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rude1
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07 Feb 2016, 9:35 pm

Dear NT,
First I would like to make it clear that I by no means intend on generalizing you or your population, but if what I'm about to say applies to you, you know who you are. I don't understand why you insist on being in charge and setting the rules for what is "normal" or "acceptable" and what is not. I watch you in social situations and the only purpose of your interactions seem to be to please other people. You appear to me to have a manual built into your brains constantly telling you what is socially acceptable, which I translate as what everyone else wants to hear so they'll like you. You tell me you don't have any guide. And maybe you don't. Maybe you are so used to following this code which has been imprinted in your mind that you unconsciously do so without even stopping to question it. Do you know that sometimes when I'm outside with you and you're socializing among eachother that I'm staring at plants and noticing the intricate details on the flowers and imagining them emerging from the dirt all while making a mental note to classify them later? And if I chime into your conversation, I may say something you like to call "random" or "off the wall", which translates into "I, NT, don't like what you said so it's officially wrong."

But what about me? Are you going to stop laughing so loud because it hurts my ears? Are you going to stop talking about what your boyfriend did last night because I don't care? Are you going to stop wearing bright red because I don't like the color? Of course not. Because there's more of you, it makes you typical, right? Wrong. It makes you followers. Granted, you don't have autism. No, you don't have to be like me. But many of you enjoy pointing out what is wrong with people like me and/or trying to be saviors because you assume I want to be you. You base your entire lives around other people and "friends". Many of you have 5k+ friends on facebook and I doubt you know half of them. Your selfies with random people scream out I'm pleasing everyone by being my perfect sunshine self!! !! And these people profit you; the more selfies the more likes. I have news for you. There's a good chance none of these people will be at your deathbed. There's a good chance only one person will be at your deathbed: yourself.

And when that time comes, if you ask yourself "am I pleased?" what will the answer be? Have you pleased yourself, the one who was always there? Or was it all about everyone else and socialization? This is what you call me selfish for. When you agreed to go to the mall with your friend did you always want to? When you chattered away with the group, did you ever want to say something, but not say it because other people would find it inappropriate? As people, when you are alone with your thoughts, do you ever take the time to question anything? Maybe the world is backwards? Or to you, is that "crazy" AKA I, NT do not understand this so it is wrong.

Honestly I wish to understand how your minds work and why it is that your way of life gets to be mainstream. I acknowledge that you may have problems of your own. But you can easily find someone to talk to who will understand. And you won't have a problem expressing yourself. One thing I notice is that you apply your values and thoughts to me and make assumptions based on that. For example, I once had to use the restroom in a church and quickly walked passed a certain NT in the pew, possibly brushing him slightly. His remark, being that I did not say excuse me was: "you just push me like, get the hell out of my way". Why do you assume I'm thinking "get the hell out of my way?" What if I was thinking "Excuse me"? Or what if I simply had to use the bathroom and you weren't in my head at all, as I've attempted to explain many times. Instead of thinking and considering these possible scenarios , you once again blindly follow the social code imposed upon you.

I feel as if you leave the house expecting everyone out in public to be a clone of you. Which is why you stare at my feet when I walk on tiptoe. For the most part, you're right. There's typically only a few different people in one area and everyone else tends to blend in, the way you like it. But when I go out I think the opposite. I have to brace myself to deal with the mobs of you. I have to expect you to come up and ask me my age [I look young as mentioned in another post]. If I want a burger from Mcdonald's, I have to rehearse my order. I know how badly you want to cure me so you can make a million dollars, but I don't struggle with this because of autism alone. My way of ordering a burger would be: Burger. Fries. Chocolate Milk Shake. For here. But you insist I do it your way, with sentences. Because my way is rude. That's the part I've struggled with and have for many years no matter how many times you try to "correct" me; I'm not naturally the way you say I should be and never will.

Your lifestyles reigns everywhere. Naturally anyone who follows your code will fit in at high school. If I got a job anywhere near your public, you would have a huge problem with my stimming, because again-if it's not something you see everyday, it's not okay. You raise your children to be judgmental by sheltering them from reality or anything abnormal, you allow your 4 year old to point at people with disabilities because they're just a kid, but they grow up thinking they run the world. So what do I want from you? I want you to stop thinking the world revolves around you. Stop assuming I want to be like you, stop calling my autism a curse when you cause 80% of its problems, stop expecting me to conform to you when you don't have to conform to me. I don't automatically denounce your behaviors just because I don't understand them. The difference between you and I is that I only care because it actually affects me. As said, I have struggled to find employment, order food, and go out into your world because you can't deal with me.

I don't want to be your 999th friend on Facebook. I don't want to pose for a meaningless selfie with you. But, sometimes, if you would give me a chance, I'd like to be your friend-that word has a different meaning to me-if you would give me a chance. If you would stop writing me off as weird or strange or crazy and consider this-I may not think the same as you, but that's the way you think, we were all created with unique brains, this is yours, I may never understand but I will ACCEPT it. And I will do the same for you!

Me


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The world is backwards and upside down. So far they show no signs of hearing my voice; I am silenced and discounted yet I continue to shout until I can shout no more.


StarTrekker
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08 Feb 2016, 3:19 am

Very nicely written. I agree vehemently. You've inspired me to try and write something similar, perhaps for my blog.


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EzraS
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08 Feb 2016, 4:56 am

I hate to harp on this, but if people spent their life mainly surrounded by people on the autism spectrum, like I have, they would probably realize their problem with people would not be limited to "NT's", but rather with people in general.

I generally don't like most people all that much, pretty much for the kind of stuff listed above. But for me a majority of the people I've had a problem with, have very thoroughly diagnosed autism. As a whole people tend to be irritating, annoying, intrusive, condescending, rude, self absorbed, attention seeking and all that. Even the ones with autism.



nurseangela
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08 Feb 2016, 6:23 am

We don't write any rules, that's just the way we are. We can't change anymore than you can change. We have to be social. I don't know what being a "follower" means. I don't follow anyone, I wear what I want, I choose not to be on Facebook and sometimes I like a lot of small talk and to have a really good laugh. I also like people to treat me like how I would treat them and that means saying "excuse me" if you're passing in front of me - basic manners that everyone should do. Little kids point because that is natural for them, but etiquette is supposed to teach them not to point. I rehearse my order several times before I call Pizza Hut.

"The difference between you and I is that I only care because it actually affects me."
So if what we do didn't affect you then you would just write us off and ignore us? Isn't that what you think we do?

Gotta get back to work.


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Your neurodiverse (Aspie) score: 83 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 153 of 200 You are very likely neurotypical
Darn, I flunked.


rude1
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08 Feb 2016, 2:27 pm

nurseangela wrote:
So if what we do didn't affect you then you would just write us off and ignore us? Isn't that what you think we do?


No, I would accept you, as I do now. I highlighted in my final sentence that I would like to coexist with you.


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The world is backwards and upside down. So far they show no signs of hearing my voice; I am silenced and discounted yet I continue to shout until I can shout no more.


rude1
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08 Feb 2016, 2:29 pm

nurseangela wrote:
We can't change anymore than you can change.



Did you actually read my letter or just go to conclusions? I said I don't want you to change. I want you to stop expecting me to change. Again, more assumptions...


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The world is backwards and upside down. So far they show no signs of hearing my voice; I am silenced and discounted yet I continue to shout until I can shout no more.


rude1
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08 Feb 2016, 2:31 pm

EzraS wrote:
I generally don't like most people all that much, pretty much for the kind of stuff listed above. But for me a majority of the people I've had a problem with, have very thoroughly diagnosed autism. As a whole people tend to be irritating, annoying, intrusive, condescending, rude, self absorbed, attention seeking and all that. Even the ones with autism.


Yes, I can understand that. People with autism are people too and definitely not exempt from wrongdoing. I was just speaking of my experiences with certain NTs :wink:


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The world is backwards and upside down. So far they show no signs of hearing my voice; I am silenced and discounted yet I continue to shout until I can shout no more.


rude1
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08 Feb 2016, 2:34 pm

nurseangela wrote:
I also like people to treat me like how I would treat them and that means saying "excuse me" if you're passing in front of me - basic manners that everyone should do.


Basic manners that come easy to you and matter to you. I would like everyone to color code their wardrobe like me, something everyone should do, in my opinion.

To be clear so I'm not misunderstood, I'm aware not everyone is going to color code their wardrobes and I do not try to enforce it on others. Therefore it is unfair to enforce your rules on me.


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The world is backwards and upside down. So far they show no signs of hearing my voice; I am silenced and discounted yet I continue to shout until I can shout no more.


Last edited by rude1 on 08 Feb 2016, 2:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

rude1
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08 Feb 2016, 2:40 pm

nurseangela wrote:
I rehearse my order several times before I call Pizza Hut.


I did not mean rehearsing so you simply don't forget what you're ordering. I mean bracing yourself because not only are you terrified of speaking, so you're able to verbally say the sentence correctly.

And once again, if this doesn't apply to you, it's not addressed to you...


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The world is backwards and upside down. So far they show no signs of hearing my voice; I am silenced and discounted yet I continue to shout until I can shout no more.


DestinedToBeAPotato
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08 Feb 2016, 2:45 pm

I didn't spot a single lie in this post - although not all NTs engage in sickeningly sycophantic behaviour, this is ultimately how society functions as a whole. This is what is expected of people, in order to become popular, one must dilute one's authenticity and individuality until they become mediocre and bland (paraphrasing Oscar Wilde here).


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conciouscohort
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08 Feb 2016, 3:32 pm

Hello,

I like your post. I am a concious NT. I wrote a book about a strange experience. I'm not sure what to do with it.
I would very, very much appreciate feedback or interest from those on the spectrum. Conscious NT is a big claim, but I never lie.
Below is a brief description of me and the book. If it interests you, contact me and I will give you a link to read the full book on the web.
No cost or anything, no download necessary, and new input for you.


My name is Claire Hoogstra, and I am a thirty-one year old advocate of autistic intelligence. I currently live with my husband Brandon, who is on the autism spectrum, and our two young kids in Latin America. I have a B.A. in Communication Studies from Hollins University in Virginia, though I didn't like school.

This book is about my opting to become homeless with my husband prior to our marriage and having children. It explores the nature of autistic intelligence, the lack of recognition of its existence, and it follows us through the beginning of a difficult journey. Throughout, I maintain a position that autism is really just the vestiges of the male mind trying to crop back up in a now insanely feminist world. My writing is not anti-female though, just pro-male. In my telling of our story, I also offer many observations about the state of mankind on this planet, which can be bleak given the situations that we face during our travels. I intend to plant a seed of doubt in a reader's mind about what is commonly considered to be right versus wrong in the way we interact with one another and the world around us, while simultaneously offering hope in other possibilities.

The story opens with my return to the U.S. from South Africa in 2009, where I was trying to help my father achieve his dream of establishing a space for those on the spectrum to live apart from neurotypicals and create unique things without being weighed down by all of the rule sets of the world in its current state. Believing my mother could be integral to the salvation of the project, having been sent away by my father when our funding was cut, I return to live with her as an adult. Over the course of one year spent in my mother's house, I begin to lose interest in her importance, growing agitated with the revelation that she seems to show no compassion for anything, and I grow increasingly anxious to embark on a life with Brandon, a diagnosed schizophrenic man who I am in love with.

Brandon and I met several years before during a period of enlightenment for both of us. For him, this was a time of realization that he was a lot less nuts than he thought and everyone else was a lot less sane. It was then that he reached out to my father, believing himself to be autistic and met me. Because Brandon had such a profound impact on me since he came into my life, I find myself terribly distraught over the hard fact that he is now nearly dead due to the damage the world has inflicted on him. I resolve that I will either commit suicide or join up with Brandon. He finds a way to bribe the director of the halfway house he is living in to let me stay under the pretense that I am an addict, and from there, we begin a journey that is both horrible and beautiful all at once.

We spend several months living among rough men in the recovery home before leaving in late Winter to become homeless. With nowhere to go that will allow us to stay together, we venture into the unknown. We sneak into a downtown building to sleep, stay at a forgotten campground for several weeks, experience life in a homeless shelter, crash in a dilapidated, vacant motel, and sleep behind a church by the sea while we travel through mill towns and bay side beach cities. Finally, we make it back to where we started and are able to give birth to our son, who gives us his protection until we can make a heavenly alternative to life on Earth as we know it or die trying.

My book isn't all about the dark side either. After all, the two main characters are creatures of light, meaning that their intentions are pure. There is accidental humor sprinkled throughout coupled with light-hearted sarcasm.
-Claire



conciouscohort
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08 Feb 2016, 3:37 pm

Oh yes...contact info:
[email protected]



nurseangela
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08 Feb 2016, 4:47 pm

rude1 wrote:
nurseangela wrote:
So if what we do didn't affect you then you would just write us off and ignore us? Isn't that what you think we do?


No, I would accept you, as I do now. I highlighted in my final sentence that I would like to coexist with you.


If you accepted NT's, you wouldn't have wrote the big long letter.


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I'm happiness challenged.

Your neurodiverse (Aspie) score: 83 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 153 of 200 You are very likely neurotypical
Darn, I flunked.


nurseangela
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08 Feb 2016, 4:48 pm

rude1 wrote:
nurseangela wrote:
We can't change anymore than you can change.



Did you actually read my letter or just go to conclusions? I said I don't want you to change. I want you to stop expecting me to change. Again, more assumptions...


I don't expect you to change. That's an assumption on your part now.


_________________
Me grumpy?
I'm happiness challenged.

Your neurodiverse (Aspie) score: 83 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 153 of 200 You are very likely neurotypical
Darn, I flunked.


nurseangela
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08 Feb 2016, 4:58 pm

rude1 wrote:
EzraS wrote:
I generally don't like most people all that much, pretty much for the kind of stuff listed above. But for me a majority of the people I've had a problem with, have very thoroughly diagnosed autism. As a whole people tend to be irritating, annoying, intrusive, condescending, rude, self absorbed, attention seeking and all that. Even the ones with autism.


Yes, I can understand that. People with autism are people too and definitely not exempt from wrongdoing. I was just speaking of my experiences with certain NTs :wink:


And I've had problems with certain Aspies. :wink: Each person is going to be different. If I posted a long letter about the problems I've had with Aspies, I'm sure to get the same kind of replies that you're getting from me. But I know that all people aren't the same. All threads like this do is make the gap between Aspie and NT even bigger. Any person would take offense to it if you're on the side that is being discussed. How are you trying to understand NT's any better? Read any books lately? Or are you just wanting us to change? It goes both ways. You are never going to feel like the NT side has done anything to change for you because there are way too many NT's and MOST don't know about Aspergers. They just think that you are "different". I would go by the people (NT's) that you do know - are they doing anything to get to know you more and why you do the things you do? If not, then they aren't worth your time. Same goes for me, if I'm in a friendship/relationship with an Aspie and they don't know why I act like I do and try to understand me more, then they aren't worth my time.


_________________
Me grumpy?
I'm happiness challenged.

Your neurodiverse (Aspie) score: 83 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 153 of 200 You are very likely neurotypical
Darn, I flunked.


nurseangela
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08 Feb 2016, 5:05 pm

rude1 wrote:
nurseangela wrote:
I also like people to treat me like how I would treat them and that means saying "excuse me" if you're passing in front of me - basic manners that everyone should do.


Basic manners that come easy to you and matter to you. I would like everyone to color code their wardrobe like me, something everyone should do, in my opinion.

To be clear so I'm not misunderstood, I'm aware not everyone is going to color code their wardrobes and I do not try to enforce it on others. Therefore it is unfair to enforce your rules on me.


What rules, dude? Etiquette? Most manners are actually just a way of being "decent" to people. I think you would like it more if I said "excuse me" to you if I was needing to get past you rather than me just mowing over you like you were in my way and didn't have a right to be where you were at that time. Manners are a way of showing "respect" to another person. They are a "learned" behavior. Believe me, TONS of NT's are ruder than hell.

I have had Aspie friends, I've read Aspie books, I've talked to Aspies about why they are the way they are and there are certain things that I needed to learn in order to keep a friendship with them. I HAD TO LEARN. So why is it that Aspies can't learn etiquette? And what other rules are you talking about?


_________________
Me grumpy?
I'm happiness challenged.

Your neurodiverse (Aspie) score: 83 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 153 of 200 You are very likely neurotypical
Darn, I flunked.