What do we all have in common?

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And even those traits you no longer present are still there "underneath it all" -- or at least the triggering cause of those traits is still a part of who you are if I'm making sense. As you say, you've just learned skills of accommodation that allow you to "read" as NT. But it doesn't make you NT (as you obviously know.)

It's really no different than, for example, Jodi Foster's performance in the movie "Nell." In that movie, Ms. Foster "read" as a particular sort of person (raised in a very isolated environment and learned to speak from a mother with stroke-induced speech impairment) but just because the movie "Nell" was very convincing doesn't mean Jodi Foster was no longer a modern, assimilated, urban woman -- underneath the "Nell-ness" was still Jodi Foster just as underneath an Aspie's ability to "pass as NT" is still an autistic person.

This is part of the difficulty with adult diagnoses, as well. Over the decades, we continue to develop (albeit on our own, non-NT timetable) and we continue to devise personal accommodations and work-arounds until we often do not look as autistic as we did when we were children. But it doesn't mean that the non-mainstream neurology is no longer present "underneath it all."

It's kind of ironic: I sometimes hear people describe those with autism as being "trapped inside the autism" and family members and professionals are trying to "release them" but they dont' seem to realize that what they are doing is actually wrapping new layers of behavior and accommodation around the genuine autistic. They see the new creation and say they have been liberated (and, in fairness, perhaps in many ways the individual has been liberated from many things) but what they're actually looking at is an autistic person inside an NT-approximating shell.

Sparrow

I see communication (non-verbal) and repetition (stereotypies). Social interaction is not really addressed one way or the other in this description (non-verbal pretty much guarantees a social deficit, however. Just ask any Deaf person if they have difficulty in social interaction with the hearies.)



I see social interaction and repetition. Communication is about more than just speech so the triad may still be present -- impossible to tell from such a small amount of data.



There's communication and social. No stereotypies just means no stims or other repetitive movements. Is the individual an obsessive reader? Or do they have a great collection of certain things or types of information? The triad could still be present -- again, there's not enough information presented in such a short burb.



Each one is missing a feature the other two have but they *may* still all be exhibiting the classic triad of impairments, just not in the same manner as one another.

Sparrow

I affirm we are all of the human race and no joke! I, too, am very literal and I appreciate plain talk.






I thought that the result of trying to interact with the world from our autie/aspie point of view caused the social phobia and anxiety, not the other way around.

Merle

That would be a diagnosis of an ASD..., O, wait, never mind.

^ Cos we're all ASD guys.

and gals

Thanks for the reminder...

nothing

Then why are we here?

Thats philosphy

this thread is a fantastic example of why ASDs, particularly AS, needs a whole lot more research. and a great testament as to why AS needs it's own spectrum. Asperger's happens on the inside more than the outside. it is about what the person is thinking and feeling and why that makes them do or not do certain things. where as with lower functioning ASDs you can just look what is being done without a complete understanding of the thought process or emotional process behind it.

I don't think I understand what you meant to say because I'm offended by what it appears you just said.

point form? (i work much better in point form)

1. asperger's has a very diverse population.
2. the diversity is not properly acknowledged in any current criteria
3. that diversity is acknowledged in this thread
4. to cover the diversity with in the aspergers population it would require a spectrum
5. rather than have a spectrum within a spectrum, why not allow it to have it's own?
6. the truly defining characteristics of aspergers seem to be related to how a person thinks or feels about things (internal) rather than how they look (external).
7. the external characteristics that are displayed by those with asperger's are still not truly defining as they are also commonly displayed by those not on the spectrum.
7. it easier to diagnose a lower functioning person with ASD because their external characteristics are far more unique and noticable.

i think that is my post in point form, hope it alleviates the offense you felt.

It does, very much. Thank you.

Just for the record, as far as I can see Aspergers stems from the failure to complete a feedback loop from visual perception to facial expression. Normally, forms between two and three years of age. In aspies, doesn't.

With the loop in place, reactions to perceived stimuli take place inside the half-second delay that considered responses are saddled with. Trust relationships between people depend on this fast response. Theory of mind, in its conventional form, doesn't develop without it.

Everything past that is path-dependent. You may just be ignored, you may have a parent or mentor who notices and cares, you may lead a charmed life. None of that, past the basic failure to respond, has anything to do with Aspergers.

All of the distraction responses, all of the physical mannerisms, emerge from attempts to adapt to an incomprehensible world and deal with unimaginable stress. How people close to us respond to that stress and how we respond to them shapes our lives. Again, all phenotype. Well, meltdowns are fairly close to the Aspergers genotype (see unimaginable stress above).

I'm sure Ive heard of people with AS that have no problem with facial expressions, etc. They don't remember any problem in their past and they don't even think about now. I'm one of these people. My parents would back me up on that one!

I'm starting to think that 'meltdowns' have a connection to alexithymia, part of the inability to identify emotions in self. Not knowing what emotion you're feeling would give you less control over it I suppose. A 'meltdown' due to extreme frustration IS more common in AS but it is still considered normal if you compare it to the emotions of that person. So it's not really a 'meltdown' its more of an 'outburst' like everyone else has.