What is the issue with 'autistic pride'?

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Double post

Last edited by CockneyRebel on 27 Mar 2011, 6:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

Autistic pride to me is about being proud of who I am, after years of feeling ashamed. It's nice now to know what I am and why I am the way I am after so long thinking badly of myself for this, it's a matter of pride to say that this is who we are and that is more than okay.

But...we're getting off-topic

As I stated however It isn't the perfect analogy. Its the only one though that does come close to the actual layout of everything.

I think Aspies for Freedom and Autism Speaks are both full of s**t but for entirely different reasons. I'd like a cure for autism, but it's never going to happen. Right now I would be satisfied with a prenatal test and better support systems for autistic people.

See, that's where the problem comes in, because some people actually do seem to think "autistic pride" means being proud of being autistic, and feeling that NTs are inferior specifically because they're not autistic. (And again, this is comparable to the "gay pride" movement, with some feeling that this means they should be proud of being homosexuals, and that "breeders" are an inferior grade of being.)

And, of course, those people are taken by the opposing camp as revealing the "real meaning" of autistic pride; their furthest fringe holds that we should actually be ashamed of being autistic, and even that autism should be completely stamped out. Which is then taken by the Autistic Pride folks as being the "real position" of their opponents, and the wheel spins on...

The real division is Happy vs Unhappy Aspies. Happy aspies are more likely to support autism pride and be hostile to cures. Why cure something when having it makes your life an unmitigated joy? Where as unhappy aspies want a cure as they want to be happier and see less positives to having AS. I fall squarely in the latter camp i feel.

I am not really bothered about this autistic pride thing. Nor do i support
a cure.
I don't think there will discover a cure i mean they can't even find a cure for
aids which to be honest is far more pressing than autism. The most
important thing is to increase support and to make this support available
to all autistic people. which the government condem is not doing.
I digress. It I feel much better to be getting on with my life than worrying
about a cure. Thinking about a cure will only make me feel worthless.

Jamie, nobody's life is "an unmitigated joy" - well, with the possible exception of a victim of a prefrontal lobotomy, or someone with Williams' Syndrome. Even if every single aspect of autism were to be suddenly and abruptly cleared from your life, you'd still experience loneliness, heartbreak, jealousy, anger, misunderstandings, and injustice. You'd just be stuck with trying to muddle through it all from an almost completely emotional perspective, without the ability to (relatively) easily step back and look at things logically.

Yes, I know, the curebies like to paint NT life as being all wonderful and problem-free because they can use body language and we can't, and because they have hobbies and we have perseverations - but I've also known times when my perseverations could get me through troubled periods, while the NT I was with lost interest in her hobbies... It's a trade-off, really, Neither group could exist, at least comfortably, without the other.

Yes but proper medical depression and AS are co morbid whereas proper medical depression and being an NT are not comorbid. Would being an NT make you bound around like barney the dinosaur on crystal meth? No!But statistically, the chances are you'd be happier and have a more fulfilling life.

No they are not co morbid jamie your talking out your arse.

People with AS suffer from mental health no differently then the NT population. The fact that they have a disproportionate level of occurance is due to the mistreatment poor understanding and poor provision of services to recognise and deal with such people effectively.

Being human and being on the recieveing end of poor treatment and misunderstanding leading to social isolation, loss of self and marginilisation are co-morbid in depression.

Aspies are" more likely to be on the recieving end of poor treatment and misunderstanding leading to social isolation, loss of self and marginalisation leading to greater incidences of depression" than nt's then. I wish i was born an NT so i'd have a statistically higher chance of being happy. I'd also be more likely to be outside enjoying my life instead of quibbling about semantics with some aspie dude on an internet message forum.

Hmm, I am happy but my life is not an unmitigated joy, and I would say being autistic has actually caused me quite a bit of grief. I just don't hold a grudge.

This looks like the kind of black and white thinking Deaconblues described in response to me, and anbuend has explained at length.

The "unmitigated joy" part was an exaggeration to try and add emphasis to my point.

That seems ill-advised on a forum where people take things literally.

I don't think it's necessarily about "Cure vs. No Cure," though the debates are closely related.

It's simply about whether one should be proud to be an Aspie or not. It really isn't any more complicated than that.

There are those who feel AS is, simply put, NOT a good thing, and therefore nothing to be proud of.

There are those who see it as a blessing, and therefore something to be proud of.

There are also many of mixed feelings.

There are some from all three groups that would like to see a cure. (Yeah, even some from the second group ~ some in that group choose to see it as a blessing because they feel it's just better to think positively about it even though there's nothing they can do to change it ~ but would still rather choose NOT to have it, IF they had a choice)

There are some from all three groups who don't want a cure for a number of different reasons. Some, out of a sense of self determination. There are many other reasons to numerous to list.

So, no, I don't think the two debates are the same at all. They are distinctly different issues.

haha Most likely yes. I don't have that problem myself so i forget that other aspies do.