP is is to me a lot less intelligent than someone with lesser grades who understands the world.

Is she an American? Does she live in this country?

I don't know a lot of things that most people take for granted, but then again, I don't care...

Brian003
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27 Oct 2007, 11:42 pm

Mw99 wrote:

Brian003 wrote:

Mw99 wrote:

I know your reply is not to me, but...
Some people do well on the SATs because they are intelligent and because they possess a reasonable amount of knowledge related to the subject matter.

Which they obtain through paying attention in school.

It's possible that they didn't pay attention in school but did well on the SATs because they spent a reasonable amount of time studying exclusively for the SATs...

Quote:

Mw99 wrote:

maybe they were ill or maybe they are not overly intelligent or have a learning disability.

I'll ignore the fact that this is coming from someone who thinks they are smart because they did well in school and had a high GPA.

Quote:

Mw99 wrote:

Your argument is that there is no correlation between SAT scores and intelligence

And who is denying that there is more to intelligence than standardized test scores?

Quote:

Mw99 wrote:

but scientific evidence indicates the contrary.

Yes, of course it does. Scientific evidence also shows that people who do better on their ACT scores will do better in College. Unfortuntaely, I do not base everything on statistics.

Quote:

Mw99 wrote:

That's a reason, but another reason is that they are not overly intelligent, have a learning disability or suffer from some type of psychological or emotional problem.

Of course people who do not do well on tests are dumb.

Dumb people generally don't do well on tests, but that doesn't mean that a person is dumb if he doesn't do well on tests.

Quote:

Mw99 wrote:

Nobody said that (all) people who do not care about school are stupid....

True, but Quirky did imply it.

I think it could also be argued that you implied that SAT scores are unrelated to intelligence...

Don't let the robot win!

Brian003
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27 Oct 2007, 11:48 pm

quirky wrote:

All I have to say is that if you think academic success(Test scores, SAT grades, GPA, whatever) are the only measure of intelligence then you are socially ret*d.

Contrasting to what you may believe, there are other things that measure intelligence that have nothing to do with anacademic setting, but require a basic understanding of society and class to fully comprehend. Maybe instead of viewing people as 1-10 on an intelligence scale by test results you should try to look at other things that can account for intelligence. Seriously.

Mw99
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28 Oct 2007, 4:26 pm

[Brian, you are an insecure person.

SamuraiSaxen
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28 Oct 2007, 5:00 pm

I've been obsessed with memory, since I noticed by myself that I can remember a lot of trivial facts, dates, hours, minor details, and other things that people can't remember.

IdahoRose
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28 Oct 2007, 5:05 pm

Other people constantly tell me I'm intelligent, although sometimes I have difficulty believing that.

CockneyRebel
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28 Oct 2007, 5:16 pm

In Canada, having a Learning Disability and having Mental Retardation are completely different things.

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tomart
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28 Oct 2007, 7:02 pm

I'm responding to the original post, rather than the long flamey ones.

I've always been attracted to intelligent people - I enjoy how they think, I learn so much more from them than from dull, limited people, AND - I realized from an early age that I wasn't gonna go far on my social skills or understanding of NTs. So I tried (over)compensating.
I read books on genius, and discovered that I liked Hesse, Goethe, Nietzsche, Newton, Einstein, Frank Herbert, philosophy, science, cosmology, evolution, science fiction, etc.

There's a book with a title like: "the A students wind up working for the C students." Horribly unfair! But, I wish I'd known and prepared better for the real world. (Of course, finding out about Asperger's 40 years ago would have helped enormously.)

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