New brain scan detects autism

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The actual paper should appear here http://www.jneurosci.org/current.dtl on about the 11th of August, but only the abstract is accessible without subscription. EDIT: There are some links and some earlier abstracts at The New Republic http://the-newrepublic.blogspot.com/201 ... pdate.html

I think that all existing diagnosis is subject to huge biases (gender, ethnicity, affluence and reaction to stereotypical "classic" symptoms), and we have no idea what the false-positive or false-negative rates are. We do know that being male, white, middle-class, having childhood speech delay, having the money to persist in seeking a diagnosis and living somewhere with greater autism awareness all contribute to the likelihood of getting a diagnosis.

A (relatively) cheap diagnostic evaluation that provides an objective measure seems like a good idea.

Last edited by StuartN on 11 Aug 2010, 10:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

I caught the end of the report last night and thought it looked promising. There were undiagnosed people on there who seemed fairly normal who had it 'confirmed' via this test. Surely that's nothing but good news for those that are less severe and have learnt coping methods so are less obvious?

I'd love to take the test!

Ain't gonna change what's there.

That study is on the front cover and two inside pages of the print edition of today's issue of The Independent newspaper. Here is the article in the online edition: http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style ... 49090.html . It includes an image in colour of the autistic brain. Some of the comments are sceptical about the study. One mentions the book The Myth of Autism by Sami Timimi, due for publication this November.

I have heard claims that the accuracy of autism diagnosis would be higher than 90% in children.

I agree with the comments by anbuend, Callista and pgd.

Waitaminute... they only used men? Umm... yeah, this does not make me happy at all. This is not valid unless it can be applied to women, too.

...That's not Asperger's. Not speaking to anyone but your family is highly unusual speecch, and that means classic autism should have been the correct diagnosis, or else PDD-NOS.

Interesting, I wonder if certain types of ADHD might cause confusion, though.

I suppose if they appeared to be that similar on an MRI then they would be close enough for all intents and purposes.

Yep


I'm thinking along the same lines as StuartN, as it would minimize the subjectivity of it all, but its being perfected and universalized is probably a long way off, by gauging it with other developed technologies.

Realistically, with the current schema, be prepared to give your arm and leg when it comes time to pay, as anything in the U.S. without a precertification/authorization for diagnostic testing will be rejected by insurance.
And most insurance companies are overly biased and cover scantily on "psychiatric disorders" , you'd end up paying half of it all, even if you had a hard diagnoses such as paranoid schizophrenia.

My wife had a routine MRI and that was $2000.
Factor in a 1500 deductible and 80/20 coverage in that.......geesh!

Severe selective mutism ? It can be confused with autism in some cases (the more I read about mental disorders, the more I think they are part of the same spectrum in which there are different subcategories like autism since they tend to have so many similarities).

I don't know whether people who have another form of HFA show a delayed development of speech or mutism but since AS is usually considered as being a HFA, I guess it could be it.

I actually would love to have my brain scanned for any disability to know for sure (without taking the risk of being misdiagnosed though it seems unrealistic) what is wrong with me but I fear that those studies may reinforce stereotype among the population (I'm not talking about the scientists of course)

The full text of the paper can be downloaded via The New Republic

http://the-newrepublic.blogspot.com/201 ... nosis.html

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Contrast the above with the following (2009 MRI scan - Adult Age 62)

2009 MRI for cognitive difficulties limited

MRI for real cognitive difficulties very limited - For your info,
just (January 2009) had a head MRI on a 1.5 Tesla General Electric
MRI machine done at the radiology department of a major HMO. The out
of cost pocket fee (deductible) to me was $1,050.00. I have
noticeable gross and fine motor control difficulties which show up
within 2 minutes or less on such equipment as a trampoline, a jumping
rope, or playing/trying to play the piano with both hands smoothly. I
have very noticeable difficulties with attention span (attention span
tends to vary involuntarily four times a minute), spatial
visualization, and doing math (both on paper and in my head due, in
part, to short term memory challenges). These attention span
difficulties become very apparent in trying to do counter work (such
as being an ice cream vendor/table waiter) or answering questions
using a telephone. The results of the 2009 MRI: completely normal.
Again, to me, this points out the fact as to how limited a modern
day, costly MRI can be when it simply cannot detect any of these very
real cognitive difficulties/human motor control difficulties which
people can easily see but expensive MRIs cannot. For your
information, I had pointed all of these above visible symptoms to the
neurologist in advance of the MRI even asking him if there was a
piano in the medical complex so he could see, for himself, what I was
talking about. He said that there was no piano available implying
that it was inappropriate for him to watch a person play a piano so
the neurological symptoms would quickly be seen - in my view - a
little like refusing to gather data prior to a medical workup -
instead relying upon a test like the above MRI to declare to the
whole world that ~ no symptoms were noticeable to him. I gave the
neurologist the following two websites to try to help him see what I
was talking about:
http://www.balametrics.com/ http://www.infinitywalk.org/ My initial
impression from what he said was that he was way too busy to even a
take a minute or two to look at the websites. It was like next
customer please. The neurologist was quite young, like in his early
30s, and he suggested that none of what I was talking about was
taught to him in medical school and none of what I was talking about
was within the general notion of the standard practice of neurology -
year 2009.

Challenge

ADHD Inattentive
Central auditory processing disorder (CAPD)
Mild dyspraxia

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http://www.ericdigests.org/2003-5/auditory.htm

I really want one of these scans, so I can be 100% sure of my diagnosis. I have waited for ever for a biological way of DXing people, and here it is at long last.

According to the neuropsychologist I just saw, if anything type of imaging would detect any abnormalities in my brain, it would be a PET scan. What the study in the OP is claiming is that structural differences in the brains of autistic people can now be detected by an MRI.


AFAIK....the white matter abormalities associated with NLD usually, if not always, cannot be detected by an MRI or any other neuroimaging (including PET) technique. Considering that Asperger's and NLD are similar, if not identical, disorders etiologically speaking, I doubt MRI's would really be able to detect any abnormalities in the Aspergian brain.

Nonetheless...because I believe I have some serious memory problems which aren't associated with NLD/AS, I felt an MRI scan might be able to pick up on the neurological origins of those (since for example, MRI's can detect things like reduced Hippocampal volumes.) The neuropsychologist I just feels that a PET would prove more useful in my case if anything would.

A PET would might show functional, rather than structural, abnormalities in regions of my brain associated with memory. In other words, I suppose this neuropsychologist feels that any problems I may have with memory probably couldn't be determined by an MRI as they would be too subtle (though none-the-less) serious for the scan to detect. Whereas a PET could detect functional abnormalities in regions associated with memory and then theories about their neurological cause/s could be formulated.


The autism study i'm participating in at the Uni of Pittsburgh in September includes MRI scans. These are fMRI scans however and in one project, the scan is used to study how autistic people process emotion. In another, the scan is used to study brain structure and function in autism. There should also be some structural MRI images, (from whole-brain analysis MRI i'm assuming) but i'm not sure whether those will be made available to me or not.

Even if they are....I don't think they would tell much of anything useful. From my understanding, the researchers (in this study, at least) don't disclose the results of the structural MRI images unless some gross abnormalities (such as tumors, lesions, etc....) are detected.

All I know is that it would be nice to get to the bottom of this three pound Judas Iscariot floating around in my skull already

Even the neuropsychologists can't seem to tell me exactly what's wrong with my brain neurologically speaking.


Case in point...these two quotes from the written report of my most recent neuropsychological evaluation:

"This is a very complicated condition, but it is quite clear that he is experiencing measurable problems".


"While additional assessment would allow for a more comprehensive evaluation of his condition, this would only serve to reinforce the problem that is facing him. He needs to be helped through supportive counseling to move past his search for what is wrong and really to focus more on the solution for how he can improve his life. He clearly is intellectually capable of working, going to school and obtaining a college degree and otherwise functioning somewhat effectively. Unfortunately, his psychological condition is a substantial barrier".


Diagnotic impressions


Axis-I: 315.9 learning disorder NOS, 300 anxiety disorder NOS(with features of obsessive-compulsive thinking and generalized anxiety disorder), 300.4 dysthymic disorder.


Axis-II: 301.20 schizoid personality disorder (although he clearly has features of avoidant personality and schizotypal personality disorders).


Axis-III: None.


Axis-IV: limited social support, unemployment, financial limitations.

Axis-V: GAF=60.

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Well, hope you are right.

Do agree with you that many persons want objective evidence about autism along the lines of something like a brain scan if possible.

Someday that will happen (my view) but it may be in 100 years, not today, tomorrow, this year or next year (my view).

The brain is too complicated and how words like autism are defined are too vague.

The news report to me raises a large red flag due to the reported 90% success rate - that to me is a little too high for me to easily believe.

That kind of extraordinarily high success rate suggests to me one or more flaws in how the autism brain scans are read/the news story is reported.

To me, the news report about the autism brain scan sounds a little too much like/a little too similar to phony claims made in the recent past such as:

All neurological challenges from polio to Parkinson's are only due to lack of megadoses of Vitamin C.
All neurological challenges are only caused by food additives.
All autism is only caused by vaccines.

Three fibs (aka lies) but vigorously reported initially by the international news media to be factual and absolute, 100% truth when in fact the three reports were fibs (aka lies).

Speaking without any clinical experience or qualifications, I'd say that sounds a lot like Autism...

I have never seen any of those theories reported as facts by any serious news outlet,.

I fully concur but apparently, the neuropsycholgists who've evaluated me do not. For one thing, consider the similarities between schizoid/schizotypal PD and Asperger's/other autistic spec disorders. Also consider the fact that most of these neuropsychologists believe I exhibit all the "classic" signs of NVLD but NVLD/NLD is not an official dx.


Hence the "learning disorder NOS" diagnosis on Axis-I.

Nonetheless...it is a disorder which is very similar, if not identical, to Asperger's syndrome. The neuropsychologist apparently feel I don't exhibit the stereotyped and repetitive interests, routines and behaviors associated with AS and that's the one reason I haven't received a diagnosis of AS.


I DO believe I exhibit many of the aforementioned interests, behaviors, etc....but they just don't believe I do no matter what I tell them.

Nonetheless...I was accepted into the University of Pittsburgh's autism research study and i'm scheduled to participate in September. I was placed in "with autism" group as opposed to the "healthy" control "without autism" group. They are fully aware of my lack of an official AS/ASD diagnosis and I made that quite clear to them from the beginning.


From what I can gather, they are eager to have me as a participant PRECISELY because I exhibit the "classic" NVLD pattern of cognitive assets/deficits and behaviors. I believe they want to compare and contrast me with those who have received an official AS diagnosis.

In short....I believe i'm far too close not to have received the cigar.