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Daniel89
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05 Apr 2018, 3:11 pm

fluffysaurus wrote:
But you have offered no evidence that people make better parents due to waiting until they are are older. How would them waiting increase their IQs by the way? Also can you give an example of a social problem that we have that does not predate the existence of the welfare state. I can only think of drugs which has no connection to low IQ's at all.


Do you really need a study to show you that an 28 year old will make a better parent than an 18 year old? The waiting until they are older does not effect IQ, but on a macro scale when people with lower IQ's have children earlier the compounded effect means they will have more children over the generations even if each individual has the same amount of children.

I don't understand what "does not predate" means, do you mean does predate?



Daniel89
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05 Apr 2018, 3:11 pm

fluffysaurus wrote:
Daniel89 wrote:
LaetiBlabla wrote:
Sometimes, I wonder if high functioning with a job and friendship to maintain, "the successful" are not more struggling in life because 1. they are more aware of their differences and the necessary improvements, and 2. they have to make the many efforts to maintain the relative "success"


Yes I think being away does make it harder. I had lots of expectations for my future, in seniors I realised that I was smart even though I knew I was different I expected to go to Uni and earn a good wage. In college however I started to see how my lack of social understanding separated me from society and how I had problems expressing my ideas especially on paper. Now I am 29 unemployed and without friends I spend every day thinking how my life could have been different.
What are you living on?


Do you mean my income? Its disability benefits.



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05 Apr 2018, 3:21 pm

Maybe it is not IQ, high or low functioning that makes an autist successful, but more about the desire/courage/tenacity to lead the life you want. For all autists, having a simple life represents a lot of challenges.

It is also a matter of luck. If you come across drugs and alcohol early in your life, it doesn't help. If you have family or external support, this may help. Same for NTs ;)

I'm a stubborn and obstinated animal, but still, sometimes my energy has its limits.



Last edited by LaetiBlabla on 05 Apr 2018, 3:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Daniel89
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05 Apr 2018, 3:22 pm

LaetiBlabla wrote:
Maybe it is not IQ, high or low functioning that makes an autist successful, but more about the desire/courage/tenacity to lead the life you want. For autists, having a simple life represents a lot of challenges.

It is also maybe a matter of luck. If you come across drugs and alcohol early in your life, it doesn't help. If you have family or external support, this may help. Same for NTs ;)

I'm a stubborn obstipated animal, but still, sometimes my energy has its limits.


I think luck and family support really help. Bad luck really derailed me.



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05 Apr 2018, 3:23 pm

Maybe it is not too late to reconnect. ;)



fluffysaurus
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05 Apr 2018, 3:33 pm

Daniel89 wrote:
fluffysaurus wrote:
But you have offered no evidence that people make better parents due to waiting until they are are older. How would them waiting increase their IQs by the way? Also can you give an example of a social problem that we have that does not predate the existence of the welfare state. I can only think of drugs which has no connection to low IQ's at all.


Do you really need a study to show you that an 28 year old will make a better parent than an 18 year old? The waiting until they are older does not effect IQ, but on a macro scale when people with lower IQ's have children earlier the compounded effect means they will have more children over the generations even if each individual has the same amount of children.

I don't understand what "does not predate" means, do you mean does predate?
You put that the welfare state was causing social problems but other than drugs I cannot think of any social problems that began after the begining of the welfare state, hence my request for an example of one that does not predate it (as in began after the birth of the welfare state). I have known plenty of women who have had children at different ages and some are good and some are s**t, but I have not noticed any actually improve their parenting with age. Young mothers often find becoming a parent less of a shock than those in their thirties who are used to being able to do what they like when they like.

So you are living off of the welfare state then.

I have relied on the welfare state occasionally myself, I am grateful for the security it gives and find the idea of it the disappearing horrifying.



Daniel89
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05 Apr 2018, 3:40 pm

fluffysaurus wrote:
Daniel89 wrote:
fluffysaurus wrote:
But you have offered no evidence that people make better parents due to waiting until they are are older. How would them waiting increase their IQs by the way? Also can you give an example of a social problem that we have that does not predate the existence of the welfare state. I can only think of drugs which has no connection to low IQ's at all.


Do you really need a study to show you that an 28 year old will make a better parent than an 18 year old? The waiting until they are older does not effect IQ, but on a macro scale when people with lower IQ's have children earlier the compounded effect means they will have more children over the generations even if each individual has the same amount of children.

I don't understand what "does not predate" means, do you mean does predate?
You put that the welfare state was causing social problems but other than drugs I cannot think of any social problems that began after the begining of the welfare state, hence my request for an example of one that does not predate it (as in began after the birth of the welfare state). I have known plenty of women who have had children at different ages and some are good and some are s**t, but I have not noticed any actually improve their parenting with age. Young mothers often find becoming a parent less of a shock than those in their thirties who are used to being able to do what they like when they like.

So you are living off of the welfare state then.

I have relied on the welfare state occasionally myself, I am grateful for the security it gives and find the idea of it the disappearing horrifying.


I am living off the welfare state because of the welfare state.

The rise of the welfare state coincides with the rise of birth control and women's liberation, we had bad parents prior to this as people had children they didn't want.

My mother had me at 20 and my brother at 26 he had a much better up bringing than me. The human brain does not develop fully until the mid 20's emotionally immature people make worse parents.



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05 Apr 2018, 4:01 pm

Daniel89 wrote:
The welfare state means they won't struggle to have offspring, the welfare state is dysgenics in action.

I considered responding to that issue preemptively in my earlier post, but didn't think it necessary on WP :|

You should note that the abuses being discussed were in the United States, where open-ended welfare for families was eliminated in 1996. (See PRWORA.) There is no "dysgenics" program here that could salvage eugenicists' poor arguments. And even if there were such a program, it would only expose the state as incapable of making those decisions intelligently.

That aside, have you actually taken care of a kid? A disabled couple on minimum wage in the US is lucky if they can support themselves, let alone raise even one kid (less than half of the reproductive replacement rate). Give them a couple of generations and they won't have left any offspring.



Gallia
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05 Apr 2018, 4:02 pm

Daniel89 wrote:

We cannot rule out how much history and culture effects countries.


totally but history is a work in progress. i think the fact people are having less children anyway and become more globalist could be a positive trend. Britain was always more class conscious than its european counterparts but I'm hoping the move towards a more globalist minded citizenship can somewhat change that. though we go into other tricky territory such as - is the nation state a failing model and perceived threat to its integrity could explain growing populism.


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05 Apr 2018, 7:27 pm

Daniel89 wrote:
fluffysaurus wrote:
Can you show that people with lower IQs have more children than the average.


I am not aware of any statistics relating to IQ however IQ correlates with income, lower income people are financially reward for having children whereas those on higher incomes are not. Young girls with not many prospects here in the UK will get pregnant knowing they will get a council house and income support.


Well this isn't true. Hasn't been true since 2011


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Daniel89
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06 Apr 2018, 1:11 am

NobodyKnows wrote:
Daniel89 wrote:
The welfare state means they won't struggle to have offspring, the welfare state is dysgenics in action.

I considered responding to that issue preemptively in my earlier post, but didn't think it necessary on WP :|

You should note that the abuses being discussed were in the United States, where open-ended welfare for families was eliminated in 1996. (See PRWORA.) There is no "dysgenics" program here that could salvage eugenicists' poor arguments. And even if there were such a program, it would only expose the state as incapable of making those decisions intelligently.

That aside, have you actually taken care of a kid? A disabled couple on minimum wage in the US is lucky if they can support themselves, let alone raise even one kid (less than half of the reproductive replacement rate). Give them a couple of generations and they won't have left any offspring.


I am not in the US, here in the UK the state will pay for people to have children and not work.



Daniel89
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06 Apr 2018, 1:13 am

Gallia wrote:
Daniel89 wrote:

We cannot rule out how much history and culture effects countries.


totally but history is a work in progress. i think the fact people are having less children anyway and become more globalist could be a positive trend. Britain was always more class conscious than its european counterparts but I'm hoping the move towards a more globalist minded citizenship can somewhat change that. though we go into other tricky territory such as - is the nation state a failing model and perceived threat to its integrity could explain growing populism.


Globalisation has just meant the working class in Britain has to compete with immigrants for jobs and housing, which lowers wages and increases rent. Then we have immigrants telling us we have white privilege.



fluffysaurus
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06 Apr 2018, 3:15 am

Gallia wrote:
Daniel89 wrote:

We cannot rule out how much history and culture effects countries.


totally but history is a work in progress. i think the fact people are having less children anyway and become more globalist could be a positive trend. Britain was always more class conscious than its european counterparts
This is not true.



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06 Apr 2018, 3:28 am

Daniel89 wrote:
Gallia wrote:
Daniel89 wrote:

We cannot rule out how much history and culture effects countries.


totally but history is a work in progress. i think the fact people are having less children anyway and become more globalist could be a positive trend. Britain was always more class conscious than its european counterparts but I'm hoping the move towards a more globalist minded citizenship can somewhat change that. though we go into other tricky territory such as - is the nation state a failing model and perceived threat to its integrity could explain growing populism.


Globalisation has just meant the working class in Britain has to compete with immigrants for jobs and housing, which lowers wages and increases rent. Then we have immigrants telling us we have white privilege.
There is some truth in this, I don't blame the immigrants, they're just trying to get by, but they are used so the employers can be very picky over who they employ to do very menial jobs. Immigrants are often those who pick things up quickest in their own countries, those who don't stay behind so we are competing with the best. It's good for business, but not for people who are a bit harder to place in employment because employers have no need to be adaptable.

White privilege is an American term, tell them you don't speak American. Where I live the immigrants are from Eastern Europe, they work really hard on the land. If anyone told them they had white privilege they'd rightly headbutt them. :D



Daniel89
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06 Apr 2018, 3:32 am

fluffysaurus wrote:
Daniel89 wrote:
Gallia wrote:
Daniel89 wrote:

We cannot rule out how much history and culture effects countries.


totally but history is a work in progress. i think the fact people are having less children anyway and become more globalist could be a positive trend. Britain was always more class conscious than its european counterparts but I'm hoping the move towards a more globalist minded citizenship can somewhat change that. though we go into other tricky territory such as - is the nation state a failing model and perceived threat to its integrity could explain growing populism.


Globalisation has just meant the working class in Britain has to compete with immigrants for jobs and housing, which lowers wages and increases rent. Then we have immigrants telling us we have white privilege.
There is some truth in this, I don't blame the immigrants, they're just trying to get by, but they are used so the employers can be very picky over who they employ to do very menial jobs. Immigrants are often those who pick things up quickest in their own countries, those who don't stay behind so we are competing with the best. It's good for business, but not for people who are a bit harder to place in employment because employers have no need to be adaptable.

White privilege is an American term, tell them you don't speak American. Where I live the immigrants are from Eastern Europe, they work really hard on the land. If anyone told them they had white privilege they'd rightly headbutt them. :D


Yeah I do not blame the immigrants either they are doing the best by themselves and their families.



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06 Apr 2018, 3:56 am

fifasy wrote:
The big functioning aspies who have jobs and can have normal relationships come here and ignore the rest of us. The mental hospital inpatients, the nobodies, the damaged goods.

There are two kinds of aspies. The successful ones, largely able to hide their condition and the unsucessful ones who have no choice but to be recognised as what we are.


As you are, we were.

As we are, you will be.


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