Is it possible for me to have AS?
daydreamer84
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Joined: 8 Jul 2009
Age: 41
Gender: Female
Posts: 5,001
Location: My own little world
17 Apr 2011, 12:06 am
bumble wrote:
littlelily613 wrote:
bumble wrote:
Do I have an ASD or have I been diagnosed correctly?....I am trying to figure this out myself.
Tough to say, but depression, social anxiety, and OCD can all present themselves with AS-like symptoms, without the AS. That is one thing the psychologist said to me...they recognized I had severe anxiety, but they were trying to see where it comes from (if it came first and the AS symptoms came later or vice versa). They realized I have AS, and anxiety is just a symptom of that. I actually don't have anxiety is the sense that I do not feel fear in large crowds of people as long as no one is looking me way (I often don't like big crowds due to noise sensory issues though). It is only if I have to interact with people, and even then, I don't necessarily feel the fear if someone is there to do the talking and be a support. I don't have social anxiety as was previously though, I have anxiety-like issues that have arisen from years of have undiagnosed autism. The same could be for you, or perhaps you fit into some AS characteristics due to the diagnoses you have been given....
It can be very hard to know where exactly it stems from, especially as my problems are so long running and complex. I had problems in childhood (around age 7) and the welfare services at the time wanted my mother to take me to a child psychologist but she would not take me. I was academically bright but had trouble socialising, was bullied at school and prone to some behavioural problems at home (bad tantrums...my nan referred to me as a problem child because of them). At 13 I saw a therapist for a few sessions as I was still suffering from the same problems (including more tantrums during which I was prone to hitting myself, trying to choke myself and banging my head against a wall...pn i do not self harm at other times) and was told that I was bright in some ways but very emotionally immature. Nothing was really done to help and at 16 I ended up at a therapists office again after I had downed a bottle of pills in temper which landed me up in the A and E. I tried to explain that "I can't mix with people" but it was ignored in favour of focusing on the suicide attempt (which was not premeditated and was done in a fit of rage) and the depression. The therapy was not helpful and I was eventually put on antidepressants in my late teens.
I did work in my teens but was unable to hold down jobs due to my social issues and my inability to be able to mix with other members of staff. I was also bullied at work and ostracised.
In my early twenties I had a brief issue with alcoholism to help me socialise but I was still unable to mix and make friends. I sobered up but it left me with a panic disorder I did not have before that. I landed up back at the psychiatrists office, this time labelling my inability to mix as social anxiety...they paid more attention to that but still insisted that sorting out the depression would help me to socialise. They prescribed more anti depressants and sent me for relaxation therapies.
The antidepressants helped with the panic attacks but not much else. Relaxation therapies also failed to help.
I attempted a university course but again, despite excelling academically, failed to be able to mix and make friends.
Shortly after that I did develop problems with OCD in the form of intrusive thoughts and rituals (usually repeating actions) but I no longer get the distressing symptoms I used to get with that and the obsessions I have these days I prefer to refer to as Passions because I adore them...it's everyone else they seem to annoy lol. I was also prone to being obsessive about my hobbies as a child although some were a little different to the norm (such as collecting bank forms at the age of 5 and lining up toy cars instead of playing with dolls lol).
Again I saw a psychiatrist but the attention was placed on the depression in the belief that it would solve all of my other problems.
After that, I took to socialising on the internet and 10 years later I have still failed to form friendships. I formed a few relationships with men that I had met on the internet but they were short lived. My need for routine and my quirks drive them up the wall and around the bend and my temper tantrums are difficult for them to cope with and understand.
I now have support in the form of 2 support workers who help me with practical issues and am on disability. 1 of them seems to think I misinterpret people and is concerned because I am still prone to tantrums where I no long self harm but which, at their worst, manifest as screaming fits where I scream at myself for hours (complaints from neighbours alerted her to them as I tend to try and conceal them from people), and the other asked me if I had ever been spoken too about asperger's disorder so I began to research it.
It could be that I am just one very screwed up chick, but I have had these problems all of my life, medication has done little and therapy has done even less and quite frankly at 35 I am getting sick of going around in circles and going nowhere!
If the therapies were working I would doubt my existing diagnosis less...
I can relate to a lot of what you say as well. The thing is at a certain point I think it comes down to Occam's Razor. Yes social anxiety disorder can look like AS, ADHD can look like AS, OCD can look like AS etc. but if you have symptoms that could either indicate that you have ADHD and OCD and social anxiety ect. with some unaccounted for symptoms (stimming, sensory overload, special interests etc.- just a hypothetical example ) or the symptoms could all indicate that you have AS then what is the most parsimonious explanation? I think you should get a professional diagnosis if you really want to know though and this is just speculation but I think that although some people really do have ADHD, social anxiety, OCD and depression and just some other personality quirks ...........it might be a simpler explanation that you have AS.
17 Apr 2011, 2:56 am
daydreamer84 wrote:
I can relate to a lot of what you say as well. The thing is at a certain point I think it comes down to Occam's Razor. Yes social anxiety disorder can look like AS, ADHD can look like AS, OCD can look like AS etc. but if you have symptoms that could either indicate that you have ADHD and OCD and social anxiety ect. with some unaccounted for symptoms (stimming, sensory overload, special interests etc.- just a hypothetical example ) or the symptoms could all indicate that you have AS then what is the most parsimonious explanation? I think you should get a professional diagnosis if you really want to know though and this is just speculation but I think that although some people really do have ADHD, social anxiety, OCD and depression and just some other personality quirks ...........it might be a simpler explanation that you have AS.
Occam's Razor is partly how I came to my own conclusion of AS. There were so many inconsistencies in my behavior and thoughts that no one or two disorders could fully explain me. But when I found AS and plugged it into the equation, nearly everything fit and I had one answer to my problems.
17 Apr 2011, 7:23 am
Special interests are an indication of Apies excelling at "one track mind" thinking--we can be captivated by a task a totally unreasonable amount of time--an example might be pulling all the weeds out of the yard--a ridiculous idea for a lot of NTs.
Popular activities aren't good indicators because lots of NTs get engrossed in them too--because they are often designed to be captivating by very smart and clever people. On the other hand, it is quite abnormal to write down and memorize all the baseball statistics you read in the newspaper, day after day, month after month, year after year, decade after decade, Such a person is considered "special."
Conversely, we are very bad at multitasking--which really hurts our social interaction because by the time we have mentally changed tracks, we have made bad impression that is difficult to recover from. But, if you are really smart and quick, you may be able to get by with "serial multitasking"--doing stuff one at a time so quickly that it seems like multitasking. When social interaction is likely, you may be able to just idle and wait for it to happen, instead of getting into a thought process that can't be interrupted easily.
I've noticed that a lot of NTs expect to be treated as equals by their co-workers, even when they aren't. The ideal solution is to get a diva job--become a star baseball player or movie star so folks still have be nice to you, even if you aren't. Or become the guy who magically fixes problems that nobody else can solve.
17 Apr 2011, 8:42 am
daydreamer84 wrote:
I can relate to a lot of what you say as well. The thing is at a certain point I think it comes down to Occam's Razor. Yes social anxiety disorder can look like AS, ADHD can look like AS, OCD can look like AS etc. but if you have symptoms that could either indicate that you have ADHD and OCD and social anxiety ect. with some unaccounted for symptoms (stimming, sensory overload, special interests etc.- just a hypothetical example ) or the symptoms could all indicate that you have AS then what is the most parsimonious explanation? I think you should get a professional diagnosis if you really want to know though and this is just speculation but I think that although some people really do have ADHD, social anxiety, OCD and depression and just some other personality quirks ...........it might be a simpler explanation that you have AS.
It is very hard to say what is responsible for what. Add to that mix that I tend to be a generally quirky person in some ways and it is hard to even define what is part of a disorder and what is part of my personality. I also tend not to discuss every symptom I have with the therapist for several reasons. The first is that I am not good at verbally communicating myself. I cannot always explain in words exactly what I mean or what I am feeling and why. There are no words. The second is some of my quirks are a little strange and my ways of coping with stress get a lot of negative responses from people. I don't want them to lock me away in a padded cell or anything lol.
When I go into tantrums for example I cannot explain what I am feeling and why I am so upset to them. The comforting words offer no comfort at those times because it is quite clear that they are not understanding what I am feeling and why. Their help just seems to make it worse and I will end up blowing into a screaming fit where I scream relentlessly if they push it.
I don't like my routines changed not because I think something bad will happen but because my world descends into a feeling of complete chaos...especially if too many things are changed at once.
I do odd things like burst into tears in a supermarket at 30 years old because I can't get the right flavour of ice-cream for my Saturday night movie. People do not understand why I am getting so upset over this but I ALWAYS have the same food menu on a Saturday and my day is all wrong without it. Occasionally I can tolerate a change as a one off but not on a regular basis or if many other changes have occurred or other things have upset me as well.
Breathing exercises do not work when it comes to trying to soothe myself when I am upset and instead I prefer to either rub a tickle, which is something I have always done (hence the name tickle...it was named when I was very young) and which is a piece of material (that has a certain feel) that I rub between my forefinger and thumb. If lose a tickle though (I usually have several pieces around) watch out because I will turn a house upside down looking for it in a frenzy even if I have another one to rub instead lol. I will part with them when the pieces of material wear out after a short period of mourning for them but I cannot not rest if one goes missing much to the amazement of people that I have shared a house with in the past lolololol. I need to know where my tickles are at all times lol.
Another thing I will tend to do is walk around the house talking to myself. For some reason though I'd rather do that then talk to other people and have at times been caught wondering around nattering to myself by others. As a child and teenager I would do it whilst walking in the street but people kept asking my mother if I was all there because I was talking to myself so now I try to do it in private instead. If I am caught doing it though people will tend to ask who I am talking to...to which my reply is myself. I am not talking to imaginary people or voices that are not there...I do not hear voices etc and know that it is indeed myself that I am talking to.
Another thing that has driven people mad is that I will sit and listen to the same song over and over and over for hours on end...alternatively I may branch out and listen to the same play list repeatedly. This has had complaints from people so I now wear headphones lol.
Socially I struggle to mix with people. I cannot make small talk so instead either resort to two different approaches. One is sticking to a list of possible questions I can ask someone to keep them talking so that I don't have to and the other is just standing there and smiling and nodding every so often whilst making huh huh noises so they know I am listening to them. If I relax too much, forget myself or the conversation goes onto a subject I am interested in them god help them lol. I am told that I give out too much information, people have actually said "excuse me, if you don't mind me interrupting your monologue" to me (although its not usually termed so politely and the words "can you shut up please as we are not interested" come to mind lol). Back in the days when I had friends, at age 15 I went to Birmingham with them (a city in the UK) and took them around all the museums there (as I loved the places at the time). On arriving home they told me that they would not go there with me again. I asked why and they replied by saying that I had dragged them round the museums and it was really boring. Apparently they wanted to go shopping for make-up and to talk about boys. I will also tend to do annoying things like talk constantly about the same thing, keep drawing the conversation back to the same topic again, repeat what I have already said over and over again and repeatedly keep asking the same question even though I have already been given an answer (I have no idea why I do this!). Apparently I bore people into a coma and then they don't want to be my friend any more.
I also seem to be a bully magnet and have been bullied not only through my childhood but in my adulthood as well as well as being ostracised a lot. I have an inability to make or keep friends. I do not always know what people want from me unless they tell me. I cannot tell if someone likes me or wants to be my friend unless they say. I also cannot always tell if someone does not like me and does not want to be my friend until out right viciousness or bullying starts at which point (which usually comes along with being told to "f**k off") I may finally get the message lol. On the other hand, oddly, if someone is teasing me I will take it seriously unless they tell me they are just teasing me, at which point I am fine about it...I am not hurt by teasing if I know that is what they are doing.
I can also be a bit thick at times when socialising with people. An example would be when a support worker gave me a lift to the dentists a few weeks ago. When I got into the car she was talking on the telephone and I found myself somewhat confused as to what I was supposed to do. I got in and sat there but spent the entire time wondering if I should stay in the car or get out again whilst she was speaking. I was waiting for her to say something and give me instructions (ie can you wait outside) but none came so I just sat there wondering if it was ok lol.
The form I have to fill out before my upcoming therapy sessions asks if I avoid social situations because of a fear of embarrassment or making a fool of myself but I avoid them for neither of those reasons.
1 I am not easily embarrassed but I am easily hurt. I am not worried about making a fool of myself, I am more worried about driving people away again with my annoying habits that I have spent years trying to change and have been unable to. I am also worried about bullying occurring again and also I don't want to end up being ostracised either.
2 I have terrible trouble forming connections with people. When I do stop and talk to them I have a feeling of disconnect that is hard to explain. The closest I can get to feeling connected to someone is to develop a bond (I may feel disconnected but I can love and I do have feelings) and even then there can be a sense of a disconnect in some ways that I am unable to put into words. I can feel so very lonely at times because I find myself craving a connection with another human being...
On the other hand...(and this is a paradox about myself that I do not understand)...
3 I have long been told that I live in a world of my own somewhere, and I do 90% of the time. As a child I was happy to play in this world of my own for hours at a time and I am the same as an adult. However I can find it hard to pull myself out of this world on demand and if someone tries to socialise with me at those times I find that I am irritated as they are interrupting me. Their chat or approach is not wanted as my brain wants to be left alone to do its own thing and does not want to be disturbed.
How can someone who gets so lonely feel that way when people try to socialise with them? I don't know.
The Agoraphobia I get comes and goes. I am fine, for example, walking up a country lane on my own but go into a state of anxiety in a crowded city or supermarket etc. It is not the social element I am worried about at those times as what people think of me when I'm on a mission to get my shopping or something is of no consequence to me. What I do find though is that the noise becomes unbearable. I cannot for example tolerate sitting in a cafe whilst everyone is talking at once...it sounds like a gaggle of geese on a farmyard in stereo in my head and I just want to gag them all and shut them up. Then there are other noises that assault you at the same time...bumping, banging, clanging, someone walking in steal tipped shoes clinking on the damn floor (so much so that you feel like walking up to them and telling them get different footwear lol), some electronic equipment buzzing in the dentists office so much so that you feel like walking around to the other side of the desk and unplugging everything. Then you have to deal with everyone walking at you so much so that you'r eyes don't quite know what to do with themselves and just to add to my misery the sun will come out and take my retina's out in the process (I am light sensitive) whilst some woman at the bus stop insists what a lovely sunny day it is! All I want to do is go home where it is dim (I keep my curtains shut on sunny days) and quiet!
I am dreading having to go to social events as part of my treatment for my Social Anxiety as how in the hell I am supposed to cope with dealing with all that social stuff and actually being able to hear what people are saying anyway with the background noise bouncing around in my head I don't know. That, combined with having to make eye contact with people, seems to result in my brain hearing words but not hearing what those words are so I will constantly need to say "pardon?" or "what did you say" which just adds to my misery.
At home I am pretty sure they will encourage me to get dressed in day wear as part of treating my depression (the fact that I prefer to sit around in my pyjamas all day is often taken to mean I am depressed as is my tendency to keep my curtains shut and not want to go out for walks on sunny days) when in actual fact I have several pairs of pyjamas that are particularly comfortable and that I like to wear for that reason (I also always wear the same coat when I go out and will wear it until it falls apart basically...people have bought me other coats but I will only wear my usual coat because I like it and its comfortable lol). Sitting in day wear in the house drives me absolutely insane...it cuts, it digs in even if it is the right fit, it rubs...it's just down right irritating. I was the same with labels in clothes as a child..I would not wear anything with labels in, especially school shirts, as they would stick in me all day and I'd have a huge tantrum by the time I got home from the constant irritation. However I am not too bad with most labels these days although I have been known to lose my temper and rip them out in a minor fit of rage if I can't find some scissors to remove them with if its one that is irritating me *ahem*.
As for my interests they do turn into obsessions, however the nature of them is not usually bizarre these days (ie such as a 4 year old collecting bank forms much to the annoyance of my mother as I couldn't go into a bank with her without coming out with forms in the process lololololol). I was and am, however, more than happy to spend 14 hours a day doing jigsaw puzzle (when they were my interest) or seqin art (my present interest...I am on a mission to collect and do them all, except the 3d ones as I don't like those and probably won't stop until I have done that). This can annoy people as I would often rather be sat in doing my hobbies than be out socialising and will actually turn down invites to go out in favour of doing my hobby. This is another paradox...as how can someone so lonely turn down social invites because they'd rather stay home and spend 14 hours doing jigsaws or pushing sequins in a polystyrene board lol.
I am a rather strange soul to say the least....Either I am a strangely weird NT or I really did end up on the wrong damned planet!
Edited for typos lol.
