About Eye Contact

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I can do it, but it screws with my processing ability so I can't think as well. I think I'm suppressing part of my brain to avoid the reflex to look away; I'm literally forcing myself to remain calm and maintain it. So yes, I've learned to do it correctly when I actually care, but I can't do it if I need to think well or listen when there's other distractions like a noisy room.

Mmmm... I'm with Finn here too. "Yes" without the "correctly". That's my "missing option". I have absolutely no trouble making eye contact. Instead, my eyes typically "bore straight into their soul" (if I may wax allegorical for a moment) and make them very uncomfortable after a sustained length of time.

I can make it briefly, but I can't keep it. I'm sure I lost potential jobs many times because of my aspieness. I'd probably quit them, anyway. I work better as an entrepreneur (even though I'm still broke).

I don't have psychological problems with eye contact, only a psychosomatic one: I try to do it and my eyes secrete tears. Add the fact that I would look pretty ridiculous when attempting to focus on a person's face (due to the fact that my glasses have a part for far things and for near things) I just look into the vague area.

Ok, so here is the question; is it real eye contact?
Do your eyes actually "bore straight into their soul," or are you staring at the little grains in their irises, and they feel like you're boring into their soul. (bore-ing? boreing? Hopefully you know what I mean..)

Kris frequently stares "into" my eyes for a minute, then states a color. (my eyes kinda change color a bit. I think when my pupils are big, the irises are contracted, so the gold flecks are more concentrated, so they look greener, and if my pupils are contracted, my eyes look bluer. But I'm not completely sure. I just know they're a strange indeterminate color.)

That's why I put the "correctly" in.. to distinguish between eye contact and looking at eyes.

Can you explain what you mean by "bore into the soul"? That expression makes to me as much sense as "Colorless, green idea sleep furiously".

I don't really know how to answer. As far as I know, I've never had eye contact problems. However, I am always very aware where I put my eyes and where they are staring when I'm having a conversation with someone. I know that I often don't look at people when they come over to talk to me about something, especially at work, but I will eventually look at them. I would assume that I am doing it correctly because no one has ever told me that I have eye-contact problems.
Then again, I think at some level it must make me just a little uncomfortable. When I read about cultures where looking someone else directly in the eye was considered to be rude, I thought, "Wow, that seems so much easier, somehow..." When I interview or make eye contact with my manager, I have a tendency to stare the other person down. But again, I've never been told or sensed that it created problems.

Is this hyper-awareness about where you put your eyes during a conversation normal for most people?

There's a saying, that "the eyes are the windows to the soul." Eye contact is supposed to help people understand each other, it's meant to signify that you're paying attention to them. So staring into somebody's eyes too much can make them feel uncomfortable, kinda over-examined. So like you're not only paying close attention to them, but digging right into their soul.

I think I got what you're trying to say.

I do look people in the eyes, but I don't 'read' them. Instead I notice the colours of the irises and shapes of the eyes. A few weeks ago while I chatted with my friends, I mentioned the eye colour of someone we knew. They were totally shocked because they never noticed it. And... well, the conversation ended awkwardly with me saying "oh, xxx, yyy, zzz and (the rest of the people we know with the same eye colour) have blue eyes too."

(If you look at my profile it says NT. Actually I feel a little more like aspie at the moment. I just happened to feel particularly NT on the day I created my account. Well I guess I'm just... extraterrestrial. Anyway I apologize if my comment is irrelevant.)

That's a great clarification. First we have to define what "real eye contact" means to us. For me, it is locking eyes so that I can read any facial behaviors that I have learned. This can allow me to (primatively) simulate proper reactions to their statements. For example, if they frequently look away during some exchanges, they may be lying or nervous/uncomfortable in some way. If they return the gaze at full force, they might be interested in me or very interested in the topic of discussion.

On my side of the contact, it is much like a doctor taking a pulse with a hand on a wrist. To me, somebody's eyeball doesn't trigger the fight or flight reaction. Instead I see eyeballs just like anything else that might be painted on a canvas. The center of a rose, for example, or the whorl of a hand-painted whirpool design. Eyes are just another element in the composition and I use them in an ongoing (usually vain) attempt to figure out human behavior.

My issue is breaking contact rather than making contact. I have to remember to look away from time to time. THIS is the hard part for me. It goes like



I don't completely lose my train of thought ala ADHD, but I am not as effective at reading them during these times due to distractions coupled with a lack of facial cues.

NOTE: None of these facial cues are instinctively known to me. I have had to learn them all by studying talking people and studying psychology!

Additional trivia about how this developed. Not relevant to the point, but perhaps interesting to some of an analytical bent:
Originally, I was in the 'eye contact makes it so I cannot think about anything else' camp. I blame junior high school girls for the 180 turnaround. When I reached that age, I discovered two things: 1. Girls have very pretty eyes. 2. Staring at a girl from far away during this era and at this age could make them uncomfortable (which still fun at the time) but also could lead to them staring back as an encouragement to approach. This led to some of my very earliest dates. At that point I was hooked. I tried staring in her eyes on a date, but it was too overwhelming and I couldn't think so I defocused my eyes. That worked better. After a while, her appearance became so familiar to me (we dated for 2 years (yes in junior high school)) that I could actually look AT her eye without losing my train of thought. Once I overcame that with her, it became easier with others and I started to understand the benefits of eye contact. I never wanted to stop! And... didn't

I voted yes. My mother told me once in my teens that I'm supposed to look in people's eyes when I'm talking to them, not on the floor, and since then I've always aimed for their eyes. It took many years to figure out where to focus, when to dart, etc, but nobody's complained. I don't often talk to people, and when I do, I do it the way they want it done.

I asked my NT partner about this last night, and told him about reading that looking into some ones eyes more than >60% of the time during a conversation means you're interested in them.

He said, that's way too much. That's like stalker, restraining order crazy. He said the norm is to establish eye contact (both people looking into each others eyes) for a couple of seconds from time to time to show you are are paying attention, agreeing, surprised, whatever. It's the same timing and information as nodding your head or saying uh-huh.

He's half Korean, and we live in San Francisco where half the people come from cultures with limit eye contact. So here, the stereotypical American 'look-em in the eye, slap-em on the back' behaviour is considered rude and inappropriate.

RE <60%: Thanks Duke. Sounds like I've got the ratio about right then with the looking away vs looking at.

LOL! I like that. I hope when he said it you took the opportunity to stare directly into his eyes until he started going "What? What?" and then laughed. Hee hee

I voted sometimes, because I can look at people's eyes, but sometimes it's not for long and then I briefly look away.

I can look at someone's eyes when they're not looking at me.
I can't make eye contact with the other person, though.
When someone looks at me, for example, on the street, or in school, my first reaction is to flinch and turn away immediately.
If I know it's a person, or teacher that is very fussy about eye contact, I will look at their face, but not look into their eyes...