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Aspie solidarity is a big fat myth

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Daniel89
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05 Apr 2018, 1:01 pm

Dear_one wrote:
Daniel89 wrote:
The welfare state means they won't struggle to have offspring, the welfare state is dysgenics in action.


Archaeologists are always ecstatic when they find healed hominid bones, because it means that people were taking care of each other in times of trouble, ie: becoming human.
The modern welfare state is a recognition that machines are doing most of the work, making everyone so rich that charity is less of a burden than it was. There are simply not enough jobs to go around, and the owners have managed to create fierce competition even for marginal employment.
Times of great turmoil are not suited to selecting a population for happy times; ruthlessness and greed lead to times like the "Hundred Year War" rather than a millennium of peace.


In the western world there are enough jobs we even import foreign labour to do jobs. Automation leads to cheaper prices, cheaper prices means people can work less. The problem with the welfare state is not temporary unemployment or the disabled, its low skill low IQ people having more children and having them younger over the generations this will decrease the IQ of society and make it a worse place to live.



fluffysaurus
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05 Apr 2018, 1:10 pm

Daniel89 wrote:
Dear_one wrote:
Daniel89 wrote:
The welfare state means they won't struggle to have offspring, the welfare state is dysgenics in action.


Archaeologists are always ecstatic when they find healed hominid bones, because it means that people were taking care of each other in times of trouble, ie: becoming human.
The modern welfare state is a recognition that machines are doing most of the work, making everyone so rich that charity is less of a burden than it was. There are simply not enough jobs to go around, and the owners have managed to create fierce competition even for marginal employment.
Times of great turmoil are not suited to selecting a population for happy times; ruthlessness and greed lead to times like the "Hundred Year War" rather than a millennium of peace.


In the western world there are enough jobs we even import foreign labour to do jobs. Automation leads to cheaper prices, cheaper prices means people can work less. The problem with the welfare state is not temporary unemployment or the disabled, its low skill low IQ people having more children and having them younger over the generations this will decrease the IQ of society and make it a worse place to live.
Can you show that people with lower IQs have more children than the average.


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Daniel89
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05 Apr 2018, 1:19 pm

fluffysaurus wrote:
Can you show that people with lower IQs have more children than the average.


I am not aware of any statistics relating to IQ however IQ correlates with income, lower income people are financially reward for having children whereas those on higher incomes are not. Young girls with not many prospects here in the UK will get pregnant knowing they will get a council house and income support.



fluffysaurus
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05 Apr 2018, 1:45 pm

Daniel89 wrote:
fluffysaurus wrote:
Can you show that people with lower IQs have more children than the average.


I am not aware of any statistics relating to IQ however IQ correlates with income, lower income people are financially reward for having children whereas those on higher incomes are not. Young girls with not many prospects here in the UK will get pregnant knowing they will get a council house and income support.
Then why have teenage pregnancies been constantly falling for years? I doubt UK IQ's have increased. You are right to say that it is the girls without prospects but as the prospects for young girls even in deprived areas have improved fewer of them are making the decision to have children early which shows it was a lack of opportunities rather than a lack of IQ that was the problem. Also they are not the only or even main people having large families, these are most often second families due to divorce and nothing to do with income.


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Daniel89
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05 Apr 2018, 1:52 pm

fluffysaurus wrote:
Then why have teenage pregnancies been constantly falling for years? I doubt UK IQ's have increased. You are right to say that it is the girls without prospects but as the prospects for young girls even in deprived areas have improved fewer of them are making the decision to have children early which shows it was a lack of opportunities rather than a lack of IQ that was the problem. Also they are not the only or even main people having large families, these are most often second families due to divorce and nothing to do with income.


That is why teenage pregnancies have fallen young girls have more opportunities now. The ones who have fewer opportunities are more likely to have children because they get have their own home and an income without having to work.



Gallia
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05 Apr 2018, 1:52 pm

fifasy wrote:
Nothing and no one will help me. I have been in several mental hospitals, have lifelong scars from reading my face open in several places with a knife. I am more shy and scared than you could dream of. It matters not to me what you think of me. I am finished anyway. Such is life. Some win, some lose.


i dont know if it can help you but here's a *hug* and a :heart:


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fluffysaurus
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05 Apr 2018, 1:58 pm

Daniel89 wrote:
fluffysaurus wrote:
Then why have teenage pregnancies been constantly falling for years? I doubt UK IQ's have increased. You are right to say that it is the girls without prospects but as the prospects for young girls even in deprived areas have improved fewer of them are making the decision to have children early which shows it was a lack of opportunities rather than a lack of IQ that was the problem. Also they are not the only or even main people having large families, these are most often second families due to divorce and nothing to do with income.


That is why teenage pregnancies have fallen young girls have more opportunities now. The ones who have fewer opportunities are more likely to have children because they get have their own home and an income without having to work.
The choices they make are in fact logical, they are doing the best for themselves and their offspring.


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Gallia
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05 Apr 2018, 1:59 pm

Daniel89 wrote:
]

The welfare state means they won't struggle to have offspring, the welfare state is dysgenics in action.


that's not necessarily bad. I think there are some examples of welfare states which are more successful than others - particularly in countries where there is less income inequality and a smaller population. I think the norwegian model is good in this sense. having a smaller population would be a benefit to all but it's problematic to say to people " pls have less kids". Ideally people would just get it. like with climate change.


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Daniel89
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05 Apr 2018, 2:06 pm

fluffysaurus wrote:
Daniel89 wrote:
fluffysaurus wrote:
Then why have teenage pregnancies been constantly falling for years? I doubt UK IQ's have increased. You are right to say that it is the girls without prospects but as the prospects for young girls even in deprived areas have improved fewer of them are making the decision to have children early which shows it was a lack of opportunities rather than a lack of IQ that was the problem. Also they are not the only or even main people having large families, these are most often second families due to divorce and nothing to do with income.


That is why teenage pregnancies have fallen young girls have more opportunities now. The ones who have fewer opportunities are more likely to have children because they get have their own home and an income without having to work.
The choices they make are in fact logical, they are doing the best for themselves and their offspring.


They may be doing the best for themselves I disagree they are doing the best for their children. They are not doing whats best for society however they will not be as good parents as someone who waits until they are older. Right now we are suffering from the social problems of the welfare state within a few generations we will see the genetic problems if it is allowed to continue.



Daniel89
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05 Apr 2018, 2:11 pm

Gallia wrote:
Daniel89 wrote:
]

The welfare state means they won't struggle to have offspring, the welfare state is dysgenics in action.


that's not necessarily bad. I think there are some examples of welfare states which are more successful than others - particularly in countries where there is less income inequality and a smaller population. I think the norwegian model is good in this sense. having a smaller population would be a benefit to all but it's problematic to say to people " pls have less kids". Ideally people would just get it. like with climate change.


The Nordic countries have had less inequality historically, the Royals and Aristocrats were never as powerful as they were in other parts of Europe. Even if you go back to the vikings they were a lot more equal as a culture. They also have less inequality because they have smaller nations, there is less money to be made from a customer base of 5 million as opposed to 300 million.

People in the Nordic countries also don't rely on welfare as much people would be feel ashamed living off benefits for no reason. As opposed to here in Britain where they feel entitled for other peoples money and think they are victims.

We cannot rule out how much history and culture effects countries.



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05 Apr 2018, 2:39 pm

fifasy wrote:
The big functioning aspies who have jobs and can have normal relationships come here and ignore the rest of us. The mental hospital inpatients, the nobodies, the damaged goods.

There are two kinds of aspies. The successful ones, largely able to hide their condition and the unsucessful ones who have no choice but to be recognised as what we are.


Why do you say "ignore the rest of us"?

Do you mean you feel misunderstood?
Or "the rest of us" post less?
Or are you asking for advice and the help you get is not adapted to you?
Or something else? an example?



Daniel89
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05 Apr 2018, 2:39 pm

LaetiBlabla wrote:
fifasy wrote:
The big functioning aspies who have jobs and can have normal relationships come here and ignore the rest of us. The mental hospital inpatients, the nobodies, the damaged goods.

There are two kinds of aspies. The successful ones, largely able to hide their condition and the unsucessful ones who have no choice but to be recognised as what we are.


Why do you say "ignore the rest of us"?

Do you mean you feel misunderstood?
Or "the rest of us" post less?
Or are you asking for advice and the help you get is not adapted to you?
Or something else? an example?


I think he was just having a dark moment and venting to be honest.



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05 Apr 2018, 2:54 pm

Sometimes, I wonder if high functioning with a job and friendship to maintain, "the successful" are not more struggling in life because 1. they are more aware of their differences and the necessary improvements, and 2. they have to make the many efforts to maintain the relative "success"



Daniel89
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05 Apr 2018, 2:59 pm

LaetiBlabla wrote:
Sometimes, I wonder if high functioning with a job and friendship to maintain, "the successful" are not more struggling in life because 1. they are more aware of their differences and the necessary improvements, and 2. they have to make the many efforts to maintain the relative "success"


Yes I think being away does make it harder. I had lots of expectations for my future, in seniors I realised that I was smart even though I knew I was different I expected to go to Uni and earn a good wage. In college however I started to see how my lack of social understanding separated me from society and how I had problems expressing my ideas especially on paper. Now I am 29 unemployed and without friends I spend every day thinking how my life could have been different.



fluffysaurus
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05 Apr 2018, 3:04 pm

Daniel89 wrote:
fluffysaurus wrote:
Daniel89 wrote:
fluffysaurus wrote:
Then why have teenage pregnancies been constantly falling for years? I doubt UK IQ's have increased. You are right to say that it is the girls without prospects but as the prospects for young girls even in deprived areas have improved fewer of them are making the decision to have children early which shows it was a lack of opportunities rather than a lack of IQ that was the problem. Also they are not the only or even main people having large families, these are most often second families due to divorce and nothing to do with income.


That is why teenage pregnancies have fallen young girls have more opportunities now. The ones who have fewer opportunities are more likely to have children because they get have their own home and an income without having to work.
The choices they make are in fact logical, they are doing the best for themselves and their offspring.


They may be doing the best for themselves I disagree they are doing the best for their children. They are not doing whats best for society however they will not be as good parents as someone who waits until they are older. Right now we are suffering from the social problems of the welfare state within a few generations we will see the genetic problems if it is allowed to continue.
But you have offered no evidence that people make better parents due to waiting until they are are older. How would them waiting increase their IQs by the way? Also can you give an example of a social problem that we have that does not predate the existence of the welfare state. I can only think of drugs which has no connection to low IQ's at all.


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fluffysaurus
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05 Apr 2018, 3:05 pm

Daniel89 wrote:
LaetiBlabla wrote:
Sometimes, I wonder if high functioning with a job and friendship to maintain, "the successful" are not more struggling in life because 1. they are more aware of their differences and the necessary improvements, and 2. they have to make the many efforts to maintain the relative "success"


Yes I think being away does make it harder. I had lots of expectations for my future, in seniors I realised that I was smart even though I knew I was different I expected to go to Uni and earn a good wage. In college however I started to see how my lack of social understanding separated me from society and how I had problems expressing my ideas especially on paper. Now I am 29 unemployed and without friends I spend every day thinking how my life could have been different.
What are you living on?


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